RAAus stopping membership

[Bandit12]

Sooner will always equal cheaper, irrespective of who said or did what (when the legal eagles get involved).

 

 

[David Isaac]

Guys, it never should have happened it is an abuse of power and process and has NO up side.

 

This must be resolved before the AGM otherwise I would imagine there will be a very active question time at the AGM which can only bring discredit to Board processes.

 

 

[shags_j]

AGM is at Gold Coast isn't it? I will definitely go to that.

 

 

[maddog]

I received this Email today

 

Very disturbing if true!

 

"I am writing to express my deep concern with the decision to refuse/defer Ian Baker’s (“IB”) RA-Aus membership application. This decision, which appears to have been initiated by Steve Runciman (“SR”) and Steve Tizzard (“ST”) acting in concert, is both repugnant and immature and appears to be a clumsy attempt to punish free speech. Further, it is poor and unusual behaviour which itself brings RA-Aus into disrepute and the supporters and perpetrators of this behaviour should offer their resignations.

 

Given that RA-Aus is the only body through which IB can fly recreational aircraft of the type he prefers, it is misguided to think that the delegated authority from CASA allows the RA-Aus Board and CEO to prevent someone from flying because they directed criticism at the organisation and/or its administration. I know I can write letters of complaint about CASA and its administration without fear of my GA licence being revoked.

 

I urge you to act immediately and encourage your fellow Board members to overturn this decision by circular resolution and grant IB membership. Should IB’s membership not be granted by COB 30 August 2012, I will lodge a formal complaint with CASA which will not only describe this clearly unconscionable conduct but will urge their intervention to conduct a formal review of RA-Aus administration, Board structure, Constitution and By-laws to ensure RA-Aus acts within the spirit of its delegated authority.

 

Note that I am not representing or acting for IB but am taking steps to ensure that this sort of grave injustice never happens again. Also note that there are other avenues to pursue to correct this injustice which will be done in parallel with the CASA complaint and, as you are aware, my background equips me with the skills needed to ensure a just outcome.

 

Regards"

 

 

[Admin]

This is really hotting up. My solicitor still hasn't received any reply from the RAAus to substantiate Steve Runciman's claims that I have the potential to bring RAAus into disrepute so they are currently not allowing me to rejoin RAAus so I can fly. Whilst his letter says that I can submit a written submission for the board to consider (to him personally), they have not provided any evidence to support their claim or anything of which I can reply to...very strange.

 

I also have been told that my Solicitor's letter up till last night STILL hadn't been given to the Board even though the Secretary (Paul Middleton) has had it for some time.

 

Meanwhile I am still not allowed to fly under the statement by Steve Runciman that I "have the potential to bring the RAAus into disrepute"...no evidence, no reasoning, no proof, no proper or formal investigation of any kind on anything at all.

 

This has also now been picked up by many with people blogging about it, groups discussing the complete and utter unfairness of it and that the RAAus can do this to anyone they feel like and when ever they want...even you!

 

A copy of a letter that a person, to whom I have no relationship with, has sent to the Vic board member:

 

From: Peter Gilmour

 

Sent: Monday, 27 August 2012 4:25 PM

 

To: xxx_goflying.com.au

 

Subject: Unconscionable Conduct

 

Dear Rod

 

I am writing to express my deep concern with the decision to refuse/defer Ian Baker’s (“IB”) RA-Aus membership application. This decision, which appears to have been initiated by Steve Runciman (“SR”) and Steve Tizzard (“ST”) acting in concert, is both repugnant and immature and appears to be a clumsy attempt to punish free speech. Further, it is poor and unusual behaviour which itself brings RA-Aus into disrepute and the supporters and perpetrators of this behaviour should offer their resignations.

 

Given that RA-Aus is the only body through which IB can fly recreational aircraft of the type he prefers, it is misguided to think that the delegated authority from CASA allows the RA-Aus Board and CEO to prevent someone from flying because they directed criticism at the organisation and/or its administration. I know I can write letters of complaint about CASA and its administration without fear of my GA licence being revoked.

 

I urge you to act immediately and encourage your fellow Board members to overturn this decision by circular resolution and grant IB membership. Should IB’s membership not be granted by COB 30 August 2012, I will lodge a formal complaint with CASA which will not only describe this clearly unconscionable conduct but will urge their intervention to conduct a formal review of RA-Aus administration, Board structure, Constitution and By-laws to ensure RA-Aus acts within the spirit of its delegated authority.

 

Note that I am not representing or acting for IB but am taking steps to ensure that this sort of grave injustice never happens again. Also note that there are other avenues to pursue to correct this injustice which will be done in parallel with the CASA complaint and, as you are aware, my background equips me with the skills needed to ensure a just outcome.

 

Regards

 

Peter Gilmour

 

------------------------------------

 

Also I was sent an email of an article that is going in an Aviation Newsletter about it as well:

 

Ian Baker: persona non grata?

 

Ian Baker runs the Recreational Flying Website. It is a registered business and he also sells pilot gear, but no one who knows Ian believes for a moment that he is doing it for the sake of a profit. Love him or hate him, Ian is idealistically motivated to the nth degree and, over the years, has created more than his share of controversy in RA-Aus circles. It was former Board member Ian who got CEO Steve Tizzard agitated enough to have him initiate legal action through Slater and Gordon, (very much at the expense of RA-Aus funds it should be added).

 

Ian started flying about eight years ago and began his forum style website in xxxx. Two years ago, he began a more personal battle with a severe illness, but just lately has been given a given a clean bill of health. It was an extreme ordeal however, and, even though he didn’t actually need to, Ian stopped flying and did not renew his RA-Aus membership. Now recovered, he is taking steps to take up his hobby again, but finds that the RA-Aus hierarchy have other ideas. After making his application, Ian received a letter from RA-Aus Board President, Steve Runciman, saying that his membership was not going to be automatically renewed because of allegations that he had brought the name of RA-Aus into disrepute. Ian has now taken legal advice himself and believes the RA-Aus administration hasn’t got a legal leg to stand on, by-law twelve notwithstanding.

 

I had only spoken to Ian occasionally until just recently when I had opportunity to talk to him for an extended period over the phone. I have to say that I like Ian. Actually, I will go further and say that I admire him. Of course, I have never suffered the wrath of his Recreation Flying forum, however I may never be in that position either because I do not hold a paid position in the association and my performance in terms of my value for money is no one’s business but my own. Most of what I read on Ian’s website is to do with the broader policy and direction of the association anyway.

 

There is no doubt about it. Ian is a brilliant organizer, a pedantic idealist, a totally obstreperous ragbag (a kindred spirit perhaps), and a whole many other things as well. But he is the kind of person that helps facilitate a truer course for an organization to follow. Successful companies ignore their complaining customers at their peril because papering over the cracks with legal obfuscation will only get you so far. Personally, I think the world needs more people like Ian Baker.

 

------------------

 

There are blogs going about this, private groups commenting on the unjust of all this and your membership money is now being spent by the RAAus with their (read RAAus members) Solicitors with the only comment from them that I have heard is "let the solicitors sort it out".

 

So that is the current state of affairs and where your membership money is going

 

I also know that when an RAAus member asked Steve Runciman, the member's representative, what was going on all he got was "I can't comment on it".

 

Meanwhile I am not allowed to use my Pilot Certificate, that we all work hard to achieve, to fly a recreational aircraft and of which I have done in the past professionally and safely at all times.

 

Personally I support Peter Gilmour in his letter saying that Steve Runciman should immediately resign from the RAAus Committee of Management and anyone else who has had any part in this.

 

Who is next?

 

 

[ave8rr]

I received this Email todayVery disturbing if true!

"I am writing to express my deep concern with the decision to refuse/defer Ian Baker’s (“IB”) RA-Aus membership application. This decision, which appears to have been initiated by Steve Runciman (“SR”) and Steve Tizzard (“ST”) acting in concert, is both repugnant and immature and appears to be a clumsy attempt to punish free speech. Further, it is poor and unusual behaviour which itself brings RA-Aus into disrepute and the supporters and perpetrators of this behaviour should offer their resignations.

 

Given that RA-Aus is the only body through which IB can fly recreational aircraft of the type he prefers, it is misguided to think that the delegated authority from CASA allows the RA-Aus Board and CEO to prevent someone from flying because they directed criticism at the organisation and/or its administration. I know I can write letters of complaint about CASA and its administration without fear of my GA licence being revoked.

 

I urge you to act immediately and encourage your fellow Board members to overturn this decision by circular resolution and grant IB membership. Should IB’s membership not be granted by COB 30 August 2012, I will lodge a formal complaint with CASA which will not only describe this clearly unconscionable conduct but will urge their intervention to conduct a formal review of RA-Aus administration, Board structure, Constitution and By-laws to ensure RA-Aus acts within the spirit of its delegated authority.

 

Note that I am not representing or acting for IB but am taking steps to ensure that this sort of grave injustice never happens again. Also note that there are other avenues to pursue to correct this injustice which will be done in parallel with the CASA complaint and, as you are aware, my background equips me with the skills needed to ensure a just outcome.

 

Regards"

Having two Governing Organisations like in NZ would STOP this sort of thing. Something I might add I have not heard of before and these guys need to remember that it is the Members who keep them in a job.

 

Cheers

 

 

[Robert]

If this is true I think it is time for the sh#t to really hit the fan and all RAAus members to take a stand

 

I like the idea of another (two) organisations to represent our flying privlages

 

What would CASA think of two governing bodys ????

 

 

[Admin]

Yes it IS true...the end result may well just be that Recreational Flying has to become a Governing Body to protect your privileges to fly a recreational aircraft...the EAA style would have to be the choice

 

 

[turboplanner]

There are blogs going about this, private groups commenting on the unjust of all this and your membership money is now being spent by the RAAus with their (read RAAus members) Solicitors with the only comment from them that I have heard is "let the solicitors sort it out".

That would be famous last words if true; you can't restrict and disadvantaged someone like this these days without eventually paying a big penalty.

 

 

[skyfox1]

http://www.recreationalflying.com/threads/i-need-to-do-my-bfr.44269/Yes it IS true...the end result may well just be that Recreational Flying has to become a Governing Body to protect your privileges to fly a recreational aircraft...the EAA style would have to be the choice

l think that this is the biggest load of crap l have ever heard you haven't broken any flight rules or regulations so how or who the f*****

can stop you from flying or doing your BFR how can you bring the RAA in disrepute when they have done it themselves this why l will NEVER vote or get caught up in all the bullshit that goes with the RAA and all the bureaucratic rubbish .

 

So Ian just go and do you flight reveiw and go flying enjoy your self.

 

cheers Geoff.

 

 

[damkia]

Recreational licence (CASA) for me..........experimental registration for what ever I build/buy.

 

Ian, have you thought about seeing if you are able to convert you licence and aircraft registration to CASA/GA/Experimental? More expensive, but at least you would be dealing with a more "mature" organisation.

 

SAAA might do well out of this and could be a shell from which a new "Regulatory Organisation" is built that governs the smaller end of lying.

 

 

[Admin]

l think that this is the biggest load of crap l have ever heard you haven't broken any flight rules or regulations so how or who the f*****can stop you from flying or doing your BFR how can you bring the RAA in disrepute when they have done it themselves this why l will NEVER vote or get caught up in all the bullshit that goes with the RAA and all the bureaucratic rubbish .

So Ian just go and do you flight reveiw and go flying enjoy your self.

 

cheers Geoff.

Ummmm, now that WOULD be illegal

 

 

[Admin]

Recreational licence (CASA) for me..........experimental registration for what ever I buy.Ian, have you thought about seeing if you are able to convert you licence and aircraft registration to CASA/GA/Experimental? More expensive, but at least you would be dealing with a more "mature" organisation.

Yes Mate, I have thought about it but that would mean I would have to lie down and turn over on this matter not to mention the cost or even the freedom to simply be allowed to change the oil in my aircraft and then what happens to the "next guy"...this is all about setting a precedent that will help protect many others...for crying out loud, it is YOUR Association, it is not a Government department, it is not owned by Steve Runciman or Paul Middleton or Steve Tizzard...YOU own it and they should be acting on behalf of YOUR wishes, not their own

 

 

[damkia]

Yes Mate, I have thought about it but that would mean I would have to lie down and turn over on this matter not to mention the cost or even the freedom to simply be allowed to change the oil in my aircraft and then what happens to the "next guy"...this is all about setting a precedent that will help protect many others...for crying out loud, it is YOUR Association, it is not a Government department, it is not owned by Steve Runciman or Paul Middleton or Steve Tizzard...YOU own it and they should be acting on behalf of YOUR wishes, not their own

Fight the battle and then move on if needed

 

 

[fly_tornado]

you have to love self regulation

 

 

[Robert]

all you legal eagles out there would this be legal as far as RAAus membership goes or as far as the RAAus constution goes or is it just personal victimisation of a member

 

 

[damkia]

all you legal eagles out there would this be legal as far as RAAus membership goes or as far as the RAAus constution goes or is it just personal victimisation of a member

This is what the lawyers will be fighting about. Best to let the legal process proceed. There is a long history that is elsewhere on this site of you want to read up on it.

 

 

[Bandit12]

Well, I think that there is a case for some enterprising person to establish a new organisation to manage recreational aircraft, and petition CASA for the same privileges that RA-Aus holds. It may be a lengthy but worthwhile process. I know that many people will say that it can't be done, but sometimes I think it is easier to start afresh and learn from others mistakes than it is to convince those others to learn from theirs.....

 

 

[Bandit12]

Yes it IS true...the end result may well just be that Recreational Flying has to become a Governing Body to protect your privileges to fly a recreational aircraft...the EAA style would have to be the choice

If I could like something twice, this would be it.

 

 

[Yenn]

I was advised several years ago when a member was taken to court for low flying, the AUF could not throw him out legally. They had to go to court, which they did and he got a custodial sentence.

 

I havn't looked at the by-laws etc to see the legality of banning a member, but given time I will.

 

 

[damkia]

Whistleblower legislation anyone???

 

 

[shags_j]

Whistleblower legislation only works in government employ. Raaus is an incorporated association so the leg doesn't apply.

 

 

[Guest ozzie]

Did the AUF take him to court for low flying? Probably CASA. Most of the CASA penalties involve a custodial sentence and they would probably lock your dog up in a cell next to you as well if he just sat on the back seat and not in his box and triplicate written dispensations and personal asic card.

 

The RAAus would be wise not to waste members monies on trivial crap like this. They are pushing their luck as it is.

 

 

[kaz3g]

Hi guys

 

Steps are being taken but lots of "visitors" read this ste so not a good idea to flag too much at this stage.

 

Make sure you vote or use your proxy at the AGM and let your voice be heard via the ballot box.

 

Kaz

 

 

[shags_j]

This is what the lawyers will be fighting about. Best to let the legal process proceed. There is a long history that is elsewhere on this site of you want to read up on it.

I disagree. This should not be a legal issue. There should be no legal process. Our member fees are being wasted on ridiculous decisions made by board members who are clearly out with some sort of vendetta. We are all members of RAAus and I don't believe anyone on here thinks Ian brings the organisation into disrepute.

I think it's about time the board started listening to the members and doing what they were elected to do.

 

MADDOG: are you an elected state rep? If so why have you not heard of this till a member has emailed you (not having a go at you). I would have thought the CEO or president would have notified the Elected Reps of this as soon as the issue escalated?