Hi from Hokianga, New Zealand.

[Micko]

I'm a recently retired ex teacher seeking to take up a new hobby. I'd love to get comments comparing the merits and demerits of WSC (Flexwing) versus 3-axis microlights for recreational and cross-country flying.

 

 

[robinsm]

Hey Micko, Where in the Hokianga?, I am from Kaikohe. Good to see some northerners signing up. Wouldn't the scenery be better at KeriKeri during training?

 

 

[seb7701]

Hi Micko and welcome.

 

First up, I can't help you with an opinion on weight shift, however 3 axis training will certainly open the door to a wide variety of aircraft types and allows you to switch and change as you please. I kicked off in a Drifter (and still would rather fly them than anything), but it made flying the likes of Jabirus and Tecnams largely a non-event. Learning on the high drag, low inertia types does make you a better pilot in my opinion, and that includes weight shift I guess!

 

P.S. I'm jealous - love NZ and would happily move there I think! Best flight ever was with Ruth at U fly Wanaka!

 

 

[trikepilot]

Snap! I was born in Rawene in The Hokianga and am also semi retired teacher .I achieved my pilots licence at Otamatea Aeroclub in a Cessna 172 (1990 ) Then about 13 years ago I bought and learnt to fly a trike. I still have it and also have a bantam ultralight. I actually have them both up for sale now but still fly them both. I like them both but I got to say I am more confident with the trike . I am a 61 yr young female too. However the trike is more challenging in rough weather and for crosswind landings as Dave will testify! By the way he has just completed his book and it is for sale. I met Dave when he was in Bali. I happened to be there at the same time. Bonus! A benefit of the trike is you can pack it up and trailer it which is what I did 10 years ago and took it around Australia.

 

 

[Micko]

Hi Guys,

 

Thanks for all the advice. There is much to consider. I guess I worry that a flexwing can get into an irrecoverable tumble. Trikepilot what is it makes you more confident with your trike than with Bantam. Incidentally I live in Kohokohu.

 

 

[Micko]

Hi Robinsm, I'm on the north side, Kohukohu. Is that a Bantam in your photo? Where do you fly from?.

 

 

[Deskpilot]

G'day Micko, here's another welcome to the world of aviation. Whilst you're still in the 'which type' debate, don't over look gyros. They're no more dangerous that Trikes and can come fully enclosed. With a jump start, you don't really need a runway either. Not every ones cup of tea, but worth investigating.

 

As for fixed wing, I always liked the look of the Snark. NZ design. Not sure if they're still being made. Were a bit pricey as I recall.

 

 

[Micko]

Thanks for that, Doug. I always thought gyros were cool, but I suspect they're a bit outside my price rang. The only ones I've seen for sale that I could afford are single seaters, and definitely don't have jump take off ability. Otherwise I'd almost certainly go for one.

 

Regards, Micko.

 

 

[farri]

G`Day Micko and .

 

Trying to compare Trikes with 3 axis aircraft,is like comparing apples to oranges.

 

There are various makes and modles of trikes as there are many different types and designs of 3 axis fixed wing.

 

Each aircraft is designed to meet a particular requirement and is neither better or worse than the other, simply different.

 

The first thing to do is to decide exactly what it is you wish to do and what you expect of the aircraft then look for an AC that meets your requirements.

 

Frank.

 

Ps, You will get many different opinions from both Trike and 3 axis pilots on which is the best aircraft......I`ve tried both and choose 3 axis!

 

 

[Guest Crezzi]

They're no more dangerous that Trikes and can come fully enclosed.

I'm sure you meant to say that they are just as safe as Trike's or fixed-wing aircraft

 

I guess I worry that a flexwing can get into an irrecoverable tumble.

Trikes DON'T just get into irrecoverable tumbles by themselves - just like fixed-wing aircraft don't get into spins by themselves. Good training in awareness / avoidance is the key (in both cases).

Cheers

 

John

 

 

[trikepilot]

Hi Guys,Thanks for all the advice. There is much to consider. I guess I worry that a flexwing can get into an irrecoverable tumble. Trikepilot what is it makes you more confident with your trike than with Bantam. Incidentally I live in Kohokohu.

An ultralight can also crash and tumble upside down if it has a bad landing not just trikes . But on the matter of trikes I once had to land in bad conditions ie strong crosswinds with very short runway(250metres) never been on it before. Got down but didnt think I would pull up before the fence so tried to steer out of it but had too much momentum and trike lifted up on the side and wiped out my prop. wing and wheel spat! But walked away from it! I have been flying my trike for about 12 years and done over 250 hours whereas my ultralight only done about 40 hours! I did my GA licence in a Cessna 172 in Nz about 6 years before learning to fly the trike. My trike is Australian made Airborne model and is a 2 stroke Rotax . I met a guy (forgotten his name) he lived in Whangarei and had one of the Italian ambibian trikes! Kohukohu eh? Just across the harbour from Rawene! :) Trike flying there are less dials to worry about In fact I hardly use them now. Trike flying is more about feel etc. Only have throttle and control bar to think about No flaps! Judgement is crucial though for landing flare. Great also for photography!

 

 

[trikepilot]

Hi Guys,Thanks for all the advice. There is much to consider. I guess I worry that a flexwing can get into an irrecoverable tumble. Trikepilot what is it makes you more confident with your trike than with Bantam. Incidentally I live in Kohokohu.

I have been trying to post a photo So not sure which picture you mean?? I am having trouble navigating this site. I'm trying to reply to Trevr but cant find the reply button for his comment

 

 

[trikepilot]

Hi Robinsm, I'm on the north side, Kohukohu. Is that a Bantam in your photo? Where do you fly from?.

I live in Western Australia Recently was lucky enough to have my own private runway and hangar but have recently sold the property. Have just relocated to a place called Bindoon north of Perth where flying is only allowed weekends because during the week it is in a controlled military zone! The bantam is at a airport 2 hours south of here.

 

 

[Micko]

Kia ora tatou (Hi everybody),

 

Thanks for all your replies. I'm none the wiser, except that it's obvious there are aficionados of both WSC and 3axis (gyros, too). So I guess I shall have fun finding out for myself which category I want to join.

 

 

[robinsm]

Hi Micko, I am now living in Goulburn in NSW. The aircraft is an Xair standard. 2 stroke 582 rotax powered. Pity the airfeild at Kaikohe is now private as it was built by the yanks in ww2 as an emergency feild, has 1 main and 2 cross grass all weather runways. It used to be a public airport and was regularly serviced by NAC (now Air NZ) with DC3's and then Focker friendships untill it closed. One of the controllers of the airfield was "bunny" Findlay (around the early 1960's). It was widely used as a training strip, and a lot of the locals used to fly model aircraft there. I believe a gliding club now has it.

 

 

[robinsm]

Hey trikepilot, remember Rawene well. Did quite a bit of work at the Rawene hospital when I worked for a kaikohe firm as an electrician. Small world huh!

 

 

[trikepilot]

Hey trikepilot, remember Rawene well. Did quite a bit of work at the Rawene hospital when I worked for a kaikohe firm as an electrician. Small world huh!

Hey hubby is an electrician but not a Kiwi or a pilot LOL!. what year were you there??

 

 

[trikepilot]

Hi Micko and welcome.First up, I can't help you with an opinion on weight shift, however 3 axis training will certainly open the door to a wide variety of aircraft types and allows you to switch and change as you please. I kicked off in a Drifter (and still would rather fly them than anything), but it made flying the likes of Jabirus and Tecnams largely a non-event. Learning on the high drag, low inertia types does make you a better pilot in my opinion, and that includes weight shift I guess!

 

P.S. I'm jealous - love NZ and would happily move there I think! Best flight ever was with Ruth at U fly Wanaka!

Haven't been pilot in command of a drifter but been a pax in one and I recckon the experience would be one of the closest for a 3 axis to be like a trike! eg wind in the face etc!

 

 

[Guest davidh10]

Kia ora tatou (Hi everybody),Thanks for all your replies. I'm none the wiser, except that it's obvious there are aficionados of both WSC and 3axis (gyros, too). So I guess I shall have fun finding out for myself which category I want to join.

Welcome Micko.

You have hit the nail on the head. Only you can decide what will suit you best. 4-stroke powered aircraft usually have greater range and lower fuel consumption than 2-strokes, but are also a much higher initial cost. If you take the total cost of ownership into consideration, 4-stroke will win in the end. Gee; I could start world war three with comments like that!

 

As you can guess from the Avatar, I fly a trike and just love it for enjoyment and as a photographic platform. I have to endorse Frank's comments.

 

...Trying to compare Trikes with 3 axis aircraft,is like comparing apples to oranges...

Perhaps one thing to put trikes in perspective is to understand that they are "the motorbikes of the sky", but you really have to experience both to make the decision for yourself.

Just because a trike does not have empennage or ailerons and flaps, and thus has simpler controls, does not mean that you don't need to acquire skill to fly them. They are different, and some different considerations come into play. The key, in either case, is a good and experienced instructor.

 

You mentioned an "unrecoverable tumble", which is a description given to the situation when someone tries to fly one inverted, however don't think that 3-axis ultralight aircraft will survive being flown inverted either, as there is a very high risk of structural failure. Recreational aircraft are not designed for the stresses and forces involved in aerobatics. I cannot imagine a well designed trike entering a "tumble" without the pilot having put it there, unless of course you fly it into a towering cumulus or thunder storm. Nobody wants to do that in a 3-axis either, as the forces in such weather conditions can cause structural failure in much bigger aircraft.

 

If you want to see the camera view of encountering some heavy clear air turbulence in a trike, have a look towards the end of

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4g1l3OgUI9w. Keep in mind that the camera is gyro stabilised. During the heavy turbulence, we were experiencing G forces from the resultant flight path displacements. While quite unpleasant, at no time did I feel that I was in danger of losing control of the aircraft.

 

Enjoy the journey...

 

 

[farri]

Very nice Vidio, David!

 

Frank.

 

 

[Guest davidh10]

Thanks Frank.

 

It takes a lot of editing and I'm still learning, through feedback, what is interesting to non-pilots, as well. At the time I shot that video, I was still doing R&D on the camera mount to try and eliminate engine vibration. After that video, I introduced damping to reduce the bounce in the mount.