Class-action lawsuit against CASA and ATSB........

[Guest Maj Millard]

As a safety oriented, active pilot, I am getting very pissed off that we do not get any feedback from accidents, that concern the type of aircraft that we all operate. Our safety is being seriously jepodised everytime we fly.

 

I am seeking support, and legal opinion, on sueing the above entities for failing to exercise their DUTY OF CARE to all RAAus pilots by not supplying, in a timly manner, some indication of what may have caused engine or other aircraft failures leading to an unsafe aircraft condition. We don't need bloody names and addresses, just what failed or caused the aircraft to crash, so that we can make our own flying safer as a result !..

 

Additionally, as an active L2, I am unable to exercise my DUTY OF CARE suitably, and adequety for my customers, without this ongoing knowledge flow. This has the further potential to decrease the safety condition of our fleet, and further risk lives.

 

Todays sad loss of the Gazelle will be another typical example I'm sure, where we may never be told what led to the crash, if it was indeed linked to either engine, structural, or system failure.

 

I can, just off the top of my head, come up with at least another 10 aircraft losses (many with fatalities), where safety-related information has not been forthcoming.

 

Please let me know your opinions..............................................Maj...

 

 

[ave8rr]

As a safety oriented, active pilot, I am getting very pissed off that we do not get any feedback from accidents, that concern the type of aircraft that we all operate. Our safety is being seriously jepodised everytime we fly.I am seeking support, and legal opinion, on sueing the above entities for failing to exercise their DUTY OF CARE to all RAAus pilots by not supplying, in a timly manner, some indication of what may have caused engine or other aircraft failures leading to an unsafe aircraft condition.

 

Additionally, as an active L2, I am unable to exercise my DUTY OF CARE suitably, and adequety for my customers, without this ongoing knowledge flow. This has the further potential to decrease the safety condition of our fleet, and further risk lives.

 

Todays sad loss of the Gazelle will be another typical example I'm sure, where we may never be told what led to the crash, if it was indeed linked to either engine, structural, or system failure.

 

I can, just off the top of my head, come up with at least another 10 aircraft losses (many with fatalities), where safety-related information has not been forthcoming.

 

Please let me know your opinions..............................................Maj...

Maj, I am with you on this one. There must be some way that the accident findings can be published in a timely manner.

I started a thread on this a year or two back and was told by all and sundry that the Police give a report to the coroner and then we hear nothing else.

 

RAAus should be able to get this info and publish even IF only be email to Members. ASRA do this for every incident as I understand it.

 

I also believe that ATSB should be involved in ALL fatal accidents.

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

By support I mean you and I. Hell we could easily get hundreds if not thousands behind this, and I'm sure the national press would come on board. They (ABC) had no problem covering on national radio our lack of rego drama a few weeks back..We have a right to at least the basic details............................................................................Maj...

 

 

[farri]

Ross, Do CASA and ATSB have an obligation to supply information that they have gained about accidents,to anyone else?

 

Frank.

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

And by the way that's Civil Aviation Safety Authority, and Australian Transport Safety Bureau I'm looking at........Safety ??? just who are they trying to con here ?...........................................Maj...

 

 

[gareth lacey]

Hi Maj

 

it really concerns me that we the Flying public are never told , unless its a fatality (and this ulimatily goes to the coroner ) we can not make an informed judgement

 

planes that have engines out and an accident occurs are NEVER investigated unless there is a fatality/fatalities, in the last 6 weeks 2 plane engines out ,the

 

acceptance of many flyers is that ,oh well it happens, carry on regardless .We should not accept this I myself am still learning and find that the atitudes of some of the flying fraternity is woeful RAA should have an input to us as members so that as you say we can all learn and be better prepared

 

I support you in your endeavours to get some answers

 

Cheers gareth

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

Thank you Gareth and all others, there's the old saying ......"Knowledge dispels fear !"...........................................Maj...

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

Frank, They are public-supported Government departments hiding behind the word 'safety' . They are there to ensure that the public stay safe, that supposedly is their job is it not ?...........they are not helping us to stay safe by not providing info that they easily have access to..Like I said, we don't need names and addresses, just the meat and potatoes please..................................Maj...

 

 

[Ultralights]

sadly, Not many people file a incident report regarding most failures, just send the engine off, deal with the manufacturer, and get it fixed, no reporting means no data!

 

 

[Bubbleboy]

Maj...I was an Undertaker for 14 years and out of curiosity at times, would go through the Coroners reports on some of my customers. I have been out of it now for 8 years and havent looked in some time but there was a lot of information out there. I realise that doesnt answer all our questions as there is only a Coroners report when there was a death involved.

 

Scotty

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

One of our ex-RAAus type persons now enjoying their cushy offices in CASA Brisbane, should additionally be designated 'Major-Incident Safety (there's that word again !) Cordinator', or MISC for short. They are both ex-RAA operations managers, they should know what we are about, and what our needs are in that area................................................................Maj...

 

 

[winsor68]

I like where this is going Maj... Bloody awesome work.

 

 

[ave8rr]

One of our ex-RAAus type persons now enjoying their cushy offices in CASA Brisbane, should additionally be designated 'Major-Incident Safety (there's that word again !) Cordinator', or MISC for short. They are both ex-RAA operations managers, they should know what we are about, and what our needs are in that area................................................................Maj...

Maj, Board members could have areas of responsibility. One of these could be accident / incident coordinator who would compile a monthly report and have it published on the RAAus web site. Just a thought.

 

 

[Guest Error404]

CASA and ATSB don't investigate RA-Aus accidents so you may as well sue the Police in every state of Australia. Isn't RA-Aus an informed sport and therefore not investigated per-se? It might be a losing battle before you even begin!

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

Holy shxx Bubbleboy...nice to know you !!.............you mean you got the coroners report with the sti..er I mean body ?.........or did you recieve it later, I just didn't think the undertaker would get access to that sort of stuff.......................................Maj...

 

 

[ave8rr]

CASA and ATSB don't investigate RA-Aus accidents so you may as well sue the Police in every state of Australia. Isn't RA-Aus an informed sport and therefore not investigated per-se? It might be a losing battle before you even begin!

If this is the case then we need to have some means that Police are directed to inform RAAus, of their findings. This could be via a CASA instrument.

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

Error404, well then CASA needs to give RAA grants to carry out active investigations of our accidents and trends. CASA seems to find time and money to compile accident data, reports and trends on GA accidents, and that's and 'informed' activity also isn't it ??............................................................Maj...

 

 

[farri]

Frank, They are public-supported Government departments hiding behind the word 'safety' . They are there to ensure that the public stay safe, that supposedly is their job is it not ?..Maj...

Ross, Unfortunately,if they are not legally required to pass on information that they have gathered, can it be said that they are failing their duty of care?

 

I`d like to know if they have an obligation to make their findings available to the RAA or any individual who might request them.

 

Frank.

 

 

[DGL Fox]

I am with you 100% Maj..

 

 

[Neil_S]

As a safety oriented, active pilot, I am getting very pissed off that we do not get any feedback from accidents, that concern the type of aircraft that we all operate. Our safety is being seriously jepodised everytime we fly.I am seeking support, and legal opinion, on sueing the above entities for failing to exercise their DUTY OF CARE to all RAAus pilots by not supplying, in a timly manner, some indication of what may have caused engine or other aircraft failures leading to an unsafe aircraft condition. We don't need bloody names and addresses, just what failed or caused the aircraft to crash, so that we can make our own flying safer as a result !..

 

Additionally, as an active L2, I am unable to exercise my DUTY OF CARE suitably, and adequety for my customers, without this ongoing knowledge flow. This has the further potential to decrease the safety condition of our fleet, and further risk lives.

 

Todays sad loss of the Gazelle will be another typical example I'm sure, where we may never be told what led to the crash, if it was indeed linked to either engine, structural, or system failure.

 

I can, just off the top of my head, come up with at least another 10 aircraft losses (many with fatalities), where safety-related information has not been forthcoming.

 

Please let me know your opinions..............................................Maj...

Agree absolutely, Maj. If we can't learn from other people's misfortune then there is more likelihood it will get repeated.....

 

I am also sure the relatives and friends of the unfortunate person would take some comfort in knowing that any relevant information that may prevent a repeat occurrence had been passed on.

 

Neil

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

Frank, I know CASA can now be sued, right down to the individual if need be...not sure about the ATSB. Yes they are required to provide information to the public, under the 'feedom of information act' (FOI). Our own Turbo has just demonstrated that by asking for, and recieving the reports on the RAA CASA audits. He is looking through that info currently....Also now that this is an election year, a government will do just about anything to avoid negative publicity in the national press.........................................Maj...

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

Windsor, thank you...yes all we need now is some real good legal eagle to help us with this, a 'Queens council' (QC) would do fine. They managed to get one on 'The Castle' didn't they ??................Maj...

 

 

[Bubbleboy]

Holy shxx Bubbleboy...nice to know you !!.............you mean you got the coroners report with the sti..er I mean body ?.........or did you recieve it later, I just didn't think the undertaker would get access to that sort of stuff.......................................Maj...

Maj...as your aware it can be years before the Coroner finishes their findings and releases a report. I accessed them straight off their website. I assumed it was a public site.

Scotty

 

 

[Guest Error404]

Whilst this isn't directly related, it is to an extent.

 

http://www.atsb.gov.au/publications/investigation_reports/2012/aair/ae-2012-064.aspx

 

and here we all were thinking that they had simply landed in the dark.

 

It goes to prove why these investigatons take so long to compile as its never as simple as it looks on the face of it.

 

This last years Temora NatFly trike fatality.

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

Well that is not a real detailed report, in fact fairly minimal really. If you've had anything to do with those types of government departments, 12 months ain't bad for them.

 

I was at Temora when they departed that afternoon, and I was told at the dinner that night that there had in fact been a trike fatal after impact with a windmill. There were only minutes of usefull light left also however.................................................Maj...