Gloucester fly in. (sorry for spelling)

[flying dog]

Folks,

 

I was attempting to fly to above airport on Sat from Wollongong.

 

Alas I got as far as Warnervale and the weather had other plans.

 

I thought it would be a good idea to land there and wait out the weather and see what happens.

 

I was EAST of the strip and heard that runway 20 was the active one. That was good, as all I had to do was cross over, descend and join cross wind.

 

So: It is drizziling, there were planes in the circuit - unknow number - and I wanted to land.

 

Made an inbound call. NO REPLY. Not really expected though.

 

Made a 3 mile call. NO REPLY. Other planes making occasional calls. (note: occasional)

 

Overflew and went to the dead side. Got down to 1000 feet and joined crosswind. Made joining call. There was another plane "overflying the runway" (go around?) and I watched him.

 

NO REPLY. That's a bit annoying.

 

Somewhere else there was another plane in the circuit.

 

As I passed over the runway, I looked out the right window and checked the plane I just saw and he was where I expected him to be.

 

Flew out a bit and turned left for downwind.

 

Did downwind checks. Pump, fuel, switches (bumps and turbulance), hatches and harness.

 

Looked back out the window! WTF!!??

 

A plane! Yikes! Where did he come from??!!

 

Really throttled back. and held short. Heard a "turning base" call. The plane infront didn't turn, so there must have been another plane again infront of him as well.

 

Kept flying downwind. No radio calls heard. The plane infront of me turned base. NO RADIO CALL.

 

I held on downwind and let him get further on BASE. Turned base. "Traffic Warnervale, ....... turning base 20 FULL STOP, Warnervale."

 

There were other radio calls from a Tecnam made now and then for Warnervale, but it wasn't for base/final, so I didn't worry too much and it proved to me that I was on the right frequency.

 

Watched the other plane. He turned FINAL.. NO RADIO CALL HEARD.

 

I turned final and watched.

 

There is another story here but let's keep to this story.

 

They "landed" and just sat on the runway.

 

I had to do a go-around.

 

This plane was a GA plane.

 

VH-JYQ

 

Congrats dude. You may need to learn how to use a radio.

 

 

[dazza 38]

Sounds like you had a exciting flight FD.

 

 

[flying dog]

Yeah. I am going to call CASA about it too.

 

I can't belive what happened. The other story was just as amusing. Same plane watching them on final. I thought I was going to see a crash.

 

 

[motzartmerv]

"Warnavale traffic, Jabiru xxxx radio check please"...;)

 

 

[flying dog]

Yeah, and considering that it worked at YWOL, and when I was talking to Sydney radar, I can't believe it suddenly failed then/there.

 

It was also working when I got to Cessnock.

 

So honestly I don't think it wasn't working Motza.

 

 

[rankamateur]

JYQ - Warnervale Air Pty Ltd, can't have been behaving badly on an unfamiliar strip.

 

 

[flying dog]

JYQ - Warnervale Air Pty Ltd, can't have been behaving badly on an unfamiliar strip.

 

So they were local.

 

So I would hope they would have been more professional than what tey did at "their own strip".

 

Or is this "typical" of them? I have heard they have an attitude unto them selves that RAA and "outsiders" are not welcome.

 

But that aside, I made all the required calls and this plane made none and just (basically) sat on the runway after landing.

 

Not exactly professional or polite.

 

 

[motzartmerv]

Can't see CASA being too interested. Not much there other than someone stopping on the runway, which isn't illegal, and turning base late after giving a call.

 

Should never asume that what people are saying is what they are doing, students will often give false calls, or give a call and NOT do the turn. You had the proceeding traffic in sight, so all was good..;)

 

I dont understand why you would 'go around' after seeing an aircraft overflying the field when you were joining xwind.. What was the issue here? Why would you go around in the CCT just to go back up and mix it with him?

 

 

[flying dog]

Y know Motza,

 

As true as you may be, you seem to be promoting what they did.

 

And if CASA are or not interested, I am quite capable of asking them myself and getting THEIR opinion.

 

If people do something different to what they say, then there is a problem with how they were instructed.

 

There are proceedures for reasons.

 

I did not do a go around seeeing the person overlying.

 

There was someone overflying/going around as I was joining cross wind.

 

I just read what I said. There seems to be a problem with you parsing what I wrote. It was quite clearly stated.

 

When I was on SHORT FINAL the plane infront landed - after another interesting observation of their flying - and basically stopped on the runway.

 

I made a call and they didn't really do much to help me.

 

Granted they have/had "right of way".

 

But if that is the attitude they promote at the school, then I feel there is a problem with what is being told as the right thing to do.

 

 

[motzartmerv]

Ok Dog.

 

Y know Motza,

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

There was someone overflying/going around as I was joining cross wind.

 

I just read what I said. There seems to be a problem with you parsing what I wrote. It was quite clearly stated.

Clearly stated what?..Were they going around or overflying. They are two totally different things. Speaking of concerns with training, I am concerned that YOU dont know the difference, and you better make sure you do before you call the cops.

 

You are correct, they had right of way, and while not being polite, or displaying good airmanship, they didnt break any rules.

 

Im not defending them as I wasnt there. meerly stating that in training, sometimes things arent tottaly by the book, people make mistakes, the cockpit is busy with chatter, and s@#t happens.

 

You always seem so ready to call the cops on people, just make sure you know the correct meaning of the phrases you are using.

 

Did you request a radio check at any stage??.. Like you would have been TRAINED to do??

 

 

[flying dog]

Well, as you do know better, you tell me what the other plane was doing when I was joinging crosswind.

 

They weren't taking off, I know that.

 

They were about 500 feet in the air, above the runway (flying along the runway).

 

So was it a "go around"?

 

Or were they simply overflying the runway?

 

there was no radio call telling anyone.

 

 

[motzartmerv]

Dog, mate... Overflying the runway means something othe than any of the options you just put forward.

 

Was there a risk of him running into you from there?? If not, suck it up, he doesn't have to talk to you.

 

 

[flying dog]

So to educate the village idiot, why don't you tell me the DEFINTION of a overfly?

 

And that isn't the part which concerns me.

 

 

[motzartmerv]

Ask casa when you call them. Sure they will be happy to educate you.

 

 

[flying dog]

Ah....

 

Quick to complain yourself but are reluctant to actually instruct and/or educate.

 

Your cred' has gone from LOW to NON-EXISTANT for me.

 

 

[motzartmerv]

Excuse me? From low to non existant?

 

Dog, you always post up huge descriptions about how you were so badly wronged by other pilots. An how you are going to be talking to casa about it. That's fine. I'm happy to educate you. If you would answer my questions I could help you.

 

1. Did you request a radio check?

 

2. Was there a risk of collision at any stage?

 

3. Who has right of way in the cct?

 

Answer those 3 questions and we can work the problem . If not, stop making posts that only highlight your own lack of understanding, these "non professional" (who actually are professionals) would have grave concerns for their paying passengers and their own safety if they were to read some of your comments.

 

Cheers.

 

 

[flying dog]

suck it up

 

I think is the saying.

 

(Who said that I wonder?)

 

 

[motzartmerv]

Yep. Exactly as I suspected, and exactly why I offer you no "instruction". Because you are not interested in learning. Ive been around the block enough times with blokes like you that don't want to learn, look at what THEY can do to improve safety, only point fingers, to know another one when I see one.

 

Never have I seen you indicate that you wish to learn from your "questions" only point fingers at other pilots. So yes Dog, suck it up mate, your "incident', was nothing, nothing that any half decent student couldn't handle, let a lone a licensed pilot. People sometimes dont talk on the radio, sometimes they say they are doing things that they aren't, say they are inbound from the north when they are actually south, stop on the runway during instruction, do go arounds without calling..... All of this happens all the time, we as pilots are expected to be able to cope with these small inconveniences. But you go right ahead, call casa and tell them all about your big bad scary brush with death, im sure they will send a van load of officials around to take your statement, and congradulate you on the massive contribution to safety you have provided by bringing it to their attention that someone turned base late after a call and stopped on the runway.

 

Im sure they will find this professional pilot and line him up against a wall and shoot him. And after all that, the "creds" of the RAA will be hugely improved in the eyes of CASA.

 

(just as long as they dont care that our "pilots" dont know the difference between going around and over flying)

 

Be sure to let us all know the outcome of your "call" to the cops.

 

 

[flying dog]

I am not going to dignify that - or this any more.

 

I don't have time for people who belive the sun shines out of their ......

 

 

[motzartmerv]

When all else fails, resort to insults. ;) the sign of a true gentlemen. Insult me all you like, just as long as you learn something, it's a small price to pay.

 

Fly safe mate.

 

 

[i_like_planes]

Geez, is it hot in here? ...

 

FD, I don't think Motz is promoting bad airmenship...

 

In your original post You kept saying "NO REPLY", as if they were supposed to talk back to you? They're not control towers mate, they don't have to read-back your every call, or give you clearance to join... That's YOUR job... Were you expecting every one of the "unknown number" of acft in the circuit to give you the thumbs up that they heard you on the radio?

 

Perhaps instead of blaming everyone else and running to CASA, try to see what YOU could have done better.

 

Sounds to me like you wandered into a circuit very situationally unaware ...

 

Concerned that you weren't being heard/talked back to, yet didn't request a radio check to confirm you were transmitting.

 

Unaware of how many aircraft were in the circuit and with concerns that they weren't using their radio you STILL proceeded to join

 

without being sure you had them all sited.

 

I have to say I'm with Motz on this one - when you look up the very important definition of "OVERFLYING" ... Perhaps read up on when it would be appropriate to use.

 

Hang about above cct height, get yourself situationally aware, THEN Join if its safe to do so.

 

Just my $0.02

 

Planes.

 

 

[flying dog]

Well, from the concensus I can see, people know more about what happened than me.

 

So with that knowledge I shall act.

 

 

[motzartmerv]

I can see, people know more about what happened than me..

I suspect everyone at warnavale did too..;)