What to look for? (fabric covered wings)

[Guest Howard Hughes]

Hello learned friends,

 

As someone who has almost zero experience with cloth covered aircraft, what are some of the traps when looking to purchase this type of aircraft? (X-Air, Drifter, Flightstar, etc)

 

How frequent are the inspections on the fabric, do they have a timed/calendar life, or is it just on inspection? Clearly it would be best kept hangared, but what if you were to keep it outside? Would the deterioration be exponentially worse, or only marginally worse? Would the cost of hangarage be greater than the cost of new skins every x years?

 

Any other experience with purchasing this class of aircraft would also be most welcome, what other things do I need to look out for?

 

Cheers,

 

Mark (aka HH).

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

All interesting questions there mark, generally if you were purchasing a used rag wing you would need to establish two things. How old are the skins ?....And how much sun have they been exposed to ? (IE: outside storage ?). Then basically you are going on actual condition of the skins themselves. One way of testing is; can you poke your finger through a faded portion easily ?,.... but a more accurate way is to use a fabric tester, which leaves a small hole after the reading is done. You may have to search for someone who has one of these, but they are around.

 

Continuous outside storage is not an option in my book, as you are also then exposing it to rain, wind etc. and the fade rate would be at a much greater rate than if it were hangared.

 

To renew the skins on most aircraft each year would not be practicable. You would be spending at least a month on most types on the ground changing wing skins.

 

Generally most skins will last between 6-10 years if kept out of the sun.

 

You must be very vigilant when looking at used aircraft however. If you get stuck with a weakened set of skins you will have no choice but to renew them at some cost.............................................................Maj...

 

 

[Guest Andys@coffs]

Yeah, I agree with Major, inI dont believe that outside storage is an option for any fabric covered plane, where the fabric is exposed to UV/Sunlight. And teh instrument to test the fabric is called a betsometer (not sure if that spelling is correct but a quick google search will sort that out) anyway as I understand they puncture the fabric with a needle and then measure force applied sideways. shouldnt rip with an applied force, crap fabric will rip and therefore destructuive testing :<)

 

Andy

 

 

[dazza 38]

There was a video on here a few weeks ago showing a Fabric testing Tool.EAA video I think it was.Cant remember which Gent loaded it on here.

 

PS- www.eaavideo.org is the site

 

 

[Tomo]

Dopped and painted Ceconite will last a surprisingly longtime though.

 

 

[Guest Howard Hughes]

Thanks all so far, how would sellers view it if a potential buyer wanted to test the fabric? I'm not sure I would be too happy if it were my aircraft, or would an 'expert' be able to tell just by a visual inspection?

 

 

[Guest Andys@coffs]

There is another test, something about using your nail and looking for fibre damage......but at the end of the day the Betsometer test is the definitive test and selling an RAA Aircraft requires an aircraft condition report to enable the rego change, so I cant see how it can be sold without the test being done....... Major?

 

Andy

 

 

[icebob]

Hi,

 

It would depend on the seller and how they feel about the sale. If a Betsometer fails the test area then it is unsafe for flight, would you as a potential buyer feel good if the seller flew it and "went in" because of failed fabric. I would want someone to tell me long before takeoff. The test can be done in corners anyway and the small dimple goes of a passed test in four to six weeks anyway.

 

You can get the Betometer new from that well known Australian trike company for about $40 plus post.

 

The EAA video is a good one to explane the process and the publication he quotes on the video is a free download from EAA and other sources anyway.

 

Bob.

 

 

[Guest Howard Hughes]

Thanks Bob.

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

Yes as Icebob mentioned, you can always find an out of the way spot to do the test/s, and I doubt if anyone would notice then anyway unless they knew where to look.

 

It is really up to the seller to justify wether the skins are ok or not . It is he trying to sell the aeroplane afterall. if he's not prepared to do the tests then you would assum that they'll need replacement, and then reduce the sale amount accordingly.

 

Yes a level 2 needs to sign a UACR for the sale, but once again it is mearly a condition report, for RAAus internal use...NOT a guarantee of airworthiness. That is clearly stated at the top of the form.

 

A reputable L2 will certainly show some interest in the skin condition, and note that in the report.There is however no requirement for him to perform a skin check for the UACR, other than to report condition. He may state " wingskin appear old, no fabric test performed, may need replacement soon"....that would satisfy the requirement of the UACR..........................................................Maj...

 

 

[Riley]

There is another test, something about using your nail and looking for fibre damage......but at the end of the day the Betsometer test is the definitive test and selling an RAA Aircraft requires an aircraft condition report to enable the rego change, so I cant see how it can be sold without the test being done....... Major?Andy

Andy

Curiously (is that a word?) , there is provision in an RAA Aircraft Condition Report for recording Bettsometer readings of the flying surface fabrics on a weightshift wing (95-32) but no specific requirement to do so with any other category of registration. Common sense (both from a vendor's and/or purchaser's viewpoint) dictates that the test should be performed and recorded at least at every 100 hourly even if the aircraft is normally hangared. As the Major says, tieing down outside, even short term, is to be avoided if at all posssible. Cheers Riley

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

You may of course view an UACR form on the RAAus website under maintenance or inspection forms.

 

The actual item pertaining to wing skins or other fabric coverings is ;...

 

'Airframe coverings for strength, wear and damage'...........Inspect ? Yes/No Comment

 

It could also be considered to be included in...........General condition of aircraft ?......................Comment