Freedom , just landed

[freedom]

Hi guy simply looking around and making myself familiar with the site am interested in finding more about Freedom S100 amphibious (spainish build) those who have flown , your experiences would be apreciated. Both positive and negative please (the truth).

 

 

[Deskpilot]

G'day Freedom, to the forums. You're just up the road from me, Morphett Vale. Do you fly - if so where from? Sorry, can't help you with your request, not many amphibs in these parts and no water to land on.

 

 

[shags_j]

h i freedom, sorry i cant help you with amphib but welcome anyway.

 

 

[dazza 38]

Welcome freedom, never seen one in the flesh but they look good in the advertising pictures.

 

 

[shags_j]

Gotta admit I've looked at one and thought I wish.

 

 

[freedom]

Thanks Guys for your comments No I am not flying yet , am an old biker(not to old though), with a wife who due to ill health needs another way for me to get her around, the freedom 100 due to its dual role ie landing gear and amphibious seems to me to be what I can dream to have pne day. again thankyou for your advise.

 

 

[shags_j]

Just because you are not currently flying does not mean you are not an enthusiast and more than welcome around here. I too will be joining the grounded squad as my (hopefully) new home will mean I can no longer afford to fly for a bit.

 

 

[freedom]

G'day Freedom, to the forums. You're just up the road from me, Morphett Vale. Do you fly - if so where from? Sorry, can't help you with your request, not many amphibs in these parts and no water to land on.

Thanks Deskpilot, no I am not yet flying, it is my future dream , the reason I was interested in the freedom 100 is the re tractable landing gear , how safe it is I am still investigating. I understand from NSW that one experience involved gear locked down when landing on water, I really need to know was their an error in the warning light , or was it a pilot error by having the gear down! If the gear was supposed to be up without the pilot knowing then that is a concern! All the best!

 

 

[freedom]

G'day Freedom and welcome to a great place. I know somebody who landed one close to where I live (on Lake Macquarie, NSW). The landing was near perfect but the landing gear doors had jammed open and caused the plane to stop instantly. The pilot and owner were on board and very lucky to have no more than relatively minor but painful and expensive injuries. The plane was destroyed. I believe there have been other instances where all hands were killed. Other than that it looks like a great bit of gear. One day I'd like to have an amphibious but I think I'll get a few (a lot) more hours up on dry land first.Retracting landing gear is always a potential source of grief.

 

I would think that, by its very nature, an amphibious must be a compromise. Not perfect land plane not perfect water but, of course, versatile.

 

Not due for release until end 2010 but, if you want to blow your mind, have a look at the ICON A5. It looks brilliant and very easily transported.

 

The IconA5 looks very nice , looks a faiir bit dearer than the Freedom 100 , but may have the same issues with landing gear, thankyou for the heads up on the Lake Mac incident , I read about the US accident apparently on shallow water and if inverted they had no way to escape due to the way the canopy opens. Their is starting to be a pattern with landing gear here, I really would be interested to know if the pilot simply put the gear down in error or was he aware of it being down before landing because the freedom apparently has a locked down warning light and if it was locked down then water landing would be out I would have thought. However if a fault I would also like to know what happened. Any info would help. Just like to thank you for your efforts as well. How do you like the Jabaru! all the best!

[freedom]

thank you!

 

 

[freedom]

it does look good just need to know how safe they are and that will make my mind up, then it simply waiting for the dream to come tru after that!

 

 

[freedom]

Just because you are not currently flying does not mean you are not an enthusiast and more than welcome around here. I too will be joining the grounded squad as my (hopefully) new home will mean I can no longer afford to fly for a bit.

Shags , priorities are alway the leveling parts of life drags, thankyou for the well wishes hope you arent out of the skies for long. For me its a dream which hopefully is not to far aware for myself and my wife !all the best!

 

 

[freedom]

You may be unpleasantly surprised that a factory build Freedom costs similar to the Icon.

 

The Icon was, I seem to recall, originally designed as just a flying boat. They have only relatively recently started talking about adding retractable landing gear to make it the full amphibian. I guess their marketing people have been at them to broaden the appeal/market.

 

I know the pilot and got the story first-hand. The landing on the water was actually video recorded and showed a first class approach and touchdown. Then all hell broke loose.

 

The Pilot has vast experience on just about every kind of fixed wing on the planet. He has flown for airlines, etc. He is one of the best pilots you would ever meet. He made no mistake. But for his exceptional skills probably both on board would have died.

 

As I recall it, they had taken off from land and were doing some checks on the new Freedom. When time to land they were not getting the right signal from the landing gear system and did a low pass over the aerodrome to get people on the ground to see if the gear was down or not. The report came in that the gear was not down. Since they were less than 15 minutes from Lake Macquarie, they decided to put it down on the water.

 

The approach and touchdown were textbook as verified by the video. But, unknown to them the gear door was open and caused the plane to be destroyed a few seconds after touchdown.

 

The J160 is a lot of fun. Takes a bit to fly compared with some but, as a trainer it would be hard to beat. Very robust airframe. The 4 cyl Jab engine works fine in the J160 and gives it a cruise of 100 kts which is good I think for a small plane. There have been plenty of comments on here regarding the reliability of the Jab engine and whether any of them get to their claimed TBO.

Thank you Blackrod , for giving me the actual event info on the freedom accident . I will not even consider apmphibious/ landing gear varients now, for two reasons the saftey question mark and two the additional cost. It sounds wise the stick to land based. As you know this is something I wish to do ie my dream to work towards. On that note sounds like jab has a good airframe , but the engines are less reliable is this true for all their engines? and would a rotax engine in a jab be a better combination. or are jab owners able to do something with the jab motor to make them more reliable. pitty they read good on the specifications with the preheat/ car oil filter/plugs and local bits.

 

once again I thank you!

 

 

[freedom]

Thank you Blackrod !

 

 

[Guest rocketdriver]

There is a saying that there are two types of pilot ... those who have landed with the gear in the wrong position, and those that will .... And I have to admit that I have done it twice, both times in gliders, both times when the work load was very high (for two different reasons) and both times extremely lucky not to even scratch the paint ......

 

 

[dazza 38]

Hi Freedom, just to throw a spanner in the works, have you looked at the SeaMax amphib,quick run down, it is made in Brazil, made of glass/carbon fibre, with some alluminium thrown in. According to the factory, they know of two cases when, the pilots forgot to have the retractable undercarriage, up and locked, for a water landing. Apart from stopping realy quickly lol, the a/c on both occasions, stayed upright. The reason is because, the rear main wheels are set along way back in the fuselage, well behind c of G,and basically acted like anchors, with no tendency of the a/c to nose over. All the above information i found on their and the australian web site.Cheers

 

 

[freedom]

There is a saying that there are two types of pilot ... those who have landed with the gear in the wrong position, and those that will .... And I have to admit that I have done it twice, both times in gliders, both times when the work load was very high (for two different reasons) and both times extremely lucky not to even scratch the paint ......

In my brief exposure to this RF site I have been fortunate to learn from others experience, I have an enquiring mind and am intriged with your glider/ landing gear experiences. I had assumed gliders had the fixed centre wheel I did not realise that gear is retractable, oanother reason for the fixed position, takes the alternative out of the equasion. Probably a good thing for new folk like myself! Thank you for your comment!

 

 

[freedom]

Hi Freedom, just to throw a spanner in the works, have you looked at the SeaMax amphib,quick run down, it is made in Brazil, made of glass/carbon fibre, with some alluminium thrown in. According to the factory, they know of two cases when, the pilots forgot to have the retractable undercarriage, up and locked, for a water landing. Apart from stopping realy quickly lol, the a/c on both occasions, stayed upright. The reason is because, the rear main wheels are set along way back in the fuselage, well behind c of G,and basically acted like anchors, with no tendency of the a/c to nose over. All the above information i found on their and the australian web site.Cheers

Thanks for that Dazza , you were correct by saying a spanner in the works, perhaps the people at Freedom can lurn from the Seamax, I like the mirror on the float a simple and effective option , I dont like the cloth wing though, to me a maintenance issue! so I think fixed at the beginning and work towards something like the seamax after. First for me is to start and thats why its my dream at the moment $, thankyou for the info its a good plane , just the cloth worries me.

 

 

[Guest rocketdriver]

In my brief exposure to this RF site I have been fortunate to learn from others experience, I have an enquiring mind and am intriged with your glider/ landing gear experiences. I had assumed gliders had the fixed centre wheel I did not realise that gear is retractable, oanother reason for the fixed position, takes the alternative out of the equasion. Probably a good thing for new folk like myself! Thank you for your comment!

Hi Freedom ... the first was on my conversion flight to a 15 metre racing class glider with flaps as well ..... on downwind I was following a 2 seat trainer and spaced myself to land after him. Then about half way along the downwind leg andother glider inserted itself in the cct a bit lower than me and between me and the other guy, and then, about turning base, in came another really low after completing a task. So now I had to spot land an unfamiliar glider in between and / or over the others, depending on where and how long they landed. And of course I'd interrupted my downwind checks ...... Luckily I made a very smooth touchdown on grass, and it was only as the fuselage settled onto the grass that I realised something was different. Then I felt VERY small!!!! Luckily not even a scratch .... The CFI seft me a polite note telling me "DYFC and if you don't know what that means, give me a call" ...... which of course I did .....

The second was really STUPID. I was flying a single seat aerobatic glider whose u/c control was the oposite to normal ... ie forward for down. I'd been showing off, and was so excited by my own brilliant pilot skills that I did my downwind checks twice, the second time raising the undercarriage instead of lowering it ...... The lesson I take from this one is that pride comes before a fall, and that showing off is DANGEROUS!! .....