New Engine Options for Jabiru –Rotax or Lycoming

[Motif]

I was talking to Phil Goard yesterday morning and he was telling me that his company, PG Aviation (Cowra, NSW) have just developed a firewall forward system for Jabiru aircraft which allows owners of 230’s, 430’s, all class 19 Jabirus or indeed the owner of RAAus category 24 Jabirus, to fit the Rotax or Lycoming engines instead of the standard Jabiru 3300 engine.

 

This is a big deal for Jabiru owners who now have the option of installing the 100hp Rotax 912 ULS engine or the Lycoming O-235 or the new 115hp Lycoming O-233.

 

So Jabiru owners can enjoy the peace of mind that comes from knowing that they now have three incredibly reliable engines to choose from. As part of the kit, PG Aviation can also supply the Rotax or Lycoming engine for the Jabiru.

 

(Jabiru owners whose aircraft is currently registered in category 24 wanting to install the Rotax or Lycoming engine will need to change to category 19. However for many owners this will not represent a problem at all, but it does rule out commercial training as an option if you do change engines).

 

In addition to fitting the Jabiru with a Rotax or Lycoming engine, P.G. Aviation can also supply a new and strengthened nose wheel oleo for the Jabiru airframe.

 

PG Aviation’s main claim to fame is that they manufacture hard, or impossible, to get parts for general aviation aircraft.

 

P.G. Aviation can be contacted at (02) 6341 1635 or internationally on +61 2 6341 1635.

 

 

[dazza 38]

I wonder why Phil has gone to all this effort. There is nothing wrong with the reliabilty of Jabiru engines.It is ALL caused by people carrying out servicings on the engines incorrectly. Just ask the Jabiru factory.:peepwall:

 

 

[skyfox1]

I wonder why Phil has gone to all this effort. There is nothing wrong with the reliabilty of Jabiru engines.It is ALL caused by people carrying out servicings on the engines incorrectly. Just ask the Jabiru factory.:peepwall:

Thats right dazza nothing wrong with jabiru engines mine holds my boat fine when at anchor.

 

 

[kaz3g]

Makes you think though, doesn't it?

 

If the use of 24 rego for training is to ensure the highest safety standards are complied with, doesn't it make sense to re-certify an engineered conversion to accommodate known reliable engines, particularly the Lycoming 0-235?

 

My Auster has a 0-320 installed and is still able to be registered for air work if required.

 

Kaz

 

 

[Motif]

Absolutely right Kaz. And Dazza you have quoted the factory perfectly.

 

Ross

 

 

[planesmaker]

I think you will find the lycomings a bit heavy and limit the useful load on a Jab. they are around 30kgs heavier, do the maths first. Rotax is a good option though. Tom

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

Phil may have solved three continuing problems with the Jabs, in one foul sweep. That is the engine reliability, weak nose legs (particularly during a rough off-field landings ) and the lack of choice generally on props. If it makes the jab fleet safer, and more reliable, bring it on. With non-Jab engines onboard, many L2s will again be happy to exercise their privileges on them also.

 

There is just no future for a level 2 servicing Jab engines, when there a good chance they'll fail mechanically on their own anyway, not to mention the general lack of meaningfull support from the factory. Guess who gets the blame when failure does occur ??..The squeaky wheel gets the grease !....Good move Phil...........................................Maj...

 

 

[planedriver]

This post is real interesting Maj. I, like many others keep looking at the "for sale" ads, and wondering whether it would be wise to invest my limited dollars in something that my heart would love. However, when you see an aircraft for sale with only a couple of hundred hours on it TTIS and it has had a major o/h by the manufacturer, it does not inspire a lot of confidence for a prospective buyer.

 

That having been said, there are many others who have done many hundreds of hours with their treasured posessions, whether it be 2 stroke, or 4 stroke without any problems.

 

Having been the same as many on here, who have read just so many reports of through-bolt failures, broken valves, etc; I sometimes get get very hesitant before making an offer for an aircraft that deep down I'd dearly love to own.

 

Maybe I need a visit to a hypnotherapist to convince me otherwise. or, the whierd looking woman at the local markets who reads your future? and ask's what your name is? If she is as good as she claims, shurely she'd already know!

 

 

[cooperplace]

I was talking to Phil Goard yesterday morning and he was telling me that his company, PG Aviation (Cowra, NSW) have just developed a firewall forward system for Jabiru aircraft which allows owners of 230’s, 430’s, all class 19 Jabirus or indeed the owner of RAAus category 24 Jabirus, to fit the Rotax or Lycoming engines instead of the standard Jabiru 3300 engine.This is a big deal for Jabiru owners who now have the option of installing the 100hp Rotax 912 ULS engine or the Lycoming O-235 or the new 115hp Lycoming O-233.

 

So Jabiru owners can enjoy the peace of mind that comes from knowing that they now have three incredibly reliable engines to choose from. As part of the kit, PG Aviation can also supply the Rotax or Lycoming engine for the Jabiru.

 

(Jabiru owners whose aircraft is currently registered in category 24 wanting to install the Rotax or Lycoming engine will need to change to category 19. However for many owners this will not represent a problem at all, but it does rule out commercial training as an option if you do change engines).

 

In addition to fitting the Jabiru with a Rotax or Lycoming engine, P.G. Aviation can also supply a new and strengthened nose wheel oleo for the Jabiru airframe.

 

PG Aviation’s main claim to fame is that they manufacture hard, or impossible, to get parts for general aviation aircraft.

 

P.G. Aviation can be contacted at (02) 6341 1635 or internationally on +61 2 6341 1635.

I don't suppose he gave any indication of price?

 

 

[Motif]

I rang Phil this morning and he said he would get back to me on prices. He tells me that he has already had a few callers who are interested so he may be on a winner with this one.

 

 

[Fatman1238]

I was talking to Phil Goard yesterday morning and he was telling me that his company, PG Aviation (Cowra, NSW) have just developed a firewall forward system for Jabiru aircraft which allows owners of 230’s, 430’s, all class 19 Jabirus or indeed the owner of RAAus category 24 Jabirus, to fit the Rotax or Lycoming engines instead of the standard Jabiru 3300 engine.This is a big deal for Jabiru owners who now have the option of installing the 100hp Rotax 912 ULS engine or the Lycoming O-235 or the new 115hp Lycoming O-233.

 

So Jabiru owners can enjoy the peace of mind that comes from knowing that they now have three incredibly reliable engines to choose from. As part of the kit, PG Aviation can also supply the Rotax or Lycoming engine for the Jabiru.

 

(Jabiru owners whose aircraft is currently registered in category 24 wanting to install the Rotax or Lycoming engine will need to change to category 19. However for many owners this will not represent a problem at all, but it does rule out commercial training as an option if you do change engines).

 

In addition to fitting the Jabiru with a Rotax or Lycoming engine, P.G. Aviation can also supply a new and strengthened nose wheel oleo for the Jabiru airframe.

 

PG Aviation’s main claim to fame is that they manufacture hard, or impossible, to get parts for general aviation aircraft.

 

P.G. Aviation can be contacted at (02) 6341 1635 or internationally on +61 2 6341 1635.

[Fatman1238]

Certified aircraft cannot be changed to experimental just by putting a different engine in. Type certified need a Reg 35 approval and factory built LSA need the manufacturers approval to do the mod. Look into this before spending $20 k on a mod.

 

 

[Motif]

Fatman,

 

Under ASTM specifications (i.e. the standard under which LSA aircraft are certified) engine and propeller manufacturers need to also attest that their product was certified under ASTM specifications to the original aircraft manufacturer. In respect to the topic at hand i.e. engine mods to Jabiru airframes, if Jabiru themselves were to certify that the firewall forward kit supplied by P.G. Aviation together with the Rotax / Lycoming engine was acceptable to them, then the registration could stay in 24. In this case however, it's hard to imagine Jabiru agreeing to these mods.

 

In respect to any 24 registered LSA (apropos your first sentence), if you put say an un-certified constant speed unit propeller on, you legally should move the registration to 19 irrespective of how much you (or the original manufacturer) wants to keep it in 24.

 

 

[Sapphire]

I always thought the Jabiru is a great a/c......if you take away the Jabiru engine

 

 

[Compulsion]

There seems to be an argument that if you have a 24 registered aircraft then you cannot re register it as a 19. Can anyone tell me if this is true.

 

 

[ruffasguts]

There seems to be an argument that if you have a 24 registered aircraft then you cannot re register it as a 19. Can anyone tell me if this is true.

true

 

 

[Compulsion]

Thanks Mick. No one at the club today would believe me.

 

 

[Herm]

There seems to be an argument that if you have a 24 registered aircraft then you cannot re register it as a 19. Can anyone tell me if this is true.

You all need to read your current mag ( sports flyer) the information is in there. You are not able to change a 24 aircraft to 19... Period!

 

 

[winsor68]

You all need to read your current mag ( sports flyer) the information is in there. You are not able to change a 24 aircraft to 19... Period!

But... I get the strong impression that Ra-Aus does. Perhaps the grounding are still just the tip of the iceberg? Not saying anyone is doing anything particularly unsafe... just that perhaps Ra-Aus has much less of a clue then they or CASA are aware...?

 

 

[Herm]

But... I get the strong impression that Ra-Aus does. Perhaps the grounding are still just the tip of the iceberg? Not saying anyone is doing anything particularly unsafe... just that perhaps Ra-Aus has much less of a clue then they or CASA are aware...?

Yes this is also true. I am aware of an aircraft that this has been done. However this was only due to problems that have occurred as a result of internal error or problems that are a subject of another thread. However relative to this post it is not the case an most likely never be.

 

 

[Fatman1238]

There seems to be an argument that if you have a 24 registered aircraft then you cannot re register it as a 19. Can anyone tell me if this is true.

True, just buy an amateur built aircraft in the first place.

 

 

[Jabiru7252]

Read section 3.5.3 in the RA-Aus Technical manual. It's not as exciting as The Hitch Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy but might set a few things straight.

 

 

[eightyknots]

I wonder why Phil has gone to all this effort. There is nothing wrong with the reliabilty of Jabiru engines.It is ALL caused by people carrying out servicings on the engines incorrectly. Just ask the Jabiru factory.:peepwall:

Is that what it is?

 

Up until now, I thought people only encountered problems with throughbolts if they flew their Jabiru engines in non-Bundaberg climatic conditions.

 

 

[Gentreau]

Factory built aircraft which have been modified without the approval of the factory must bear the “EXPERIMENTAL” placard as detailed in Section 7.5.4 Annex A' date=' be issued with an Experimental Certificate by an Approved Person and can only be used for private operations.[/quote']

 

Approved Persons are those that hold an Instrument of Delegation issued to them by the CASA as having authority to act in tasks relating to aircraft registered under the LSA category.

That would be RA-Aus who can issue an experimental certificate then ..... aircraft would remain on the 24 register but be unusable for training.

 

.

 

[Guest john]

This following information may surprise some owners of Jabirus that are 55 or 24 registered & want to make an engine change.

 

Some years ago a Flying School at Hedlow Qld, purchased several Jabirus for training & hire purposes. The Jabiru engines were failing repeatedly & the Flying School wanted to do something about this issue before someone was killed.

 

Therefore the Flying School went through the motions @ their cost of obtaining an Engineering Order to do a firewall conversion for the installation of a Rotax 912 engine , & several Jabirus including all the Flying School Jabs had an engine change from the unreliable Jab engine to the approved & trusted Rotax 912 engine.

 

It used to be said around the aviation traps that if you purchased a 2nd hand Jab with a Rotax 912 engine, then you had the best of both worlds.

 

So it goes to prove that if someone wants to go down the path of doing an engine change, there are ways & means of doing this rather than suffering the woes of an enreliable engine.

 

Every Pilot that I know that flies wants to have the assurance that if he goes up flying he will return to terra firma safely.

 

There is an old & true saying in aviation," We've never left anybody up there yet"