Another 80s 'pilots strike' looming?

[Guest ozzie]

being a fly on the wall at 'St George Rowers Club' around lunch on Monday may be interesting. Anyone from here involved?

 

Pilots of Australia - time to unite - Meeting Aug 23 - PPRuNe Forums

 

 

[Guest check-in]

Without going too deep into it, the 89 thing was not a strike in the usual sense. It was a mass resignation and it backfired very badly on the profession. It destroyed many small tourist businesses, so there was very little public sympathy. It destroyed marriages.

 

Side-effects were that it opened opportunities for deregulation, charter airlines and the low-cost carriers. Working conditions for pilots have been eroding ever since that time. So we may see industrial action again, but my bet is that it will be more along the lines of working to rule, maximizing 'sickies', loading 'comfort fuel' at the expense of payload, flying lower than optimum altitudes etc etc. What makes really strong union action so unlikely is that in the ensuing years pilots have been quite divided; some really bitter. There were those that stayed out and either went overseas, took alternative careers or (in some sad cases) suicided, plus those that came in from overseas and those that eventually reapplied for their old jobs and went back.

 

Interesting that the recent film about the life of Bob Hawke made no mention of it, yet he was on watch when it happened......

 

Probably not a suitable topic for this site. Pprune will well and truly cover it.

 

 

[poteroo]

You'd hope professional pilots would not repeat the mistakes of the past, (1989), but it's 21 years on, and maybe a new generation of pilots again reckon they are indispensible. It's not as if there's exactly a shortage of commercial pilots around. Hope the cooler heads prevail.

 

happy days,

 

 

[facthunter]

The aftermath of tha 89 dispute.

 

The aim was to destroy the union. To this end Ansett Spent loads of money,and gave most of it's pilots to overseas competitors , free. The other Airlines were brought into it whether they wanted to or not. It was an Abeles /Murdoch thing being the owners of the Ansett empire, with Hawke as a puppet. The cost of the whole episode was in the realm of 2.3 billion and that was the figure that sent Ansett into bankruptcy. The debt figure in today's money would be two and a half times the figure of the day, currently. Traditionally Airline management HATES its pilots because they know that they need them and they are SKILLED. so they are hard to deal with. They have the same problem with their maintaintainence staff who they regard as just a necessary evil, and their qualifications are minimalised. There never was a strike, just a work to rules. The arbitration commission cancelled the pilots award on a weekend. The pilots resigned to protect their houses and assets from attack by the Airlines for loss of earnings due to withdrawal of services . Seriously high figures. You would loose ALL that you had.

 

If you want to judge this thing , get ALL the facts and don't just take the historical account of it which is written by the Murdoch press which owned half of the Anset Airline conglomerate and controls most of the media in Australia. Journo's that I spoke with said that there are only two types of Journo's in Australia " Those who work for Rupert Murdoch and those who are going to". What hope have you got in getting the true facts out there.

 

In writing this I know that I am putting myself at risk, but there comes a time when shutting up is not an option. Nev

 

 

[Jabiru Phil]

I heard that it will be over planned "importing" pilots at a very much lower salary.

 

So they have every right to be concered.

 

 

[dazza 38]

Off thread a bit.But the same thing is happening in other industries.Construction industry for example.Over the years, more and more cheap labour from asia, is taking Australian Construction jobs.Alot of my mates who are Tilers for a big company, are losing their jobs in the next few weeks.Because they cant price low enought to compete with cheap Asia workers over here on working Visas.They are working for about $10 a hour apparently.Jobs that they have taken over so far is mainly-Tilers, Cleaners.Landscaping. So far not electrical or plumbing, due to licencing requirements here i suspect.So back to the thread.Its just not pilots, coming here it is alot of different trades, in different industries.

 

 

[justinm001]

Very true Dazza.

 

People dont relise its going to be effecting EVERY industry soon.

 

Interesting little fact which not many people know. The Gov plans to use an international company to carry out the testing and part of the rollout for NBN.

 

The company in question has no experience doing this, Its not a company from US/EUROPE/ASIA where similar networks have been succesfully setup, the company just quoted 1/3 cheaper than everyone else.

 

(and no im not trying to sway peoples votes, voting is over :) )

 

Off thread a bit.But the same thing is happening in other industries.Construction industry for example.Over the years, more and more cheap labour from asia, is taking Australian Construction jobs.Alot of my mates who are Tilers for a big company, are losing their jobs in the next few weeks.Because they cant price low enought to compete with cheap Asia workers over here on working Visas.They are working for about $10 a hour apparently.Jobs that they have taken over so far is mainly-Tilers, Cleaners.Landscaping. So far not electrical or plumbing, due to licencing requirements here i suspect.So back to the thread.Its just not pilots, coming here it is alot of different trades, in different industries.

[Tomo]

Off thread a bit.But the same thing is happening in other industries.Construction industry for example.Over the years, more and more cheap labour from asia, is taking Australian Construction jobs.Alot of my mates who are Tilers for a big company, are losing their jobs in the next few weeks.Because they cant price low enought to compete with cheap Asia workers over here on working Visas.They are working for about $10 a hour apparently.Jobs that they have taken over so far is mainly-Tilers, Cleaners.Landscaping. So far not electrical or plumbing, due to licencing requirements here i suspect.So back to the thread.Its just not pilots, coming here it is alot of different trades, in different industries.

Dead right Dazza, some local businesses down the road to us employ Asians etc... Why? Because they actually WORK, and are pretty cheap too, but this particular guy usually pays them well, mostly because they are willing to work.

 

Sadly Aussies have hit the deck with that idea... it's easier to go on the doll... hopefully that goes away, and things will start to get a face lift.

 

There's a difference between being unable to find work (which there is) but why did it happen in the first place?

 

Anyway I should stop while I'm ahead... too far out of my comfort zone here.

 

 

[justinm001]

I get the subtle message in your post and partially agree.. however the problem is with people coming on Work Visa's and swiping the work...

 

If your an Australian Citizen (regardless of nationality) you have every right to work and try get the best pay/job you can in Australia. Its the groups of people that get mass-imported via Work Visa's for temporary job that are causing the problem. Well not them, but the AUS companies hiring them.

 

*edit* - you should be anoyed aswell Tomo. Didnt Qantas or someone move alot of there repair work overseas... Your a mechanic yeah ? (diff issue, but similar underlying problem)

 

Dead right Dazza, some local businesses down the road to us employ Asians etc... Why? Because they actually WORK, and are pretty cheap too, but this particular guy usually pays them well, mostly because they are willing to work.Sadly Aussies have hit the deck with that idea... it's easier to go on the doll... hopefully that goes away, and things will start to get a face lift.

 

There's a difference between being unable to find work (which there is) but why did it happen in the first place?

 

Anyway I should stop while I'm ahead... too far out of my comfort zone here.

[dazza 38]

I should have mentioned.These Guys are coming he via a sponsor.They normaly go to work in a mini bus they all live in a house or units.Im talking 10 to 15 guys, in one house.This is not hear say, i see it first hand.This one company which has a house down the road from my house.The asian workers, renovated this guys house, after hours.High Rise work here they work Saturday to about midday.Then they work on the house.They are getting exploided.Yes tomo they do work hard. 95% of workers on High Rise Construction also work very hard,I should know i have worked on High Rise Construction for the better part of 11 years.Working on decks plumbing pipe work in behind steel reinforcing, in the summer heat and getting burned by the steel isnt the best job in the world. But guys who work on high rise generally make $1300 to $1500 a week on wages.Subbies a little bit more(me lol).Construction work is hot and cold at the best of times.Every body runs out of work , every now and again.Thats the risk in working in the construction industry.

 

You have to make hay whisle the sun shines.That is you have to make good money when the work is there.With these Guys coming in cheap.Workers wont be able to save up, to ride the down times.

 

Ps- I forgot to mention.Painters are also on the hit list.One company here will have about 150 painters out of work, in a few weeks.Plus the 120 odd tilers i mentioned before.

 

As- per steel fixers, formworkers, scaffolders.Most of the guys are Kiwis, or aussies.They all work very hard.Lazy people dont last long in the construction industry.You just want to get paid, and paid well.

 

I have had 4 people i have personaly known been killed at work, working on high rise construction, by work accidents over the last five years, it is or can be a dangerous occupation, thats why the money is good.

 

I hope i havent offended anyone and i am sorry for moving off the original thread.

 

I can see why profesional pilots here are worried about their future as well.If they lose their jobs to imported air crew.

 

Cheers

 

 

[winsor68]

Dead right Dazza, some local businesses down the road to us employ Asians etc... Why? Because they actually WORK, and are pretty cheap too, but this particular guy usually pays them well, mostly because they are willing to work.Sadly Aussies have hit the deck with that idea... it's easier to go on the doll... hopefully that goes away, and things will start to get a face lift.

 

There's a difference between being unable to find work (which there is) but why did it happen in the first place?

 

Anyway I should stop while I'm ahead... too far out of my comfort zone here.

Jeez Tomo... You need to get out more. Aren't you a bit young to be a wowser?

 

The reality is that Australians are no longer the "bludgers" of the world economy... we work long and hard hours for less money than any generation in the last 100 years, Young, Old and in between. Perhaps in your small community you have young dole bludgers but it is no longer a national phenomenon like it used to be.

 

In my industry the young blokes (although many of them still as clueless as many of us were at that age) are hard working, think nothing of working 15 hour days. The problem is that so many of them now think of this as normal.

 

Any company bringing in overseas labour with the excuse that Aussies don't work needs to be run out of town.

 

I find it ironic that there is a major threat to our jobs from overseas labour, yet in the recent election it was not mentioned. Every day at my job I see Kiwi's flying in and out from New Zealand weekly taking their $100 000 + out of our economy... and the big mining companies really couldn't give a stuff.

 

I say give those jobs to locals...there are thousands of us just waiting for the opportunity.

 

 

[blueshed]

Very Interesting thought's from above!

 

As someone said you have to make the money while it is there for the taking, and in my industry there is plenty of gaps between the good times. (Agricultural Industry)

 

We have a great deal of difficulty finding people who have some common sense and who are willing to work odd hour's. Our industry runs for extremely busy period's, then has extremely slow periods. Just how it is!

 

Have seen many people leave this industry for the supposed consistancy (spelling) of some other industry!

 

If it keeps raining and the locusts arrive as expected we will need to work 24/8 to just keep up with it, well maybe keep up!

 

There definately won't be enough of us! Either pilot's or ground crew.

 

As me mum has mentioned "Agriculture is the most respected form of Gambling" How True!

 

What a Challenge! and the Rosey future moves on!