RA then convert to GA PPL

[tarnasky]

Hey just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on getting a recreational license then

 

converting that to GA PPL in order to go through to CPL? Im yet to start my training but am currently in the process of selecting a school....so anyways was talking to an instructor today who metioned this was a good way to go. He said starting off on a Jabiroo for the rec license, then converting to PPL on a Beechcraft and finishing off the CPL on a Cessna 210.

 

Apparently the cost savings would be significant.

 

Thanx in advance

 

 

[NWpilot]

G'day Tarnasky,

 

That is the way i went, i started flying trikes, found the winters were to cold for me so i converted to 3 axis, Jab's, sports cruiser and the likes, then decided i would like to fly with more mates and luggage etc, so i converted over to GA and completed my PPL.

 

I will be holding on to each type as i like to fly the lighter Aircraft with just a mate to keep me company, and i love flying the trike, (when the weather is warm enough for me)

 

I found it to be a cheaper way as i did it in dribs and drabs, and i can get more hours in the sky in the RA Aus planes then what i can in the GA planes. Good luck which ever way you go and remember to keep the dream alive, Remember why you started flying in the first place.

 

 

[Guest basscheffers]

Best way to get your PPL

 

It's the best way to get your PPL! Just make sure you choose a school that offers both and does an easy transition. People have been stung by GA schools that made them do way more flying than needed to convert. (like repeating the whole nav syllabus, making them get an SPL, etc.) Shop around, talk to the CFI. If you have a full RA-Aus license with passenger and cross country endorsement, you should really only need the two hours instrument flying, getting used to the aircraft and fly the test.

 

You really have two options:

 

1. Get your RA-Aus certificate, fly the PPL navs in RA, then convert after.

 

2. Get your RA-Aus certificate, fly PPL navs in GA.

 

Best to do the GA BAK and instead of the RA-Aus nav exam, do the PPL theory.

 

Cost wise there should not be much difference (depending on how many nav hours you do in the expensive GA aircraft!) and in either case you end up dual-licensed.

 

 

[NWpilot]

Hey Tarnasky,

 

Where do you fly from, if your over in the west let me know, i have had dealings with a few of the GA and RA schools over here.

 

 

[tarnasky]

Thanx for the replies so far.........NWpilot im currently living in Melbourne but im open to any reccommendations you have. I just recently took a trip down to Hobart to have a look at Tasair.

 

Cheers

 

 

[poteroo]

There are savings to be had.

 

Look for a school which does both GA and RAAus training. They will almost certainly give full credit for the RAAus PC hours - meaning all you need is 2 hrs IF + competency on a GA aircraft + PPL BAK/Class2 medical and you're thru GFPT as well.

 

If the school has it's act together - then your RAAus Navs will actually be identical to NAV 1 to NAV 5 of the PPL NAV syllabus - so you won't be repeating those in the GA aircraft.

 

More often than not in 'dual' schools, your instructor/CFI will be qualified over both sides of the industry, which makes things so much easier for students.

 

happy days,

 

 

[Simonflyer]

Thats the way Ive gone about it, and I reckon Ive saved a fair bit of cash so far, but more than that I think learning in A Tecnam has been good for my basic flying skills..I found it pretty easy to transition into Pipers and cessna's after time in the Teccy as the inertia in the heavier plane's looked after a lot of the little adjustment needed in an UL.

 

Ive come into aviation late in life(started at 31) but under two years later Ive got all the RA endo's, a PPL, and most of my CPL theory subjects done.In other words about 2 steps from the start line...It is a long road.

 

The next thing is to work on an RA aus instructor rating, build a bit of experience and then do a GA Instructor rating after that..Overall I feel like Im getting a really well rounded education, and I plan to fly a lot of different aircraft throughout my career.So far so good..

 

If you want any info on some schools catering for both RA and GA in the Melbourne/Regional Vic are area feel free to PM me.

 

 

[ossie]

Hey just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on getting a recreational license thenconverting that to GA PPL in order to go through to CPL? Im yet to start my training but am currently in the process of selecting a school....so anyways was talking to an instructor today who metioned this was a good way to go. He said starting off on a Jabiroo for the rec license, then converting to PPL on a Beechcraft and finishing off the CPL on a Cessna 210.

Apparently the cost savings would be significant.

 

Thanx in advance

If CPL and beyond is the goal, then cost really has to be a secondary factor, within reason of course. Why, cause what seems like costs savings during initial training may well be insignificant when looking for that first break in the industry.

 

Keep in mind that having a CPL and being employable are two different things, your initial training is vital when heading down that road. Good Luck :thumb_up:

 

 

[XAIRVTW]

I was thinking like you a couple of years ago now, I just went & did my PPL, If CPL is where you want to go just do your PPL straight up either way its going to cost$$ especially when you start your NAVS & CPL isnt any cheaper. Hope this doesnt discourage you.

 

Cheers

 

 

[Tomo]

Hey mate.

 

I'm pretty much doing exactly the same thing now, and will give more of an idea once I'm finished as to how it went.

 

Why I went with RAA first for myself was because; 1) the aircraft were cheaper to fly/maintain; 2) I could start when I did as I had the money for it.

 

Difference was: $130hr dual for the Drifter vs $260hr dual for GA. Initial training to fly an aircraft is the same, why pay twice as much for the same thing??

 

I now have a hundred or so hrs in quite a few different aircraft, I've flown around a bit of Australia. If I did my PPL first off, I would not have been in a position to do any of that, and would no doubt have no where near the hrs I do now. I'm still better off actually even with all of that.

 

Rough estimate of say hundred hrs, about, lets say at $120hr for average sake = $12,000. A fair bit when you see it like that!!

 

PPL estimate they reckon of around $18,000 I think = How many hrs?

 

The way I look at it is experience/understanding rather than license. I may only need a few hrs to go GA now, but I've put aside about 10hrs or more worth at this stage and will try as many new things as possible. Whats that leave me? 10hrs at $260 an hr is $2600 + $12,000 is $14,600. $3,400 left over, that I wouldn't have if I had done the PPL.

 

Fun factor? Oh yes! Flying Drifters and the Huge range of RAA aircraft is just incredible.

 

Do what you have to I guess, but you don't want to get ripped off, and you also don't want to undercut yourself when you don't have to.

 

Another thing, how urgent are you at wanting your PPL? Get the RAA ticket now, wait a yr gaining experience in the air, X-countries etc... then Jump on the PPL, may end up the same amount of doing the PPL first, but consider how much more learnered you are.

 

Sorry to ramble on, but I hope it helps a little.

 

Oh, and just another thing. If you want to do the 150hr CPL course it mayen't be a good idea to do RAA first. (you'd have to check on that) But there are some restrictions on how you go about doing it. All depends I guess on how urgent you are.

 

 

[Spriteah]

RA to GA

 

Tarn,

 

I am currently doing what you are asking. I completed RAA at Lethbrdige Victoria which is not to far from Melbourne (not close either but we have a lot from Melbourne there).

 

Now I am converting to GA at Bacchus Marsh (closer to Melb). I estimate about 10 hours cross over. They are ticking off all skills (but you have to demonstrate) and then want me to do the navs which is fine by me as I will do them in a Piper low wing so will be gaining experience in a different plane at the same time.

 

I am very happy with the level of instruction at the GA school and they are undoubtable making me a better pilot.

 

If you want to chat further give me a call on 0403 22 8986.

 

Cheers,

 

Jim

 

Austec Avionics.

 

 

[Guest basscheffers]

Keep in mind that having a CPL and being employable are two different things, your initial training is vital when heading down that road. Good Luck :thumb_up:

I think that's a load of fear, uncertainty and doubt.

At the school where I keep my Sporty, the ones who do their first 20-40 hours in RAA and do some more hour building in it too have no more trouble finding a job than the ones who went Cessna all the way.

 

Start in RA at the same school where you will finish your CPL and use the savings to pay for complex 182RG and even 206/210 time at the end of your training; that will impress employers far more than having flow a Cessna 152 Land-O-Matic for most of your 200 hours.

 

 

[Guest Dick Gower]

That is the most cost-effective way to go Tarnasky. The RA hours are recognised for the GFPT (CAR 5.76) and PPL (CAR 5.84).

 

There is a flow-chart and explanation at Royal Victorian Aero Club - Recreational Aviation.

 

The logical way to go is to get the RA pilot certificate plus the cross-country andorsment then find a good GA school for the PPL.

 

Good luck!

 

 

[murali]

Need help if possible

 

Hi NWPilot,

 

I came across your post while looking for information for learning to fly - thinking of whether to go for GA or RA.

 

I went out to Jandakot last week and checked out the GA schools, right now im trying to get hold of RA schools in WA and im hoping you could provide me with starting points/contacts on this.

 

Thank you for your help.

 

Regards,

 

Murali

 

 

[poteroo]

Go to www.auf.asn.au and look up flying schools by state. WA has several. You should have some idea of what you want to do with your flying in the future when you talk with schools. You may find that combined RAA/GA schools can offer you the better 'pathway' because they will have harmonised their courses and the instructors will be the same people both sides of the school.

 

happy days,

 

 

[tarnasky]

Hey guys thanx alot for all your advice.......after much debate Ive decided to do the 150hr CPL course full time at TVSA out at Bacchus Marsh. I met with the CFI not long ago and he seemed like a pretty straight shooter. I have the time and the money so i figure why screw around when I can study full time and get my CPL in a year (all going well of course).

 

May sound a little naive but im pretty motivated and believe i can achieve anything i set my mind too.

 

Thanx again :)

 

 

[winsor68]

Hey guys thanx alot for all your advice.......after much debate Ive decided to do the 150hr CPL course full time at TVSA out at Bacchus Marsh. I met with the CFI not long ago and he seemed like a pretty straight shooter. I have the time and the money so i figure why screw around when I can study full time and get my CPL in a year (all going well of course).May sound a little naive but im pretty motivated and believe i can achieve anything i set my mind too.

 

Thanx again :)

Go for it! If the money is not an issue you will be sitting in the right hand seat of an airliner in no time...

 

Good luck.

 

 

[Bandit12]

When I was looking at that, my instructor suggested that I stay away from the twins straight after or while going for CPL. The reason given was that they are expensive, and you have a snowball's chance in hell of getting a job flying a light twin straight out of training. Most likely you will spend a season flying in a single anyway, and in that time, you will have to spend money maintaining a MECIR. The instument rating is not a lot of good when you are stuck in a VFR single.

 

After getting some experience in a single, then go back to the school and get your MECIR, and then go chase the light twin jobs. I never followed through myself, but I watched others do exactly that.

 

Good luck with it!

 

 

[pilotdave69]

What a great topic and good information people! Im going to head down the path of PPL once my Navex are completed, then possibly looking at the instructors rating as well. PPL is needed as a few places i want to fly , are in Controlled airspace, seems the right way to go. I love learning in the Jabs, just today stepping into the J230 after 50 hours of the J160, which is a unreal plane to learn in. I will keep flying both to stay proficient in both.

 

Learning continues, so does the fun.

 

Dave

 

 

[rdarby]

To clarify, once you have the RA Pilot Ceritificate and Cross Country Endorsement, do you then need to do the GA BAK as well? Or do they accept th RA BAK exam as the same as the GA one? Doing the time to learn to fly the GA plane is obvious, I'm just not sure if I need to start preparing for a GA exam as well? I completed the RA certificate a month ago and am doing RA nav's, but want to plan my year out to get the PPL too, so need to factor in more study, or not. Thanks, Ryan

 

 

[Guest basscheffers]

Not sure about needing the GA BAK, but you certainly will need the PPL theory exam, just like you will need to do the RA nav exam before you will get your XC endorsement.

 

Needless to say: if you can pass the PPL theory exam, then the GA BAK will be easy should you have to take that after all.

 

 

[rdarby]

I think I'm missing something obvious. By looking at that flowchart again I see there is a GA BAK exam and a PPL theory exam. What's the difference? What else is there to learn, or is it their equivalent of the XC exam?

 

 

[poteroo]

You need to pass GA BAK plus the PPL Final theory exam before your PPL flight test.

 

Your GA BAK is slightly more advanced than RAA BAK - mostly in respect of W&B,and performance. If you do it first - then your RAA BAK isn't needed.

 

You must have GA BAK to attempt the GFPT flight test - but you do not need to do this GFPT if you are going to begin your GA flying by going straight on to your PPL navs. The IF hours can be done during your type familiarisation and early navs.

 

Your GA flight school might accept all, or none, of your RAA X/C's towards PPL - it all depends. Some are downright arrogant about this - others less so. It certainly helps if your instructor was both GA and RAA qualified. We fly the same routes and syllabus as the GA school does for NAVS 1-5 of the PPL course, and this is accepted towards your PPL NAVS.

 

What's really important is to ensure that you've knocked over the PPL Final long before you get to the end of your PPL NAVS because your instructor needs to organise your flight test with an ATO - and sometimes these can't easily be changed. Nothing worse than postponing a flight test because of no theory pass - then discovering you've 'gone off the boil' with your handling skills while studying. Costs big $$$.

 

happy days,

 

 

[Hildy]

can anyone recommend a specific school in NSW for doing the conversion once I have the full set of RA endorsements? I'm basically flying every moment I have spare time right now (that coincides with instructor time - part of the reason for doing my ab initio training where I did was the availability of a full time instructor so I could go flying every day) so I hope I can do the navexes over the next month or so, weather permitting, and I'll try to get the hours for my pax this coming week.

 

I spoke to a CFI yesterday who said it was hard in NSW and suggested I go to Bendigo.

 

(working evenings is very compatible with flying, I've found).

 

 

[kaz3g]

Thanx for the replies so far.........NWpilot im currently living in Melbourne but im open to any reccommendations you have. I just recently took a trip down to Hobart to have a look at Tasair.Cheers

Perhaps give Dick Gower a call at Coldstream 03 9739 1406. He is CFI for both RA (Tecnam) and GA (Warriors) and YCEM is a very friendly spot close to Melbourne in the beautiful Yarra Valley.

 

kaz