Devices and plans for pilots

[Guest Ausflyer512]

Casa recently came to town and the main take-home message for me was get yourself an iPad2 for flight planning and navigation. In my new RV-12 I can get a hinged bracket to mount the tablet in front of the map box door, and angle it towards the pilot.

 

I know there are lots of aussie pilots with runs on the board in the electronic devices field. I really need a fresh perspective to decide devices and phone/data plans to group with a iPad2 and a fairly new PC laptop running Windows 7. I don’t use my mobile much, and I have started to use skype a lot more for long distance phone calls. I use the laptop as my home computer, a lot for web surfing, travelling and downloading from the Dynon 180 in the aircraft. I do use wifi at home for my laptop and visitors devices

 

My plan A is to buy a smartphone with GPS and Telstra nextG network access (HTC Wildfire S); and possibly can my fixed phone. But I will still need to rent a fixed phone line, I think.

 

The hard part I find is sorting out the plans and providers. Bearing in mind that I am a small volume user, can anybody recommend a combination of plans and providers to cover the fixed line rental, ISP, calls and data for the smartphone, and data for the iPad2?

 

Another nagging question I can’t sort out is the necessity for pilots to have Telstra next G service for outback flying. What have you found?

 

Any advice will be greatly appreciated.

 

Rod

 

 

[goflying]

Hi Rod,

 

Can't help with any of your questions but the only thing i can say about the phone is to make sure it's next gG compatable and not just 3G. I recently had to upgrade my phone when i switched to telstra next G , bought a 3G smart phone outright for only $190 only to find out later that next G works on it's own frequency so then i had to buy another one on the next G network.

 

Frank

 

 

[Tonym]

Hi

 

I have an iPhone which I bought outright and I use a TPG SIM (Optus network but cheap as chips). I pay $14.99 per month for 1GB data and heaps of phone calls and never crack the included value. I also use them for home phone and internet and find them ok but you need to look at the plans to see if it makes sense for you. Whirlpool is a pretty good source of information.

 

For flying, I use an iPad and I have a Telstra NextG prepaid SIM for when I am going out into the serious boonies. 1GB prepaid costs $20 and it lasts for a month. You don't need to renew at all. Just pay when you need it. NextG is a ripping network. We were emailing from 5000 ft in the middle of absolutely nowhere.

 

But I find that if you're flying in more populated areas with towns or highways around, the Optus network is fine. I can tether the iPhone to the iPad via bluetooth for those kinds of trips and use the TPG plan's included data. I don't worry about using the NextG at all.

 

Not sure if that is the kind of information you wanted. YMMV.

 

 

[sseeker]

Watch that, just some things to think about.

 

 

-Andrew

 

 

[Tex]

Hi Rod, sry long post follows...

 

This is the set up I would recommend: If you can get rid of your fixed line at home then do so... you may need it if you are on ADSL connection, I would not have one but for the family need (daughter and wife).

 

Get the iPhone from Telstra on the Next G network, check your usage and get what ever plan will cover it, the one I use is on a $99 dollar a month plan which gets you $1200 in calls and texts, Unlimited text messages to standard aussie number and 2.5GB of data (though I transferred from a business plan and for some reason I get 5gb a month). I can get lots of that back on tax

 

Get the iPad 3g but DO NOT get another plan for 3g access. You tether your iPhone to your iPad ('Personal hotspot' they call it now) and your iPhone data allowance is used for your iPad internet access... the iPhone becomes the iPads modem, I am actually on this set up now but on my Laptop PC, works on any bluetooth (or line) connection. You also need the 3G iPad as it has the built in GPS, the WiFi only one does not have the GPS inbuilt, requiring after market purchase.

 

Buy OzRunways... absolutely AWESOME app. Still could do with some development in Flight Planning and available Nav screens but it is 98% there already. get NAIPS App it does ... well... NAIPS! Get Dial-a-Wis app. I also have an App called 'Co-Pilot' I got this because it has a pretty good flight planning function with weather update to your flight plans, all ICAO field identifiers are in there (though being a US app I am not sure where the weather comes from, though it does generally reflect NAIPS, kinda sorta reflect NAIPS), it is not very intuitive to program but once you sort it out it is not so hard. It has a very simple and easy to see Compass/Nav screen which you really need on the iPhone.

 

Ozrunways is not real good on the iPhone because of screen size... not the programs problem... it is still usable just harder to see, but I used my iPhone (with those apps) ONLY as my GPS Nav and weather device from Tara to out near Cameron's Corner over a weeks flying...in a Drifter... only two problems I had: one when my iPhone was sitting in the sun for quite a while as I messed around getting ready for flight and it went into thermal shut down. As soon as I got airborne it cooled and fired right up again. Co-Pilot 'froze' once or twice, turned the App off and restarted... all good. Sending text messages while flying was available almost EVERY mile flown. Could listen to music with auto-mute activating when the radio fired up, make phone calls too though not worth it open cockpit:blah blah:. I am contemplating the iPad as well now. I have flown with them in other aircraft (and one of our crew used it in a Drifter on that trip) as they are really needed to get full functionality from OzRunways. I could have a 'glass cockpit' Drifter in the future

 

As for the Garmin comparison: buy a glare screen shield for the iPad and I never had any faults with GPS locks. You can't use your Garmin to surf the web and check your e-mails... while away (if you really WANT too). The weather on OzRunways has BOM radar...

 

 

[Tex]

Hi again Rod,

 

Just reread my post... may not have been too clear at one point, but you will be able to use your laptop PC at home (or anywhere) by connecting to the internet via your iPhone as well, assuming you have decent NextG service, so with the right plan you can ditch your home phone fixed line AND internet service and just have your mobile phone plan ... you will probably be saving money doing this...

 

 

[JG3]

Another nagging question I can’t sort out is the necessity for pilots to have Telstra next G service for outback flying. What have you found?

Any advice will be greatly appreciated.

 

Rod

I've done email business with a fella in Canada by my iPhone while flying at 5500ft over the Petermann Range 50nm west of Uluru, no problem. Amazing! Telstra NextG is the only way to go.

 

JG

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Just to sort of clarify what sort of phones you need to buy to work with your carrier.

 

Telstra uses 850 and 2100Mhz for their network. Optus and Vodafone use the 900 and 2100Mhz. The 850 and 900Mhz is designed for long range reception and 2100Mhz is designed for penetrating buildings.

 

Apple products originally only supported 850 and 2100Mhz. Since the iphone 4 and ipad 2 now support the 900 Mhz frequency.

 

Nearly all the 3G android devices support the 900 and 2100Mhz frequencies.

 

Larger the phone, the larger the aerial.

 

You can now also buy a 3G to wifi devices now to use your laptop.

 

Also some of the newer phones support "tethering" and "hot spotting" which allows you to use the phone as a modem either as a tethered USB device or as a wifi "hot spot". iphones require your telco to unlock the tethering function.

 

 

[Tex]

iphones require your telco to unlock the tethering function.

Good point FT...

I don't think Telstra require anything to be unlocked with their iPhone, it just works...(could be wrong but pretty sure it is good to go) Telstra also do not charge to use tethering... Optus do, at least $10 extra a month, not sure about other carriers.

 

 

[JG3]

Good point FT...I don't think Telstra require anything to be unlocked with their iPhone, it just works...(could be wrong but pretty sure it is good to go) Telstra also do not charge to use tethering....

My early iPhone works easily for tethering, just turn 'Tethering' on in 'Settings' and enable it on the PC. No charge.

 

JG

 

 

[Guest davidh10]

While there's some great apps out there, just be cautious of whether they constitute a "legal source" of the primary information for flying (weather, notams, navigation). Some are and some are not. For example, NAIPS is legal regardless of what you use it on, but Yahoo Weather is not a legal source for aviation weather reports.

 

All data you use as a primary source must be on the device, not dependent on network access. To use NAIPS as an example, you could look up the weather and notams via a browser, but need to save the information in a local file for it to be legal. I do that with my HTC Desire phone, saving it to a note type application, so it is available until manually deleted.

 

Telstra NextG is the way to go if you go regional or off the beaten track, as their network does have the widest coverage. Only Telstra works at Temora, for example.

 

CASA's official musings on what constitutes a legal EFB are rather onerous, albeit that they verbally seem happy for you to carry aircraft manuals, ERSA and similar on an electronic device.

 

IMHO, moving electronic, with semi-automated updates will be a safety benefit in the longer term. I recently saw a pilot flying on a 2002 edition ERSA. Didn't even have the right runways or CTAF frequency for an AD he flew out of and later had to return to, due to poor weather.

 

 

[goflying]

Just to sort of clarify what sort of phones you need to buy to work with your carrier.Telstra uses 850 and 2100Mhz for their network. Optus and Vodafone use the 900 and 2100Mhz. The 850 and 900Mhz is designed for long range reception and 2100Mhz is designed for penetrating buildings.

Apple products originally only supported 850 and 2100Mhz. Since the iphone 4 and ipad 2 now support the 900 Mhz frequency.

 

Nearly all the 3G android devices support the 900 and 2100Mhz frequencies.

 

Larger the phone, the larger the aerial.

 

You can now also buy a 3G to wifi devices now to use your laptop.

 

Also some of the newer phones support "tethering" and "hot spotting" which allows you to use the phone as a modem either as a tethered USB device or as a wifi "hot spot". iphones require your telco to unlock the tethering function.

That is correct FT but it must be on the UMTS/HSDPA frequency band not on the GSM band otherwise it will only work on the 2G network as i discovered. just simply look for a phone that has Quad band 3G and you should be right.

 

Frank

 

 

[Guest Ausflyer512]

Thanks for the comprehensive advice. It has made sense of several concepts I found only confusing info on. I plan to get the iPad and iPhone, and start with a TPG plan, and next-G prepaid cards as required. Tethering seems to be the way popular with to go. Tex, thanks for your long post. The software and apps recommended are on the button according to local users. the only grey area for me is the cost of tethering but I will soom sort that out. And Frank, I'll look for the quad band 3g so all the frequencies are covered

 

Many thanks for your comments and advice.

 

Rod

 

 

[P4D]

<snip> All data you use as a primary source must be on the device, not dependent on network access.

Hello David

 

Can you please advise where this is stated and by who.

 

If we are all going to use EFB's we need some clear unequivocal statement from the appropriate authority as to the legal requirements as well as the operational requirements of using these devices. Something I have not been able to discover to date.

 

Technical advancements have raced ahead of the regulators and the genie is out of the bag. Navigating with a moving map on a personal device is making flying safer and reduces the mental task load significantly.

[jerrajerra]

Hi Rod,.......make sure it's next gG compatable and not just 3G........

Frank

And possibly avoid purchasing 4G if travelling to regional centres as many do not have 4G capability/reception but they can get nextG (my town for example).

 

Chris

 

 

[Guest davidh10]

Sorry, P4D. I usually provide a reference when I post something like that, but didn't have the time to search for it again. Even today, I am unable to access that part of the CASA web site, so cannot provide a direct link to the document to which I was originally referring. I did provide a link to the current Casa project information which shows that they are actively reviewing the situation of EFBs and the rules surrounding them.

My response is composed of information from several sources:-

 

1. CASA Airworthiness Bulletin 00-017 dated 18-May-2010 "Electronic Flight Bag".
    
    
   
2. I have questioned CASA Safety Advisors on this subject, personally. (They specifically rule out data that is reliant on network access).
    
    
   
3. VFRG (references the regulations that ) and AIP specify authorised sources of weather and navigation information.
    
    
   

 

 

Separately, CASA have some safety posters that focus on these sorts of issues:-

 

• "Check the Data is it Approved"
   
   
  
• "Don't let the GPS Fly You" (Can't find that one on CASA site, but it's in the flying school hangar)
   
   
  

 

 

If you think about it, it is just common sense. While there's a lot personal electronic and computing equipment these days and a bunch of apparently useful apps:-

 

• who has certified them?
   
   
  
• how reliable are they?
   
   
  
• network access is the least reliable link in the chain and is variable with location as well.
   
   
  

 

 

There are some subtler aspects too. For instance just because I may license Airservices maps and put them in an application that can be accessed on a personal electronic device, does not make it legal to use them for flight planning or actual flights. It comes down to "authorised suppliers" of the information. If I was to just take the PDF maps supplied by Airservices and place them on my phone, for instance, then the source of information is Airservices and that is ok. If however I processed the map information in some way to improve the presentation and utility on my phone, then I become the supplier of the information and to use it I would also need to be an authorised source of that information.

 

This is the reason that, for instance, all the plain language weather translation services are a good tool for learning, but not legal for flight planning or flight use.

 

I'd suggest you read the CASA Airworthiness Bulletin 00-017, but it seems to be unavailable on the CASA site, so I've attached it here.

 

EFB.pdf

 

EFB.pdf

 

EFB.pdf

[P4D]

Sorry, P4D. I usually provide a reference when I post something like that....Thanks for the great reply and the trouble you took to get the link for me David.

 

I will read great with interest.

 

I am coming from a compliance angle and wish there was a single authority who could clarify the opinions and point to regulatory requirements that are specific and quantifable.