Finally got my Proper Pilots Licence ;)

[Guest nunans]

Well, after more than 110hrs Dual plus another 40 or so PIC I got my ppl yesterday,

 

I still don't have my CTA endorsement and I only found out I wasn't getting it after we got back from the flight test but anyway that'll only be another 500-1g hopefully

 

Don't take offence at the acronym, I thought it was funny when I first heard it. I've found there's bugger all difference between them except the PPL costs a heap more and lets you do the same thing when your finished except for the extra seats and you get to burn more fuel that costs more per liter than the Pulp that is prime fuel for our rotax's.

 

 

[facthunter]

Congratualtions on the achievement anyhow. Nev

 

 

[Guest nunans]

Thanks Nev, I'm glad that It's over and I don't have to do it again. It's been a marathon

 

 

[coljones]

Proper Pilot Licence - like it!!!

 

 

[XP503]

That's a lot of hours for a ppl!

 

 

[Tomo]

Good Stuff!!

 

A great feeling when you have that license isn't it...

 

 

[Guest nunans]

That's a lot of hours for a ppl!

Yep, Tell me about it.. The first 35 was the RA pilot cert and pax endo, 15 for TW endo, 5 for LP & 2ST, 15 for part of Instructor rating, and about 10 hrs type famil on J170, J230, GR-912, etc. So that's 80hr dual recreational and the other 30hrs dual was GA handling, navs, instrument and controlled airspace famil.

 

I could have done the PPL in less hours if I was more consistent and just stuck to one thing at a time, but that's not what I do.

 

 

[webbm]

Proper Pilot Licence - like it!!!

Me too. Also looks like it could be called Pricey Pilots Licence, but it wouldn't be appropriate, because its worth every cent.

Congrats!!!

 

 

[eightyknots]

Well, after more than 110hrs Dual plus another 40 or so PIC I got my ppl yesterday,I still don't have my CTA endorsement and I only found out I wasn't getting it after we got back from the flight test but anyway that'll only be another 500-1g hopefully

Don't take offence at the acronym, I thought it was funny when I first heard it. I've found there's bugger all difference between them except the PPL costs a heap more and lets you do the same thing when your finished except for the extra seats and you get to burn more fuel that costs more per liter than the Pulp that is prime fuel for our rotax's.

Congratulations on getting your PPL nunans!

 

 

[facthunter]

Are you going on to the CPL. ( Or is it too soon to think about that)? You might as well do the theory exams...Nev

 

 

[Guest nunans]

Are you going on to the CPL. ( Or is it too soon to think about that)? You might as well do the theory exams...Nev

So far i haven't been interested in working as a pilot. i think it would take alot of the fun out of it as id have to fly when and where the boss told me to rather than when and where id like to go. Also i think there is a significant supply and demand problem with working as a commercial pilot and I think thats alot of the reason it doesent pay very well. The industrial electrical industry however is the opposite and has been for a while. if im flying im going to make sure its because i want to rather than have to if i can.

i would like to know the ins and outs of maintaining a night vfr or private instrument rating so i can convert it back to an annual dollar figure. a ppl on its own is really not much more usefull than an ra pilot cert.

 

 

[frank marriott]

Start with P3 of the VFG NVFR

 

 

[facthunter]

I have never considered the night vmc the way to go. if you are going across country I would do whatever training you feel is right for you, which could be a fair bit of circuit work at night, but end up with a PIFR. endorsed on the type of approaches that would suit your operation. With a lot of aids being decommissioned that might be a GPS based thing which means the equipment would have to be TSO'd. You might consider a back up aid ( NDB) that lets you have an alternative but really ifyou get stuck you could get radar track and terrain clearance advice to somewhere. It's a matter of having what is necessary to get a flight plan approved . You can fly almost anything on a private licence.

 

Doing it for a living means you fly at the behest of someone, and you spend many christmasses and new years eves and kids birthdays away. You can't run for committees or play organised sport and guarantee to be any place.

 

Most of the pay is below what I think it is worth, particularly on feeder runs where you earn your money as you fly in all weather into pretty ordinary airports. Nev

 

 

[motzartmerv]

Dont you need either NDB or VOR? Or is the pifr different?

 

 

[facthunter]

motz I think it is changing by the day. I don't know how many VOR's are active. PIFR is very flexible . CASA don't like Night VFR unless something has changed lately. For me the concept has never made sense. Humans cannot see at night unless the moon is out.This is a pretty rare occurence. Mazda used talk of the destination visual thing. Couple of lights moving all around the windscreen. This is what you are faced with on a pitch black night. Nev

 

 

[motzartmerv]

Absolutely. I reckon its a very dangerous rating. I was just curious about the Pifr requirements thats all. I dont know the rules very well (just scarped through on Irex) but I know that a rating has to have either Ndb or Vor. The Gps still can't be used as primary unless Tso'd 165 bla bla. Not many lighties have a gps that fits the catagory. I couldn't see them laxing on a Pifr. It seems silly I know with the reliability and functions of modern Gps's as aposed to the out dated Ndb's etc with their limited coverage and errors. I dont know, I dont write the rules...luckily..;)

 

 

[Patrick Normoyle]

I thought Private IFR was just to get you from one area to another area this is enroute, but not to depart IFR or arrive IFR dos no procedural SIDS or instrument approaches. Just so you can go from VOR to VOR to get you across the sky country at a safer altitude. NDB's are being done away with and GPS is not that common in light aircraft ( not good enough to meet CASA's requirements )

 

 

[frank marriott]

When I last read up on it (some time ago so don't rely on info being current) PIFR was LSAL to LSAL with optional approaches as an add on. Once the approach/s are added then the renewal/ currency requirements of a CIR applied.

 

Currency of PIFR without approaches etc was only by inclusion of some IFR in the BFR.

 

Relevant Tsoed instruments naturally. Min 2 aids.

 

The suggestion was that if you had a current CIR you could apply and receive a PIFR which would allow you to file and fly " enroute" IMC privately if you didn't meet the currency requirements.

 

As my CIR was not current I didn't follow up on it. I am a firm believer of the recency requirements for IMC flying. (Particularly with low time IMC not to mention small aircraft and turbulence )

 

Frank

 

 

[motzartmerv]

They generally automatically give you one with the CIR these days, and its purpetual, you can use the Pifr to get current on your CIR apparently..

 

 

[facthunter]

The currency requirements are built in. Whatever qualifications you have , recency is important. It's also much harder to fly an approach in a plane than a similator, but if you have done a lot of actual flying recently the simulator feels wrong ( even if it is a good one). Nev

 

 

[REastwood]

Having just recently completed my NVFR and will be completing my CIR in about 2 weeks I can hopefully shed some light on the subject. Firstly the NVFR, if you end up doing a CIR then you have to have 10 hours night flying with 5 as PIC, you do not need to get the NVFR but it can make things easier if flying IFR at night (you can get better LSALT's by making visual fixes etc.). If you do a PIFR then any instrument time done doing the NVFR counts towards the PIFR, again most places recommend you do the NVFR. It took me about 14 hours all up in my own aircraft. Recency is just doing your 3 landings every 90 days (only 1 every six months if not carry PAX) and a flight of at least 1 hour duration once a year.

 

As for the CIR/PIFR, if you can find someone in your area who can do a PIFR then that could be the best option. In SA there isn't anyone who was able to conduct a PIFR course. I ended up sitting the IREX exam (self taught through Bob Tait books) and currently doing the CIR at Adelaide Airport. The basic PIFR gives you enroute only, i.e. take off clear of cloud until you reach LSALT (the cloud base can be at LSALT) and you must be visual to descend below LSALT. You can however do FPA's (Flight Procedure Authorisations) which allow you to do additional things like Approaches, departures etc. You will have to do either the NDB or VOR FPA as part of the PIFR but I would suggest also doing: Instrument departure (removes the climb to LSALT limitation), Holding, and DME approaches. If you intend on going into bigger airports and you do the VOR approach, you might as well do the Localiser as well.

 

The CIR is about 40 hours, the PIFR minimum is 20 hours, but if you add on the FPA's you might end up doing 30 odd hours, a lot of people suggest doing the CIR and getting the PIFR signed off at the same time. That way you get everything and are up to a good standard.

 

Having both the NVFR and CIR/PIFR allows more flexibility when planning private flights. Of course you still have to fly within your aircrafts and your own limitations, i.e. icing, thunderstorms, personal minimums for cloud, turbulence, wind etc. but for those days when it's overcast at 1000' but beautiful over the ranges you get get to were you are going safely.

 

 

[Guest nunans]

Thanks for all that great info...

 

One thing I'm not sure on after reading the post is if the recency requirement is the same for PIFR, NVFR, Command Instrument, and FPAs?

 

With the CIR do you have to do all the NDB, RNAV, VOR, ILS approaches every ninety days to keep all privaleges current? and is the recency specific to different models of avionics? ie if you do rnavs with one model GPS then you're not allowed to fly an RNAV approach with a different GPS unless you've also done the recency on that in the past 90 days?

 

Also, is the CPL a pre req to the CIR or can a PPL holder get a CIR too?

 

I would have guessed that most schools would make you do the NVFR before the PIFR even though the PIFR covers Night flying..... It's just bussiness I suppose.

 

So if the PIFR requires VMC conditions below LSALT for the whole flight, then surely I could safely fly VFR in those conditions. So what's the point of PIFR?

 

 

[Guest nunans]

The Gps still can't be used as primary unless Tso'd 165 bla bla. Not many lighties have a gps that fits the catagory.

It's a given that Lighties (if you mean ultralight/RA rego aircraft) don't apply for any flying that isn't day vmc due to the limitations of the rego exemption but you knew that already.

There are plenty of VH piper/cessnas around that have TSO'd gps and avionics etc. I have noticed that the GA TSO'd gps's that i've used have little LCD,s with bugger all information and no map or chart at all, just the basic info that you need. The MUCH cheaper ultralight gps's are all 10" screen, moving map, pretty blue line where you're going type units that aren't worth a cracker as far as casa is concerned.

 

 

[ayavner]

good on ya!! i can't wait to get to that stage, really looking forward to taking some little trips and some great piccys.

 

 

[Guest nunans]

good on ya!! i can't wait to get to that stage, really looking forward to taking some little trips and some great piccys.

thanks, you can start taking little trips and piccys as soon as you get your ra cert, no need for a ppl in the j170 :)