Blanik L13 grounding

[Dafydd Llewellyn]

This thread is ridiculously out of date. Look up STC SVA 542 on the CASA website. All the servicable L13A1s were returned to service; in addition, VH-XQO (Bundaberg gliding club) has been added to the list. VH-GIW will shortly join them. This mod. can be applied to L-13s that were servicable when the grounding occurred and which have proper log book records up to that time. Anybody interested should contact CAMIT Pty Ltd (Bundaberg) for the cost of a parts kit, and Seabird Australia Pty Ltd for the labour cost to put it together, and add approximately $3000.00 for the package of fasteners. Total cost is likely to be in the vicinity of $ 35,000.00

 

 

[Captain]

This thread is ridiculously out of date.

That is because all posts before yours were made between late 2010 and late 2012.

 

Logical I guess.

 

 

[Dafydd Llewellyn]

That is because all posts before yours were made between late 2010 and late 2012.Logical I guess.

Well, yes; that was pretty much my point. However, the thread was not up to date even back then. I have the jigs; anybody interested can deal directly with the suppliers.

 

 

[winsor68]

Dafydd

 

Are you saying it would cost $35k to upgrade an L13?!???

 

 

[Dafydd Llewellyn]

DafyddAre you saying it would cost $35k to upgrade an L13?!???

Yes; that's about what it typically costs, provided the basic aircraft is in reasonably good condition. That gets it to 12,000 hours total life (if mainly aero-towed). The machined, heat-treated and proof-tested parts kit costs around $12,000; there are about 240 man-hours in installing it; and roughly $3000 cost for the fasteners. It replaces more than double the critical metal in the root area out to rib#7 in the wing, and supplies added reinforcement out to about 40% of the wing span, plus at selected spots further out; it replaces the steel wing root fitting and the lower fuselage carry-through member and the main wing pin. It also replaces the tailplane root fittings and reinforces the tailplane carry-through structure; and it reinforces the fin attachment. In other words, it's a major structural re-build, not a band-aid. The wing has to be opened and the mod pretty much deals with "ageing aircraft" issues, at least so far as the main structure goes. Look at it on a cost per hour basis; if you start with a Blanik that has already done 5000 hours, you get another 7000 hours life, so the cost works out at about $5 per hour. The job covers most of the "heavy engineering" aspects of the 40 year inspection.

 

What did you expect? A can of fly-spray labelled "Crack begone?" maybe?

 

 

[winsor68]

I guess at $5 per hour it sounds better...I was just thinking that $35k is a lot of money for a Blanik... Again if you spread that cost over 7000 hours and factor in the price of a new club trainer it maybe makes sense...

 

What do clubs buy these days of they want a NEW trainer?

 

 

[Blueadventures]

This thread is ridiculously out of date. Look up STC SVA 542 on the CASA website. All the servicable L13A1s were returned to service; in addition, VH-XQO (Bundaberg gliding club) has been added to the list. VH-GIW will shortly join them. This mod. can be applied to L-13s that were servicable when the grounding occurred and which have proper log book records up to that time. Anybody interested should contact CAMIT Pty Ltd (Bundaberg) for the cost of a parts kit, and Seabird Australia Pty Ltd for the labour cost to put it together, and add approximately $3000.00 for the package of fasteners. Total cost is likely to be in the vicinity of $ 35,000.00

Hi Dafydd That was a great Mod you designed. A little history of the modified Blanik I fly is that when the previous owners (a club south west of Sydney) sold her thier reason was the preceived or apparant drag of the external reinforcing under the wing. When the new owner got her to Central Queensland they often compared the glide performance with the other glider and theres no difference. Then I bought her pre the grounding and I carn't say how happy I am that they sold off the modified Blank all those years ago. The one I have is VH-GPS and she flys great. Cheers Mike

 

 

[Blueadventures]

Hi Dafydd That was a great Mod you designed. A little history of the modified Blanik I fly is that when the previous owners (a club south west of Sydney) sold her thier reason was the preceived or apparant drag of the external reinforcing under the wing. When the new owner got her to Central Queensland they often compared the glide performance with the other glider and theres no difference. Then I bought her pre the grounding and I carn't say how happy I am that they sold off the modified Blank all those years ago. The one I have is VH-GPS and she flys great. Cheers Mike

[Blueadventures]

Blanik L13A-1

 

 

 

[Blueadventures]

post: 315686, member: 5112"]Blanik L13A-1

 

Blanik GPS winch launch, in flight and flared for landing.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

 

 

 

 

[Dafydd Llewellyn]

Thanks for that. Here's what our one will look like (I'm still rib-stitching ailerons; the main life-extension work is complete). You're correct, the mod makes no measurable difference to the performance; we checked it way back by flying one with one modified wing and one unmodified wing; it showed no turning tendency whatever. I renewed my gliding currency a couple of weeks ago, on the Bundaberg one, VH-XQO; it still flies just as nicely as I remembered.

 

 

 

[Dafydd Llewellyn]

I guess at $5 per hour it sounds better...I was just thinking that $35k is a lot of money for a Blanik... Again if you spread that cost over 7000 hours and factor in the price of a new club trainer it maybe makes sense...What do clubs buy these days of they want a NEW trainer?

The short answer to that is, I don't know. However it seems gliding clubs find it much easier to get finance for a new aircraft, than for a major rebuild of their Blanik.

 

 

[paulh]

A motor blanik - what sort of engine/motor and prop combination is envisaged? It would be interesting to know how much hp is required, and will it be purely to get to altitude and avoid outlandings or be enough for some motor touring? (need a big bump in the trailer for the motor pylon!)

 

 

[Dafydd Llewellyn]

A motor blanik - what sort of engine/motor and prop combination is envisaged? It would be interesting to know how much hp is required, and will it be purely to get to altitude and avoid outlandings or be enough for some motor touring? (need a big bump in the trailer for the motor pylon!)

Rotax 582 DCDI model 99; single-blade folding pusher (experimental). It's intended to be a cruising motorglider; target is 80 KTAS at 50% power. My trailer has no problem with the engine pylon . . .

 

 

 

[paulh]

Rotax 582 DCDI model 99; single-blade folding pusher (experimental). It's intended to be a cruising motorglider; target is 80 KTAS at 50% power. My trailer has no problem with the engine pylon . . .

Thanks Dafydd - interesting aircraft

 

 

[Dafydd Llewellyn]

Hi ExadiosMy Blanik L13A-1, VH-GPS, was back up in the air last Saturday. It was great to have her back up. I'm looking forward to many flights again this year and perhaps get the 300 kms done. I think this will be the third or fourth one back on line out of the original Llewlyn modified Blaniks.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Mike, I'd reply to your conversation, if I could get the thing to give me a "reply" button. meanwhile, in response to your question:

 

Yes, it will have two seats; it will have an MTOW of 600 Kg in the normal category - i.e. a downgrade from the "cloud flying" category. However I'll not be certificating it; it will be under the Australian Experimental rules - see CASR 21.191(a) and 21.191(i). The reason is that the motor - Rotax 582 Model 99 (Type E gearbox) - does not have a TC; also I'm planning to use a single-blade folding pusher propeller, which will also be experimental. (The Hoffman option is out of the question, due to their ridiculous overhaul requirements). At that weight, the fatigue life is used at about 2.8 times the normal rate. The installation of the hard points in the fuselage for the engine pylon added about $2500 to the cost of the fatigue mod; I'll be building the rest myself. The engine mod. needs the nose bumper replaced by a wheel, to prevent it digging the nose in if you open the engine up too fast on takeoff; and I'm planning an improved tail wheel installation, with much better energy absorption, because if it does dig the nose in, it then comes down on the tail with a wallop when you throttle back. The Rotax 582 costs around $7000 here in Australia, complete with Type E gearbox, so the added cost of the powerplant is likely to be about double that. The reason I want to use the Rotax 582, is that it's an oil-injection motor, which means one can use it rather more like a four-stroke, than is normal with 2-stroke engines; it will cruise at around 80 KTAS on 50% power, so that's a significant consideration.

 

 

 

There have been innumerable attempts at putting engines on Blaniks, including the L13J - but they have all failed, except the Riley one, because unless they are extremely "clean" with power off, they cause unacceptable buffet on the vertical tail.

 

 

[Dafydd Llewellyn]

Mike, I'd reply to your conversation, if I could get the thing to give me a "reply" button. meanwhile, in response to your question:Yes, it will have two seats; it will have an MTOW of 600 Kg in the normal category - i.e. a downgrade from the "cloud flying" category. However I'll not be certificating it; it will be under the Australian Experimental rules - see CASR 21.191(a) and 21.191(i). The reason is that the motor - Rotax 582 Model 99 (Type E gearbox) - does not have a TC; also I'm planning to use a single-blade folding pusher propeller, which will also be experimental. (The Hoffman option is out of the question, due to their ridiculous overhaul requirements). At that weight, the fatigue life is used at about 2.8 times the normal rate. The installation of the hard points in the fuselage for the engine pylon added about $2500 to the cost of the fatigue mod; I'll be building the rest myself. The engine mod. needs the nose bumper replaced by a wheel, to prevent it digging the nose in if you open the engine up too fast on takeoff; and I'm planning an improved tail wheel installation, with much better energy absorption, because if it does dig the nose in, it then comes down on the tail with a wallop when you throttle back. The Rotax 582 costs around $7000 here in Australia, complete with Type E gearbox, so the added cost of the powerplant is likely to be about double that. The reason I want to use the Rotax 582, is that it's an oil-injection motor, which means one can use it rather more like a four-stroke, than is normal with 2-stroke engines; it will cruise at around 80 KTAS on 50% power, so that's a significant consideration.

 

 

 

There have been innumerable attempts at putting engines on Blaniks, including the L13J - but they have all failed, except the Riley one, because unless they are extremely "clean" with power off, they cause unacceptable buffet on the vertical tail.

Please understand - I'm NOT trying to sell anything; this is a retirement project for my own enjoyment. Anybody who wants to can do likewise - but you'd best start with an L-13A1.

 

 

[Blueadventures]

Please understand - I'm NOT trying to sell anything; this is a retirement project for my own enjoyment. Anybody who wants to can do likewise - but you'd best start with an L-13A1.

Hi Dafydd No worries my end. Thanks for the information and look forward to hearing about your flights in her it sounds a great project. I called in at caboolture and caught up with Bert and Speedy last September and he did a quick appraisal of my Blanik (GPS) and said he was impressed with its great condition. I was towing from the Kingaroy Xcountry week and to the opportunity to ask him about some anticipated maintenance jobs I was planning. There done now so will fly her before Xmas. I presently in Newcastle on a course and not back home unttil November.

 

Cheers Mike

 

 

[Dafydd Llewellyn]

There's a new EASA AD, # 2013-0252, which mandates a LET Service Bulletin #L13/116a, that calls for conductivity check on the spar caps of Blanik wings. It's arguably irrelevant to L13A1s and L-13s modified under STC SVA-542; and I am requesting an exclusion from it for Australian-registered Blaniks that incorporate either of those modifications. Watch this space.

 

 

[Dafydd Llewellyn]

There's a new EASA AD, # 2013-0252, which mandates a LET Service Bulletin #L13/116a, that calls for conductivity check on the spar caps of Blanik wings. It's arguably irrelevant to L13A1s and L-13s modified under STC SVA-542; and I am requesting an exclusion from it for Australian-registered Blaniks that incorporate either of those modifications. Watch this space.

CASA to-day issued an exclusion to EASA AD 2013-0252, for L13A1 and L13s modified under STC LSA-542. It is conditional on the aircraft having the full modification including the tailplane. Some of the L13A1s modified back in the 1980s did not have the tailplane mod. done at that time.