Circuits in the Jabiru LSA 55

[HeadInTheClouds]

 

Filmed this months ago, only just got around to editing it and putting it on youtube yesterday. Didn't know it at the time but this is my last lesson in the Jabiru LSA 55, and last lesson with my instructor/flying school before they closed down.

 

Decided to take a break from the flying now, probably for a few years until I have the time and am actually living in the one place. Have been considering putting it off for a while now and the fact I don't have a flying school now made the decision for me. Plus it would be expensive seeing as I would have to spend money getting used to a whole new aircraft again, then I would need to build the 5 hour solo I need.

 

I will probably still fly sporadically every now and then, but nothing regular.

 

 

[Deskpilot]

First, some nice landings there Jake, but................................get your engine /ignition checks done off the runway. Suppose that ambulance was wanting to go or was coming it. It certainly doesn't want to wait for you or your checks.

 

Did the engine actually stop on your last landing? If so, why?

 

 

[HeadInTheClouds]

First, some nice landings there Jake, but................................get your engine /ignition checks done off the runway. Suppose that ambulance was wanting to go or was coming it. It certainly doesn't want to wait for you or your checks.Did the engine actually stop on your last landing? If so, why?

There was no other traffic in the circuit, on the ground, or inbound when we lined up that first time, plus the wind was around 10 knots right down the runway so we did the checks quickly then, rather than at 90 degrees to the wind. And yes it did stop after the last landing - probably because it was such a rough landing I assume.

 

 

[facthunter]

Any how Jake if you can handle that slippery little baby you won't have much worry when you come back with most others. Nev

 

 

[Tomo]

Nice one Jake.

 

Let me know if you're ever passing through Toowoomba or Dalby and I'll take you for a fly.

 

 

[Gnarly Gnu]

Decided to take a break from the flying now, probably for a few years....

Didn't you get an RA-Aus scholarship HITC.... is that completed? Or maybe I am thinking of someone else.

 

Looks like a lot of fun in the '55.

 

 

[HeadInTheClouds]

Didn't you get an RA-Aus scholarship HITC.... is that completed? Or maybe I am thinking of someone else.Looks like a lot of fun in the '55.

Yes that was me, got one for 1k. Ended up using it just getting used to the Jab, and in trying to go solo which involved flying to Grafton first due to the tower at Coffs. Didn't even end up going solo, wasn't feeling up to it on the day.

 

 

[Gnarly Gnu]

I'm wondering if there is an inherent problem with training in aircraft like the LSA 55 which is known to have a few quirks that take time to get used to as compared to say learning in a Gazelle or a Foxbat initially at least. You don't come across as enthusiastic about flying as you used to which is sad but I understand the time / cost pressures when you are young in particular. Others here more knowledgeable in '55's like Thirsty may well disagree with me of course.

 

 

[facthunter]

I think it's a much more difficult an aircraft to handle in critical conditions than the two you mention. The Gazelle is ridiculously easy to fly and is very forgiving. It's almost too easy to fly in that some people coming off it onto something else, lose confidence.. Experienced pilots or those that own the plane get used to the LSA 55 and enjoy the experience of flying it. I don't think It would be my choice of initial trainer, today. Nev

 

 

[HeadInTheClouds]

I'm wondering if there is an inherent problem with training in aircraft like the LSA 55 which is known to have a few quirks that take time to get used to as compared to say learning in a Gazelle or a Foxbat initially at least. You don't come across as enthusiastic about flying as you used to which is sad but I understand the time / cost pressures when you are young in particular. Others here more knowledgeable in '55's like Thirsty may well disagree with me of course.

I think I have to agree with you there. I spent about 5 hours in the Jabiru after finishing up with flying the Foxbat and only just started to feel like I would be able to manage solo and now I'll have to get used to something else. I definitely don't enjoy flying as much as I used to actually, it seems like in the LSA flying was more of a chore as you always had to be focused on what the plane is doing, keeping the ball in the centre and making sure it is actually doing what you want it to etc, especially doing circuits. Hopefully when I eventually come back to flying to finish of my cert I will be able to find a school with a bit more user-friendly aircraft, and one that is more stable so to speak so the risk of having to suddenly change planes will be lower.

 

 

[Tomo]

Are you still in Coffs Jake?

 

 

[cooperplace]

I think I have to agree with you there. I spent about 5 hours in the Jabiru after finishing up with flying the Foxbat and only just started to feel like I would be able to manage solo and now I'll have to get used to something else. I definitely don't enjoy flying as much as I used to actually, it seems like in the LSA flying was more of a chore as you always had to be focused on what the plane is doing, keeping the ball in the centre and making sure it is actually doing what you want it to etc, especially doing circuits. Hopefully when I eventually come back to flying to finish of my cert I will be able to find a school with a bit more user-friendly aircraft, and one that is more stable so to speak so the risk of having to suddenly change planes will be lower.

I'm currently training in one of these and I really like it. Yes, it's been said, if you can fly one of these you can fly anything, but I feel I'm learning lots of good habits from the Jab. Of course I can't say how learning in a Foxbat/Gazelle/whatever might compare. I strongly believe however that the quality of the instructor, and the rapport you build with them, is critically important; again in this regard I feel I'm very fortunate: my instructor is great.

 

 

[HeadInTheClouds]

Are you still in Coffs Jake?

Moved to Armidale for uni so only in Coffs sporadically now

 

 

[Tomo]

Ah yep, remember that now, friend of mine lives in Coffs, will have to time a visit one day.

 

 

[Thirsty]

I would always agree the lsa is hard to get used to. If you look back at my early posts you'll see the trouble I had! I learnt to fly in a 152 in the late 80's and eventually gave up flying partially because it got boring. I agree that the lsa isn't really the best platform to learn on but I've found in my 60 hours or so of instructing that it's not the aircrafts habits that cause the problems but the students interpretations or lack of that cause problems ie I can't tell you how many times I've said to a student push left rudder and they push the right!

 

I reckon training in the lsa probably adds about 10% to the amount of time taken to get to solo. I had a young guy do his training full time and he was soloed at about 9 hours. Horses for courses probably and some, like me, prefer the lsa cause the challenge makes flying more fun.

 

 

[Deskpilot]

As they say, if you can fly an LSA55, you can fly anything. It's a great little plane, ONCE YOU GET USED TO IT. Biggest difference, lead with your foot every time and forget you've got ailerons. Rather like early radio control models with rudder and throttle control only.

 

 

[Thirsty]

Gotta disagree with you there Doug. Most people I fly with tend to do exactly that and you end up flying out of balance. Stick and rudder together every time will get you turning nicely in balance with the lsa. The ailerons are so small you really need to get them in at the start of the turn if you want to make nice balanced turns.

 

 

[Deskpilot]

That's not what James, Neil and Doc taught me. Lead with the foot, keep the nose on the horizon with the elevator and use ailerons only to counter turbulence. Been so long since I've flown, I'll have to relearn anyway.

 

 

[Thirsty]

If we're talking about turning and not just flying straight and level it's definitely stick and rudder together which is how James taught me. Next time you fly give it a go and see what you reckon.

 

 

[facthunter]

Control, especially at lower speeds, is "limited" Don't waste what you have by having your controls "crossed". Leading by a small margin that may be almost imperceptible doesn't count really and don't overcontrol. Be precise with this plane. If you let it wallow around it won't go well. Nev

 

 

[turboplanner]

ONCE YOU GET USED TO IT

The point I've made a number of times is: the student should not be paying for the aircraft's quirks, unless he specifically wants to pay for the thrill of mastery or something like that.

 

Most people who learn to fly run out of money, so you have this treadmill of flying schools continually training new students but rarely making incremental gains which is a key part of a successful business.

 

The second phase where most schools get it back to front is when the student graduates is is now ready to take up a passenger on a trip, only to find there are so many issues, starting with the aircraft being booked for lessons, he must do a minimum number of hours per day etc, no organised hire programme.. and he slinks off an buys a boat.

 

 

[facthunter]

The thing is though, once you have "mastered" it ( and I use the word advisedly) you are a different pilot because of your experience. I base my judgement of "difficulty" on whether the instructor having sent someone off for early solo work would be quite apprehensive if the wind got gusty or stronger, if it had a bit of a crosswind component. With something like a Gazelle , Cherokee 140 , C-150 etc, it is pretty much a non event, getting it back on the ground. Nev

 

 

[turboplanner]

The thing is though, once you have "mastered" it ( and I use the word advisedly) you are a different pilot because of your experience. I base my judgement of "difficulty" on whether the instructor having sent someone off for early solo work would be quite apprehensive if the wind got gusty or stronger, if it had a bit of a crosswind component. With something like a Gazelle , Cherokee 140 , C-150 etc, it is pretty much a non event, getting it back on the ground. Nev

I'm suggesting students can learn the basics of flying much quicker if getting something back on the ground is a non-event.

 

That costs them thousands of dollars less.

 

If, with the basics under their belts they want to spend their dollars mastering a known difficult aircraft, they've done it with their eyes open.

 

I've seen the drop out ratio of people perfectly capable of learning to fly assuming they are screwing up when the piece of crap they are trying to fly runs out of rudder authority in a medium breeze, has adverse aileron roll that would do a brahma bull justice, and others who simply run out of cash, where a stable training aircraft would see them progressing week after week.