Confused about RAA BAK vs GA BAK

[Gnarly Gnu]

Hey folks sorry if this has been done to death before; I'm about to do the RAA BAK shortly but intend to jump to GA later as many others here have done. Problem is I've been given conflicting opinions about the BAK....

 

On one hand some have advised me I'll have to repeat & do the GA version of BAK later whilst others say that there is no need to repeat as GA recognises the RAA version no problem. I spoke to a CFI who teaches both & he was a bit vague on it but was pushing me to do a days GA theory then the GA BAK "just in case CASA later found out I had only done the RAA version". Fine if that is necessary but this was all going to cost me a bit more too.

 

I'm studying the books for both (D-H RAA & Bob Tait day VFR / PPL BAK) but I'd really appreciate any folks that have gone this path ahead of me commenting. Was your RAA BAK accepted by the GA guys... or did you have to sit for the GA BAK as well?

 

Thanks, Chris

 

 

[motzartmerv]

Yea, the reason you are getting conflicting info is that the BAK is an inhouse exam, ie, the school can make you sit whatever exam they want (GA).Most RAA schools use the BAK published by the RAA but casa dont publish a BAK.

 

At some dual schools they make the RAA guys sit the GA exam, but dont make the GA guys sit the RAA one. (now im confusing myself)

 

The simple answer is generally no, GA won't recognise your RAA BAK, i say again, GENERALLY. Some might.

 

On the other side of the coin your RAA school will recognise your GA BAK, generally.

 

clear as mud?...;)

 

 

[Guest davidh10]

Cannot say based on experience, but I have seen it quoted here before that if you intend going GA, then do the GA BAK.

 

 

[winsor68]

Does RAA publish a BAK?

 

It seems to be a can of worms... Perhaps clarification is needed in writing from CASA?

 

 

[Tomo]

G'day Chris,

 

I think Motz has covered the answer there...

 

But for me I did both, in that I did my RAA one when I got my RAA ticket (I knew I wanted GA eventually but still did it) as I knew I wouldn't be doing GA straight away, so the fact I had to do another was a good thing in my opinion as it made me 'keep current' as such. There was probably a year and a bit time span between the two.

 

I guess it's up to you whether you want to do it again, if you think you know your BAK stuff and don't find it that hard (I find BAK easier for me than the other subjects like Met etc...) so doing it again wasn't a biggy. But if you don't like it, and you're sure you will be going GA. I'd suggest doing the GA BAK if your school has that option.

 

I know there isn't any clear answers there, sorry. But it's a fact that RAA accept the GA BAK, but not 'usually' the other way around.

 

How is the flying coming on? Enjoying it?

 

 

[djpacro]

For info, CASA's requirement is

 

The only acceptable proof of a BAK (Aeroplane) pass shall be a log book entry on the Theory Examination Pass Record section of the candidate's pilot log book, and signed by the candidate's Chief Flying Instructor (CFI).

.... i.e. signed by a CASA CFI per that school's Operations Manual.

[winsor68]

So... does that mean that if you have passed BAK... regardless of which one... and your CFI signed you off... it counts whether RA or GA as per Casa's requirements?

 

 

[djpacro]

Just to add to my prior post - a CASA CFI refers to a CFI authorised by CASA itself of a flying school which holds an Air Operator's Certificate issued by CASA itself - and operating Vh-registered aircraft. The BAK which that CFI signs must've been done in accordance with CASA's approved Operationhs Manual for that flying school.

 

 

[winsor68]

So... In a nutshell... the Ra-Aus BAK is good for nothing... except Ra-Aus?

 

 

[Admin]

When I did my BAK even though it was an RAA school I was still made to do the GA BAK...the only difference between the RA and GA BAK was the Weight and Balance component. Most RAA schools now include this in the BAK test although not formally required and if your school doesn't why not ask them to if they hold an AOC...it doesn't hurt and I know my BAK is accepted for my GA BAK even thought I didn't need to know Weight and Balance for RAA BAK

 

 

[Gnarly Gnu]

Thanks for the info and comments folks, that all kinda makes sense now. Strictly speaking the only certification that CASA recognises is from one of their endorsed CFI's apparently. Whilst I don't plan to go on to do GA immediately based on this info I think I should probably do the GA BAK instead of the RAA one to negate any need to repeat the exercise again later.

 

Flyings been going OK thanks Tomo; RAA is fine for now but longer term I'm looking towards flying larger GA size aircraft in order to include my family & some work related freight at times.

 

 

[poteroo]

GG,

 

Do the GA BAK at a GA school, have it signed into your records by the CFI - and you then don't need to do the RAA version. If you were doing RAA training, and were not interested in GA, then just do the RAA version of BAK.

 

happy days,

 

 

[Gnarly Gnu]

Thanks Poteroo, that's what I'll do.

 

Apparently I have to get an Aviation Reference Number first, just some form so the CASA Stasi know who what and where you are.

 

 

[Tomo]

Thanks Poteroo, that's what I'll do.Apparently I have to get an Aviation Reference Number first, just some form so the CASA Stasi know who what and where you are.

And surprise surprise... it's the only Free thing in aviation that ARN!!

 

 

[Spin]

And surprise surprise... it's the only Free thing in aviation that ARN!!

Shhhhh:freaked:, someone probably just forgot.

 

 

[Gnarly Gnu]

OK that's not working. CFI says won't recognise or accept the GA BAK.

 

 

[Acky]

Gnu,

 

I'd just do the RAA BAK. He won't charge you to do it.. Do the GA BAK at a later date when the extra work is more applicable.

 

I was a bit nervous about the BAK, but it wasn't an issue at all.

 

Cheers,

 

Acky.

 

 

[sseeker]

Hi,

 

That's not right, the GA BAK is accepted through RA-Aus and you should probably speak to the Operations Manager and get him to write a letter/email to your CFI so he will accept it in the future.

 

-Andrew

 

 

[Gnarly Gnu]

Thanks Andrew, I'm not sure how to put it but lets say GA is bad and I think that may go down not so well....

 

After talking to a few different folk in aviation I'm slowly starting to get the drift. SAAA mocks RAA, RAA scorns GA, GA ridicules RAA, everyone hates CASA and it's like the whole industry needs to see a shrink. [exasperation]

 

 

[Bryon]

Thanks Andrew, I'm not sure how to put it but lets say GA is bad and I think that may go down not so well....After talking to a few different folk in aviation I'm slowly starting to get the drift. SAAA mocks RAA, RAA scorns GA, GA ridicules RAA, everyone hates CASA and it's like the whole industry needs to see a shrink. [exasperation]

Only if the shrink can be part of the class 2 medical

 

 

[Guest davidh10]

Thanks Andrew, I'm not sure how to put it but lets say GA is bad and I think that may go down not so well....After talking to a few different folk in aviation I'm slowly starting to get the drift. SAAA mocks RAA, RAA scorns GA, GA ridicules RAA, everyone hates CASA and it's like the whole industry needs to see a shrink. [exasperation]

Fortunately, it is not the associations, but rather just a small percentage of individuals. If we all refuse to accept these illogical prejudices, then it will slowly die out, even if it takes until the individuals concerned die out!

 

Also, some of it is just FUD (Fear, Uncertainty, Doubt), which is a marketing / sales tool used by those whose product has little to offer or differentiate itself or who lack the skills to market their own product or who are just lazy.

 

 

[facthunter]

Shrink part of a class 2 medical. Perish the thought Byron. Actually it already IS. Your DAME is supposed to report any weird things you do, like manic depressive etc

 

About the various groups......... Unfortunately plenty of individuals DO bag other groups. Pilots do that and always have.. IF you are confident of your choice, don't let it bother you. I keep saying we should all work for a common goal and we would get further. Is anybody listening? Nev

 

 

[sseeker]

Like Nev and David said, GA isn't bad, it's the percentage of individuals in GA that have there heads you know where... I've had a commercial pilot tell me that I was 'breaking the rules' because I was flying without an OAT Gauge when infact you only need them for charter/air work (other than RA-Aus flight training). It makes you wonder why people knock the RA-Aus syllabus for being under developed when a CPL holder doesn't know basic air law... And just FYI the RA-Aus syllabus is basically the PPL syllabus modified for ultralights. Sorry for wondering a bit off topic but in the end, don't avoid GA because there's a few tossers around, RA-Aus has some as well! I would seriously recommend the GA BAK as it's more complex with the weight/performance section.

 

Regards,

 

Andrew

 

 

[eastmeg2]

Speaking of OAT, that's one of the joys, or curses, of the open cockpit.

 

I've had my ambient temperature gauge read as low as -10c and I didn't need the gauge to tell me it was frigging cold.

 

 

[pudestcon]

Speaking of OAT, that's one of the joys, or curses, of the open cockpit.I've had my ambient temperature gauge read as low as -10c and I didn't need the gauge to tell me it was frigging cold.

Same.

 

My OAT gauge is my nose!!

 

Pud