ave8rr Posted September 1, 2012 Posted September 1, 2012 To all you Savannah owners. I am trying to find the certified MTOW of Australian built Savannahs. The early slat models seem to be certified to 454Kg as per BMAA requirements. I have seen the paperwork for one of these and it says MTOW 454kg but also states that it can go to 560kg if amateur built????? This does not seem right to me. When / what mods were required to bring that weight up to 560kgs? What does one need to look for if looking at earlier slat model aircraft that may or may not have had the slats removed and VG's fitted. What is the MTOW of the VG (sold from around 2006) or later VG XL models? Cheers
Kyle Communications Posted September 11, 2012 Posted September 11, 2012 Hi Mike Just saw this thread. From what I am told ICP made stronger wing attachments on the wing to uprate the airframe to 560kg the earlier models would only be 544 kg. The later ones like mine are 560. The 450 kg limit has been a europe thing as far as I have seen the usa earlier versions were 544 same as here. Might be a god idea to give Reg Brost a call he would know all of these questions Mark
eightyknots Posted May 18, 2013 Posted May 18, 2013 To all you Savannah owners.I am trying to find the certified MTOW of Australian built Savannahs. The early slat models seem to be certified to 454Kg as per BMAA requirements. I have seen the paperwork for one of these and it says MTOW 454kg but also states that it can go to 560kg if amateur built????? This does not seem right to me. When / what mods were required to bring that weight up to 560kgs? What does one need to look for if looking at earlier slat model aircraft that may or may not have had the slats removed and VG's fitted. What is the MTOW of the VG (sold from around 2006) or later VG XL models? Cheers See post #56 for the US dealer's 'broadcast' that Savannah Ss are going up to 599 kg Maximum gross weight. http://www.recreationalflying.com/threads/savannah-s.11139/page-3
Kyle Communications Posted May 30, 2013 Posted May 30, 2013 Just spoke to Tom. He has been in contact with the factory and apparently it is correct about the 600kg upgrade and should be on the kits as well. So Steve looks like you might have a extra 40kg that will get you more time in the air. Tom says last year ICP did some testing in Germany I think to determin what was required to upgrade it. It has something to do with the wing attachments or some sort of mod. I have asked him to push for more info on the XL as well as he thinks the 600kg will be on them as I think so because there is no difference in these areas between the XL and S versions. If so then I can see a lot of orders for the upgrade kit I know I will order one straight away. Hopefully will get some more info on this soon Mark
eightyknots Posted May 30, 2013 Posted May 30, 2013 Just spoke to Tom. He has been in contact with the factory and apparently it is correct about the 600kg upgrade and should be on the kits as well. So Steve looks like you might have a extra 40kg that will get you more time in the air. Tom says last year ICP did some testing in Germany I think to determin what was required to upgrade it. It has something to do with the wing attachments or some sort of mod. I have asked him to push for more info on the XL as well as he thinks the 600kg will be on them as I think so because there is no difference in these areas between the XL and S versions. If so then I can see a lot of orders for the upgrade kit I know I will order one straight away. Hopefully will get some more info on this soonMark That's great news and this will make a really good product even better. I wonder how much weight the strengthening components will be? EG, let's say the the extra components are 5 kg. This will mean an effective load increase of 600-560-5 kg = 35 kg. Even if you don't use the full 600 kg, knowing that your plane is stronger to withstand sudden wild gusts makes you feel better about flying it. On the other hand, an increase to 600 kg makes it easier to figure in a chute recovery system and still be able to carry two good sized adults, some luggage and enough fuel to go some distance.
Kyle Communications Posted May 30, 2013 Posted May 30, 2013 Hi Hank Yes I am excited that extra 35 to 40 kg will make a huge difference. I can get me and mrs in the aircraft and actually fly somewhere more than 20 nm....or spend our aircraft time taxiing around the airfield. I dont believe the mod will weight anywhere near the 5kg probably 1 or 2
rankamateur Posted May 30, 2013 Posted May 30, 2013 That sounds like it could be good news, forgive for being cautious, but I will believe it when I post a photo of my plate with 600 stamped on it. I am still wondering why Valter said it was factory built only. It hasn't been on any of the Oz factory builts to date as far as I am aware.
eightyknots Posted May 30, 2013 Posted May 30, 2013 That sounds like it could be good news, forgive for being cautious, but I will believe it when I post a photo of my plate with 600 stamped on it. I am still wondering why Valter said it was factory built only. It hasn't been on any of the Oz factory builts to date as far as I am aware. I am sure it is related to the US competitive environment where any LSA is now expected to be able to demonstrate a maximum gross weight at the 600 kg LSA limit. It's a shame that ICP appears to have limited this increase to 600 kg to the North American market only. I wrote about this on the Savannah S thread. Before, when we were at 544 kg, the Savannah's 560 kg limit was a comfortable fit. My feeling is that ICP has not kept up with the recent 544 kg ----> 600 kg move both in Australia and New Zealand while the Europeans languish at a 450 kg limit. It's time the news gets back to Italy that we expect all kits and factory-built aircraft to come standard with the 600 kg maximum gross weight. [The extended luggage compartment and the long-range tanks appear to be common options Down Under as well]
rankamateur Posted May 30, 2013 Posted May 30, 2013 [The extended luggage compartment and the long-range tanks appear to be common options Down Under as well] Only because Tom orders them that way because that is what his customers want. Compare what is standard in an Australian kit and what is optional in a South African kit. The order has to fit the market. 1
AeroKits Posted June 22, 2013 Posted June 22, 2013 It's Official: All New Savannah S/XL Kits and Factory Built Aircraft now have a 600KG MTOW. Existing S/XL's can be easily retrofitted with a negligible weight penalty. See www.aerokits.net.au for more detail. To all you Savannah owners.I am trying to find the certified MTOW of Australian built Savannahs. The early slat models seem to be certified to 454Kg as per BMAA requirements. I have seen the paperwork for one of these and it says MTOW 454kg but also states that it can go to 560kg if amateur built????? This does not seem right to me. When / what mods were required to bring that weight up to 560kgs? What does one need to look for if looking at earlier slat model aircraft that may or may not have had the slats removed and VG's fitted. What is the MTOW of the VG (sold from around 2006) or later VG XL models? Cheers To all you Savannah owners.I am trying to find the certified MTOW of Australian built Savannahs. The early slat models seem to be certified to 454Kg as per BMAA requirements. I have seen the paperwork for one of these and it says MTOW 454kg but also states that it can go to 560kg if amateur built????? This does not seem right to me. When / what mods were required to bring that weight up to 560kgs? What does one need to look for if looking at earlier slat model aircraft that may or may not have had the slats removed and VG's fitted. What is the MTOW of the VG (sold from around 2006) or later VG XL models? Cheers 1 1
rankamateur Posted June 23, 2013 Posted June 23, 2013 Nothing to it! even Mark could do it. On the aerokits site you have to click the home button to get the details and pictures up.
ave8rr Posted June 23, 2013 Author Posted June 23, 2013 ave8rr said: ↑ To all you Savannah owners. I am trying to find the certified MTOW of Australian built Savannahs. The early slat models seem to be certified to 454Kg as per BMAA requirements. I have seen the paperwork for one of these and it says MTOW 454kg but also states that it can go to 560kg if amateur built????? This does not seem right to me. When / what mods were required to bring that weight up to 560kgs? What does one need to look for if looking at earlier slat model aircraft that may or may not have had the slats removed and VG's fitted. Still waiting for Savannah owner/s of the original models to answer my original question re weights??? Cheers
rankamateur Posted June 23, 2013 Posted June 23, 2013 Have a look at the second photo of the weight upgrade mod, I believe the early low MTOW Savannah models only had a single plate, the upgraded ones had a double plate(like the photo) and the new 600Kg upgrade has the little fill plate riveted between the two. When the mod is done and an entry put in the logbook then the weight upgrade is in effect.
Kyle Communications Posted June 23, 2013 Posted June 23, 2013 woohoooo now the mrs can come flying with me :) Standby Reg for a influx of orders...mine has already been sent to you
Kyle Communications Posted June 23, 2013 Posted June 23, 2013 ave8rr said: ↑To all you Savannah owners. I am trying to find the certified MTOW of Australian built Savannahs. The early slat models seem to be certified to 454Kg as per BMAA requirements. I have seen the paperwork for one of these and it says MTOW 454kg but also states that it can go to 560kg if amateur built????? This does not seem right to me. When / what mods were required to bring that weight up to 560kgs? What does one need to look for if looking at earlier slat model aircraft that may or may not have had the slats removed and VG's fitted. Still waiting for Savannah owner/s of the original models to answer my original question re weights??? Cheers I am sure the original savannahs were 520kg here in australia although 450 kg overseas in europe. There was a upgrade to take them to 544 kg and the later VG models up to 560kg
rankamateur Posted June 23, 2013 Posted June 23, 2013 woohoooo now the mrs can come flying with me :)Standby Reg for a influx of orders...mine has already been sent to you Does Denise weigh 40Kg? You should feed her more! 1
Kyle Communications Posted June 23, 2013 Posted June 23, 2013 hahahah I will tell her that Steve no with this 40kg increase we can take 50kg in fuel...so both main tanks...now we can go somewhere
eightyknots Posted June 23, 2013 Posted June 23, 2013 It's Official: All New Savannah S/XL Kits and Factory Built Aircraft now have a 600KG MTOW.Existing S/XL's can be easily retrofitted with a negligible weight penalty. See www.aerokits.net.au for more detail. What will be the extra weight of this modification?
rankamateur Posted June 24, 2013 Posted June 24, 2013 What will be the extra weight of this modification? about 25 grams by the look of the pictures
Kyle Communications Posted June 24, 2013 Posted June 24, 2013 not much just 2 alu plates quite small and 4 rivets
rankamateur Posted June 24, 2013 Posted June 24, 2013 http://www.aerokits.net.au/Savannah%20600Kg%20Mod.pdf shows the two pictures of the upgrade.
mAgNeToDrOp Posted June 24, 2013 Posted June 24, 2013 I'm sure this mod will put the savannah kit on the radar now with 600kg mtow, it certainly has for me. I'd like to see someone get it past raaus first though. I would be keen on the XL wide body is it possible to buy the kit in stages, has anyone done it this way? 1
fallowdeer Posted June 24, 2013 Posted June 24, 2013 Maybe this increase in MAUW will make the belly pod a useful option to enable some of the increase to be carried as baggage etc? I see in the USA andIitaly they are offered as a factory option.
Kyle Communications Posted June 24, 2013 Posted June 24, 2013 Well if you can build it light take it easy on the paint and use the std wheels you should easily get it around 300kg's so that gives you 300kg usable...that is outstanding when you look at the others around. The stol performance and the aircraft is so easy to fly with no vices at all. The cruise speed is not out of the park. I cruise at 84kts at 5000 if I want to cruise at 5100 or 5150 I am sitting at 88 its the extended baggage area allows a lot of gear to be taken although up to about 20 to 22kg depending on your CG rely now puts the savannah XL or S model the top of the pile. Lets face it whats 5 kts or so in scheme of things in top cruise speed with other so what if you come in a couple of minutes behind the others when you can put it in and out of a football field if necessary. I am one very happy camper now...as soon as my mod kit comes and it is ratified by Raus mine will be done. 2
rankamateur Posted June 24, 2013 Posted June 24, 2013 Mine will hopefully arrive in the next week, and it will have the modification built in at the factory already and stamped on the plate so I don't expect any trouble at all with RAAus, it should be finished ready to register about November. I have ordered Condor tyres and an Airmaster prop for it so it won't be 300kg but I am still looking forward to a very useful payload, and still have the incentive to keep myself in shape like Mark does.
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