RAA Safety-Training-Compliance Coordinator appointed

[fly_tornado]

Ross, I didn't say that the hangars weren't full. That's part of the problem, not a lot of space for new blood.

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

That's not the way I read your comment FT., if you reckon the hangars are full, then please explain what the problem is ?..What exactly are all your full hangars telling you ?..We 've got new groups popping up here, new and used planes being bought, planes being built, and new hangars going up.......and a lot of flying going on............Maj...

 

 

[Mick]

unless these are all going on to buy new aircraft.

The answer to that is in the number of new registrations, or lack thereof. These numbers are on their way to be less than 1/4 per annum than what they were 5 years ago. I personally don't believe this is due to the registration issues, there are just not as many new aircraft being completed or bought.

 

 

[Gnarly Gnu]

They seem to have caused an Australia wide glut of used cars currently for sale also.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

That's not the way I read your comment FT., if you reckon the hangars are full, then please explain what the problem is ?..What exactly are all your full hangars telling you ?..We 've got new groups popping up here, new and used planes being bought, planes being built, and new hangars going up.......and a lot of flying going on............Maj...

Any idea why there are so many used planes on the market? Its either a lot of pilots getting out of the planes or a lot of pilots not buying planes. or a bit of both. If there where a lot of hangars being built you would expect the amount of hangar space to be increasing as the RAA only registered 120 new planes this year. I got no idea how many lost their registration.

 

 

[FlyingVizsla]

Profit & Loss statements up to the end of May 2013 - extrapolated to the end of June 2013 and compared to last financial year:

 

Memberships down about 5% (financial growth in previous years 7%, 5%, 12%)

 

Aircraft Registrations down by 15% (previous growth 13%, 16%, 15%)

 

Members Market Advertising up 24% or 13% (prior year description not clear)

 

Income is down 8.7%, Expenditure up 7.2% on last year.

 

Our hangar is full of aircraft that are now out of registration, to get them renewed is maybe a bridge too far, particularly for one. Unfortunately the previous years' financials don't have enough detail to compare new registrations for each year. There's still planes in hangars, but less are flying, and people not flying are not renewing memberships.

 

Sue

 

 

[turboplanner]

Thanks Sue for some honesty after top outrageously inaccurate posts above.

 

 

[dodo]

They seem to have caused an Australia wide glut of used cars currently for sale also.

I suspect the used car market is more influenced by other factors.

It would be interesting to see how the market for used yachts in the same sort of price range is going, as yachts have similar costs (purchase and ongoing), also a similar lack of economic function.

 

dodo

 

 

[FlyingVizsla]

RAA supplies statistics to the Bureau of Infrastructure, Transport and Regional Economics (BITRE) for each calendar year, as does every other aircraft operator. RAA gets this data from you when you re-register your aircraft and then rolls that up into an annual summary for BITRE. The results are published each year. Unfortunately 2010 was released in Jan 2012, which means waiting till 2015 to get the years 2012 & 2013 to see if there was a downturn. Unless RAA release their information earlier. You can read the full reports for each year here:

 

http://www.bitre.gov.au/publications/ongoing/general_aviation_activity.aspx

 

Below: a snapshot of the hours flown by category - perhaps someone could offer some conjecture as to why the hours dipped in 2010, particularly for certified aircraft. What was happening, apart from Qld cyclones & floods? The GFC 2007/2008 didn't seem to affect flying hours.

 

 

 

[AlfaRomeo]

. . . the hounds . . . so the hounds . . . As the hounds are quiet and still, not even a little yap. . . . Regards

With a post full of childish pejoratives one is best off to remain quiet. Responding to a petulant child just encourages it to further immature behaviour. Why would anyone respond to such impoliteness?

 

 

[AlfaRomeo]

So the logic is now, if you don't hear anything that means things must be good?

I have been in (two way) contact with the Board, the General Manager, the President and the Treasurer. This communication has involved offers to assist wherever I could be useful and requests from them for assistance to which I have promptly responded. I have also been in two-way communication with the Constitution Review Committee and the restructure Committee.

 

From these communications I can assure you that the General Manager is putting in an enormous effort with minimal assistance. He has no Admin Manager and is covering a lot of that work himself with the rest being picked up by our very willing office staff. It is normally the job of the Admin Manager to keep the website up-to-date but that falls to the GM at the moment.

 

Similarly, the Tech staff are putting in a massive effort, against the odds, to try and dig us out of the Rego issues.

 

The office is struggling with an impossible workload and they do need us to cut them some slack.

 

In NSW you have three Board Members that are YOUR personal representatives on the Board. If you are curious about what is going on try asking your Board Rep instead of bleating on a forum. I know this is a sub-standard way of getting the message out to 10,000 members. But, you have to accept that this Board and and the previous management, and their predecessors for the last 5 years at least, have dug this hole. It is going to take a lot more work to fill it back in. The new Executive and Management are doing a good, honest job and are following the rules. There is a 100 times more information coming through than we have ever seen.

 

 

[turboplanner]

....ask your board rep........

 

Reminds me of a dog returning to its vomit.

 

Why?

 

Why isn't the Association communicating publicly with its members?

 

What is there to hide?

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Harsh!

 

 

[DWF]

I have been in (two way) contact with the Board, the General Manager, the President and the Treasurer. This communication has involved offers to assist wherever I could be useful and requests from them for assistance to which I have promptly responded. I have also been in two-way communication with the Constitution Review Committee and the restructure Committee.From these communications I can assure you that the General Manager is putting in an enormous effort with minimal assistance.

So have you obtained any useful information or just passed the time of day?

 

He has no Admin Manager

Why not? Too busy to recruit one? Not considered necessary by the board?

 

and is covering a lot of that work himself with the rest being picked up by our very willing office staff. It is normally the job of the Admin Manager to keep the website up-to-date but that falls to the GM at the moment.

Surely a Board member could spare some time to post some plans and information on the web site. Most people could be trained to do it in an hour or so and it could be done from the comfort of their own home if necessary.

 

Similarly, the Tech staff are putting in a massive effort, against the odds, to try and dig us out of the Rego issues.

The office is struggling with an impossible workload and they do need us to cut them some slack.

I am confident that the GM and his staff are doing their best to extricate the Association from the mess we have been landed in, however there is very little information available to support this confidence. Maybe it is more hope than confidence.

 

In NSW you have three Board Members that are YOUR personal representatives on the Board.

In WA we do not currently have a Board member!

We are currently receiving the same amount of information from our Board member as we have had for the last 2 years.

 

If you are curious about what is going on try asking your Board Rep instead of bleating on a forum. I know this is a sub-standard way of getting the message out to 10,000 members. But, you have to accept that this Board and and the previous management, and their predecessors for the last 5 years at least, have dug this hole. It is going to take a lot more work to fill it back in. The new Executive and Management are doing a good, honest job and are following the rules. There is a 100 times more information coming through than we have ever seen.

If members were kept informed of plans and progress via the web site, magazine and possibly emails the Board and staff would not have their time taken up by being pestered with queries from concerned members (as would be the case if we all followed your advice and made the call) and they would be able to get on with the important tasks they have been paid/elected to do.

 

A few minutes a week devoted to keeping members informed would save everyone a lot of time and angst. (And possibly considerably reduce the posts on this site. )

 

DWF

 

 

[poteroo]

Hear, hear DWF. Our last Board member was shocked when told that it would be quite instructive were he to venture out and talk with the CFI's around the region. The FTF's are the frontline for RAAus - yet the last to hear anything. Still, that's the way CASA treats the flying schools, so I guess there isn't much of an example for RAAus to follow.

 

not happy days,

 

 

[David Isaac]

Alfa,

 

You and I know both too well that "calling your Rep" is NOT the way for the Board to communicate with the members as DWF has so eloquently stated above. Please do NOT perpetuate that BS line.

 

A note a week on the web site (provided the note 'communicates') will keep the complaints at bay. As busy as they all are the most important thing is to keep the members abreast of the situation.

 

A wall of silence just perpetuates the systemic issues within the RA Aus management.

 

 

[facthunter]

There are less people there now from what I have heard. I believe they are pulling together. (That would be of benefit). I wish them success and one thing WE ALL know is that there is much to be done. That is not in dispute. Nev

 

 

[Keith Page]

With a post full of childish pejoratives one is best off to remain quiet. Responding to a petulant child just encourages it to further immature behaviour. Why would anyone respond to such impoliteness?

Well you did Alfa old friend even Rat came out and made a comment, well it got your minds active.

 

Alfa you are pushing your mates brigade.

 

I can not get my head around why all the silence now. I have seen members on this forum saying that is OK, and last executive the silence was not OK for them.

 

I can not figure that one. Must be which club they belong to.

 

Governance/systems/processes who has worked with all that, that is warm fuzzy stuff which has come out of business schools which is to make things work better. Now look at some big companies what dramas they have, their reason for trading at times is secondary to governance/systems/processes.

 

How I understand what we are hearing my interpretation, there are different political groups within the organisation with their own personal agendas and it is mates brigade again, so what is new.

 

There is news out there- * People do not go out of their way and do things incorrectly there heart and sole is in for correctness. So why the fuss?

 

*Every one has good ideas, small modifications, plus a bit, minus a bit works a treat.

 

*So why is this big noise about we are doomed. Egos.

 

Regards

 

Keith Page

 

 

[fly_tornado]

You obviously know something Keith, that we do not.

 

 

[dodo]

Governance/systems/processes who has worked with all that, that is warm fuzzy stuff which has come out of business schools which is to make things work better. Now look at some big companies what dramas they have, their reason for trading at times is secondary to governance/systems/processes.

The RA-Aus equivalent would be aircraft registrations. Poor governance is a direct cause of the lack of ability to register aircraft.

 

As to the silence - nothing has changed, as far as I know. If the board is now working better together, we would not know.

 

dodo

 

 

[Keith Page]

Hi All

 

This governance/systems/process thing is to remove some of the responsibility from the person to the system and process. If things do work it is the system and process at fault not a person. Then the crowd sets forth for the fix on the system and process and normally fix it with another rule when all that is finished we must endeavor to get some production, after analyising what you have there, production is only a byproduct, the good operators know this and they work around it. Hence Ed and Myles with there band of movers and shovors 8. It has been about 8 weeks since the noise started on the thread.

 

Yes Fly I am privy to somethings if I had the lot I would be not so low key, bit of information changes which make things hard, I can work with that.

 

As for Alfa he sat there and picked holes in what I was trying to warn to and say, no interpreting the information was involved, he demonstrated that to all by the way he answered me. Could be ego???

 

Only the members of the boys club say they are working hard, "Where is the evidence?"

 

I have not seen a crumb.

 

Regards

 

Keith Page

 

 

[Keith Page]

The RA-Aus equivalent would be aircraft registrations. Poor governance is a direct cause of the lack of ability to register aircraft.As to the silence - nothing has changed, as far as I know. If the board is now working better together, we would not know.

 

dodo

Good Morning DoDo

I am not up to speed with the registration process however it should not be over difficult to set up, like do it now while the place is on the correction phase, correct it for the end product not stop gap thing, like pick it up only once not many times.

 

As the registration issue there will be hidden point to work through not hard just time consuming

 

Regards

 

Keith Page

 

 

[fly_tornado]

That's not the way I read your comment FT., if you reckon the hangars are full, then please explain what the problem is ?..What exactly are all your full hangars telling you ?..We 've got new groups popping up here, new and used planes being bought, planes being built, and new hangars going up.......and a lot of flying going on............Maj...

Can I ask you why you want to be a rep for the RAA?

 

 

[dodo]

Good Morning DoDoI am not up to speed with the registration process however it should not be over difficult to set up, like do it now while the place is on the correction phase, correct it for the end product not stop gap thing, like pick it up only once not many times.

As the registration issue there will be hidden point to work through not hard just time consuming

 

Regards

 

Keith Page

The removal of our ability to register aircraft was because we failed four audits.

 

The underlying cause of failing four audits appears to be poor record keeping, some poor decisions, and no oversight by the board.

 

In other words: poor governance.

 

As to your comments on communication, I agree, except your time frames appear odd: the communication problem has existed for years, and the complaints in loud volume have been since November 2012 when it became apparent how bad the situation was.

 

dodo

 

 

[Keith Page]

The removal of our ability to register aircraft was because we failed four audits. The underlying cause of failing four audits appears to be poor record keeping, some poor decisions, and no oversight by the board.

In other words: poor governance.

 

As to your comments on communication, I agree, except your time frames appear odd: the communication problem has existed for years, and the complaints in loud volume have been since November 2012 when it became apparent how bad the situation was.

 

Here we are, good education and stick with the plan do it all once and form data bases, that is a system, even before it gets to governance for a head ache.

 

Regards

 

Keith Page

 

dodo