Many Small Plane Crashes Preventable

[djpacro]

with Rich Stowell http://www.richstowell.com/ on ABC Nightline last night.

 

The short story: http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/video/small-plane-crashes-preventable-18759779

 

Search http://abcnews.go.com/nightline for the full story: Plane Crashes: Secrets to Staying Safe, Avoiding Accidents

 

 

[Ultralights]

exactly... EMT training should be mandatory.... even for Raaus.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

475 pilots killed every year versus 11000+ citizens killed and 50000+ injuries due to gun violence in the US.

 

Hardly an issue really.

 

 

[facthunter]

You won't get any arguments from me on that one, but some of what is written there says that the pilot was too low to take successfull recovery action, even if he was trained to do it.. Except in certain specific circumstances I would contest that statement , but the point is, IF you are capable of getting out of a situation you would have had enough brains and training not to get into it, in the first place. Stowel is correct in saying that panicking is going to end badly and that having control of a plane is better than stalling spinning.

 

I agree with Ultralights about the desireability of doing EMT. Certainly INSTRUCTORS should do it. They of all pilots should know the limits of their aircraft and themselves. How can they let the student go to the point where a bad outcome is getting pretty obvious If they don't know absolutely where that point is?. If you take over too early the student may not perceive that anything was going wrong that he wouldn't have coped with.

 

The accident statistics quoted there are pretty bad. 97% of accidents in GA OPS. USA of course, but there is no reason for it to be much different here...Nev

 

 

[old man emu]

As at the end of 2011, there were approximately 615,000 active certificated pilots in the USA.

 

475 aviation related fatalities is 0.08% of the total number of pilots. Don't forget that in multiple fatality incidents (two or more deceased) there is usually only one pilot in that number, so it would be reasonable to put the percentage of pilot deaths at 60% of the 475, which is 285, or 0.046%.

 

Still safer to fly than drive to the airfield.

 

OME

 

 

[facthunter]

I'm not sure about that OME but IF you are operating a large passenger jet for a living it might easily be the case. To my mind the thing that stands out with light aircraft accidents is the feeling of "preventability" about many of them. I know when I read of some pilot who has taken his child for a ride in his plane and when a bit of weather comes through, and on return he has rolled it into a ball of fire and it's all over for them. when a bit of extra training or a diversion would have altered the outcome.

 

Getting into the air does put you into a dangerous environment, but the plane is rarely the problem. It is the Human factor that emerges most times. Nev

 

 

[fly_tornado]

When I was in Reno in 2011, on the Saturday night someone robbed the 711 next to my motel. 3 Shots fired, the last thing I needed after the galloping ghost.

 

 

[Gentreau]

Wasn't spin training originally removed from the syllabus because it was causing too many accidents ?

 

I can see the argument for instructors to do it however, as previously said, if you don't know the point of no return, how can you know when the student gets close to it ?

 

 

[facthunter]

I can imagine that FT. You would wonder when it ends.

 

Gentreau, the planes were not available. None of the 3 makes offered were certified for spin training and the syllabus was changed to incipient spin recovery only. The DH 82 was removed from the register as a primary trainer. You could still use it for spin training or other basic aerobatics which I was fortunate to get involved with because basically no one else was interested, at the Time where I was.. ( Rutherford, West Maitland).. Nev

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Funny thing is 8 days later, my last day in the US, I walked out of a restaurant and marked cop car pull up this old car with 2 black guys in it on the pedestrian crossing I was about to cross. The next cop in the unmarked car jumps out and points a Glock at them with me right behind them! Guys wearing his badge around the neck on a chain and a Hawaiian shirt, just like a movie set. Made a quick move to the other side of the street.

 

 

[facthunter]

Ft, Hope we don't get like that here. Nev

 

 

[Jabiru Phil]

I requested some spin training a few years ago and was pointed to a glider TIF as legal in training.

 

Seemed to have worked so far. Recommend if available and not expensive

 

 

[frank marriott]

My obversation

 

It doesn't appear to me that the students are having the problem - it appears to happen AFTER they get a licence - doing things outside what has been done in a controlled enviroment.

 

Personally I haven't had a aircraft in an unusal attititude [other then areobatics and recovery from unusual attitudes in a CIR rating or during a BFR].

 

Other then mechanical failure [engine or airframe] the majority of what I read about is someone doing something that they would not be doing during either training or a BFR.

 

The mental attitude of I can do this because I have seen someone else do it and I am a licenced pilot is probably a greater problem - and the answer, sorry I don't have one, other then encourage everyone to fly within their own and the particular aircraft's limits.

 

 

[old man emu]

At work we do a lot of aerobatic talking because a lot of our private customers fly Pitts airplanes. Recently we were discussing how to recover from a messed up manoeuvre in a Pitts.

 

The simple answer was to centralise the stick and pull off the power. The airplane will settle down and put itself in a position that is easier to recover from.

 

You've got to put some trust in the designer. Most of the airplanes we fly are stable in pitch, roll and yaw. If you don't do anything to make digression from the stable position any greater, then the airplane will recover itself to a stable position.

 

OME

 

 

[facthunter]

I used to have to recover from unusual attitudes under the hood on limited panel. I reckoned about the worst position I could be put in ( without being pointed straight at the ground ) was inverted nose up. My technique was a bit like OME's . Centralise controls and close the throttle. the plane usually settled into a spiral (or less likely) a spin and a quick look at the turn needle and airspeed would tell you which one it was and you applied the appropriate recovery technique. Sounds easy but without an AH the pitch attitude is not a snack. Nev