Flying helmets

[djpacro]

I also just remembered the XXXX Pitts special which went down at Gatton some years ago- vertical climb, radio popped out and nailed the pilot in the forehead and knocked him out I think?

I am not aware of that so I don't believe that was a factor in any serious Pitts accident.I do know of many Pitts accidents where the aeroplane has been demolished on impact with the ground and the pilot (no helmet) survived with only minor injuries. Fairly safe cockpit in my opinion.

I am also aware of accidents in other types which were survivable if only the pilot had worn a helmet.

 

 

[facthunter]

A good well anchored five point inertial harness and proper cockpit and fire proof suit is what you need if mustering etc. A heavy helmet could break your neck.Nev

 

 

[Downunder]

I would like a five point.

 

The four point is not very effective.

 

I find you can keep tightening the shoulder straps and the waist band simply rides up.

 

As a result it is not as tight as I would like.

 

 

[Gentreau]

You don't necessarily have to go for a full blown aviation (read expensive) helmet. What about looking at one made for race and rallying ?

 

For example: http://www.jjcraceandrally.com/rally/open-face-helmets

 

I'm sure there's an equivalent supplier in Oz.

 

.

 

 

[icebob]

Hi all,

 

I remember some time ago there was a thread about this and someone pointed out a company from England made helo helmets for passengers of rescue helicopters and then the price was about 350 pounds posted to Australia, The construction was like the "Dave Clark" style, do not remember the name of the company, sorry, I can either blame old age or "the drink", ha, ha.

 

Bob.

 

 

[Zibi]

I use one of those in my trike: http://www.microavionics.co.uk/Helmets%20and%20Visors.html

 

There's also http://www.icaro2000.com/Products/Helmets/UL-models.htm

 

And probably couple other.

 

 

[djpacro]

UK CAA recommendations for aerobatic pilots:

 

– Gloves give protection against fire and abrasion in an accident, and absorb perspiration, thus improving grip.– Overalls, made from natural fibres, with close fitting ankles, collar and wrists give fire protection and prevent snagging of controls. Zippered pockets prevent any small items, essential for the flight, from falling out and fouling controls.

– Adequate head and face/eye protection is strongly recommended, particularly when flying open cockpit aeroplanes. Lightweight helmets will minimise discomfort under increased ‘G’ loadings.

 

– Leather flying boots, with laces tucked away, give greatest protection. Trainers provide inadequate protection against impact and fire.

 

– A parachute, if worn, should be comfortable and well fitting with surplus webbing tucked away before flight. It should be maintained in accordance with manufacturer’s recommendations.

 

Know how to use it, after all, you may only need it once!

 

– Don’t take any potential loose articles e.g. coins, keys.

Some may be useful to consider for other flying operations.

[Lior]

When I took flying lessons, helmets were mandatory on Ultralights. I ended up getting a pair of light plastic Mil-Force helmets for my first plane, the Zenair 701 on the left. Ripped out half the lining to leave room for some headsets. Most of the guys flying in enclosed cockpits did not use them. A few years later they relaxed the regulations and left helmets compulsory for open cockpits only. I quit using Mil-Force helmets as soon as I could and have not looked back. I put lots of faith in shoulder harnesses. Then again touch wood it has never been necessary. These days I fly a drifter with Flycom lids between my thinktank and the elements. Besides ballistic cranial protection, masking the microphones from any ambient noise is a huge plus on Flycoms - using them is actually fun.

 

 

[dazza 38]

When I took flying lessons, helmets were mandatory on Ultralights. I ended up getting a pair of light plastic Mil-Force helmets for my first plane, the Zenair 701 on the left. Ripped out half the lining to leave room for some headsets. Most of the guys flying in enclosed cockpits did not use them. A few years later they relaxed the regulations and left helmets compulsory for open cockpits only. I quit using Mil-Force helmets as soon as I could and have not looked back. I put lots of faith in shoulder harnesses. Then again touch wood it has never been necessary. These days I fly a drifter with Flycom lids between my thinktank and the elements. Besides ballistic cranial protection, masking the microphones from any ambient noise is a huge plus on Flycoms - using them is actually fun.

Hi Lior, My Drifter came with a pair of ICARO 2000 helmets. They are very good.

 

 

[Head in the clouds]

Interesting thread, thanks Biggles.

 

No offence meant, but I don't agree with your comment about getting incapacitated from a bump on the head in turbulence, I've flown half a lifetime in areas of severe turbulence and never yet bashed my head, I do keep my belts tight though ...

 

Generally I don't wear a helmet flying ultralights/LSA, the main reason is that I usually fly with pax and offering a helmet to someone new to flying usually starts a nervous tic at the corner of the eye thing. For test flying a new plane, throwing one around or conducting aerial work I always wear it. I think there is a strong case for wearing them if you're doing something more adventurous than just cruising, I've lost three friends doing 'silly things' in ultralights who most certainly would be alive if they'd worn one, and another who wouldn't have had to live the second half of his life with seriously debilitating brain damage.

 

When I first came across the use of helmets in ultralights, in the early/mid 1980s I have to admit that most of us scoffed at those who did. I started mustering in R22s/H300s in 1990 and most people did wear them so I followed suit and bought a Gentex that was someone's unwanted present, they were $1000 at the time and I only had to pay $100, I think it was the best $100 I ever spent. The first thing I discovered was the improved concentration from not being buffeted constantly - we flew with the doors off - and the next thing was the very quiet environment, the ear seals work so much better within the helmet, so although it was quiet I could hear the engine much better and when working low level in confined areas it's nice to be sure you'll not miss it if the engine has a hiccup.

 

The next thing I really liked was being able to hear the radio as if I was listening to my home stereo, and as a result my radio work improved by leaps and bounds, as did my awareness of other traffic.

 

The drop-down full-face visors were the next real blessing. In the glare up north I always needed the best quality sunglasses, a significant expense in themselves, and the arms of them inevitably hold the ear-seals (of a headset) open just enough to spoil the serenity, even with ANR (or especially with ANR). So it's great to have the tinted visor for the bright part of the day instead of sunnies, and the clear visor to keep dust and debris out of your eyes in the first light of day, as well as masking the microphone against wind and blade noise. The wide visors are better than any sunglasses as far as peripheral vision is concerned, and sometimes a glimpse of that tree branch or other aircraft in the corner of your vision can make all the difference.

 

A good quality helmet is not heavy, mine is kevlar, and I never notice any problem with the weight, and the fully adjustable internal net and padding makes it very comfortable, wearing a headset clamped over sunnies for many hours a day always give me a headache, the helmet never does.

 

I've often heard the argument that the weight of a helmet can break your neck in a crash but the statistics don't seem to bear that out. Certainly they use helmet restraints in Formula 1 for example but I don't think the comparison really applies. From the crash reports that I've read the use of a helmet doesn't appear to add to the likelihood of neck injury in planes/helicopters and it certainly makes a dramatic difference to avoiding head/brain injuries. I wouldn't consider conducting any form of aerial work or flight testing without it.

 

 

[Guest Nobody]

The problem here lies with socialised healthcare we have in Australia. I agree you should be free to ride without a helmet if you wish but only on condition you agree to pay for all your medical costs in the event of an accident that resulted in any head trauma.

Be careful using this line. What will you say to someone who says exactly the same thing but uses " fly a recreational aircraft" instead of " ride without a helmet"?

 

 

[Zibi]

The problem here lies with socialised healthcare we have in Australia. I agree you should be free to ride without a helmet if you wish but only on condition you agree to pay for all your medical costs in the event of an accident that resulted in any head trauma.

Be careful using this line. What will you say to someone who says exactly the same thing but uses " fly a recreational aircraft" instead of " ride without a helmet"?

 

It's a bad argument anyway, as as soon as you start using it you have to ask: what about overweight people - do you want to charge them for heart surgery ?

 

How about smokers - no free health care for them either?

 

And so on...

 

 

[biggles5128]

Its getting a little off the track... however I feel the need to express my view on some of the posts. Those that choose not to wear or disagree with the law in relation to helmets while riding bikes, let me say this... If you are involved in a collision you are more likely to be seriously injured or killed, the paramedics that attend your accident, the police that investigate the incident, the hospitals and rehabilitation centres that try to save your life all come at a huge cost, thats if you survive. Now if you don't survive do you have any idea how much it costs to respond accident investigation and possibly a coronial inquiry, the many hours police will spend preparing a report for the coroner (while their time could be much better spent patrolling your neighbourhood to stop people from breaking into houses). That is only the monetary costs. Have a think about the cost of emotional trauma of the rescuers, the police that have to knock on the door of your next of kin to inform them that you have been killed, to see that person fall into a screaming heap on the floor because their world has just collapsed. The driver of the other vehicle involved has to live with this fact even if was not their fault. The laws for motorcycles have been made for a reason. I have never suggested that helmets be made compulsory in aircraft just opening a line of discussion. Zibi, I don't condone smoking however I think the poor old smoker has well and truly paid his medical bills through the enormous amount of tax he has paid while buying every packet of cigarettes.

 

One reason I love Australia is the freedom of speech, I do think that we at times don't look at the big picture and the ramifications of some of our actions or inactions as the case might be.

 

 

[spacesailor]

GEE! I'm always in the wrong, don't wear a hat, got to hospital after the accident were they took a blood sample & when it returned negative told me to pee off home, now the hospital wants money for corrective surgery to my arm damaged when the

 

bikey hit ME,

 

Had my 1st bike ride in 50 years still with no helmet as I cant stand them on my head.

 

spacesailor

 

 

[M61A1]

Its getting a little off the track... however I feel the need to express my view on some of the posts. Those that choose not to wear or disagree with the law in relation to helmets while riding bikes, let me say this... If you are involved in a collision you are more likely to be seriously injured or killed, the paramedics that attend your accident, the police that investigate the incident, the hospitals and rehabilitation centres that try to save your life all come at a huge cost, thats if you survive. Now if you don't survive do you have any idea how much it costs to respond accident investigation and possibly a coronial inquiry, the many hours police will spend preparing a report for the coroner (while their time could be much better spent patrolling your neighbourhood to stop people from breaking into houses). That is only the monetary costs. Have a think about the cost of emotional trauma of the rescuers, the police that have to knock on the door of your next of kin to inform them that you have been killed, to see that person fall into a screaming heap on the floor because their world has just collapsed. The driver of the other vehicle involved has to live with this fact even if was not their fault. The laws for motorcycles have been made for a reason. I have never suggested that helmets be made compulsory in aircraft just opening a line of discussion. Zibi, I don't condone smoking however I think the poor old smoker has well and truly paid his medical bills through the enormous amount of tax he has paid while buying every packet of cigarettes.One reason I love Australia is the freedom of speech, I do think that we at times don't look at the big picture and the ramifications of some of our actions or inactions as the case might be.

By that logic we would all be wearing them in all vehicles, I have read that around 50% of vehicle related fatalities involve head injuries. But they wont legislate that. because Joe public won't cop it, they're not a minority. I choose to use protection where I can, but I'm all for letting natural selection run it's course. I have my own views on the other content, let's just say it's not popular with the "we need to protect people from themselves " crowd.

[Guest Fred]

I wear a leather helmet with velcro on top to keep my david clark headsets on when I am flying my Aerochute,because helmets insulate me from

 

the real flying wind in your face feeling, plus helmets are soooo bulky,plus I have a roll cage for safety anyway.

 

 

[Chrism]

By that logic we would all be wearing them in all vehicles, I have read that around 50% of vehicle related fatalities involve head injuries. But they wont legislate that. because Joe public won't cop it, they're not a minority. I choose to use protection where I can, but I'm all for letting natural selection run it's course. I have my own views on the other content, let's just say it's not popular with the "we need to protect people from themselves " crowd.

I've heard the same too from road accident 'experts' that say that probably around 50% of those head trauma deaths (and injuries) could be prevented from wearing even bicycle type helmets in cars. But as you say; too hard to force so many voters to do so.

 

Great thread BTW

 

 

[Marty_d]

Enclosed cockpits with harness vs motorbike? Two different things. Your enclosed cockpit is far more similar to a car than a bike and as someone said, if you're not rallying or racing then you don't wear one in a car. I'm a fan of the 5-point harness and will be seriously considering putting them in the 701.

 

To anyone who likes the "wind in the hair" on a bike though, consider the following from the Motorcycle council of NSW:

 

"unhelmeted riders have 2-3 times the fatality rate of helmeted riders and twice the rate of serious brain injury (Ouellet & Kasantikul, 2006)."

 

http://www.roadsafety.mccofnsw.org.au/a/74.html

 

When I was young and even stupider than I am now, I went for a ride on the back of a mate's motorbike. We did 200km/h on a dirt road with no helmets. Looking back now I shiver at how stupid we were, and I dread the thought of my sons or daughter doing similar things.

 

Is that feeling of freedom worth the 2 - 3 times increased risk of leaving your brains over some power pole or spending the rest of your life eating through a straw?

 

 

[lark]

I read some years back that one of the unforseen flow-on effects when motorcycle helmets were made compulsory in California was a decline in the number retinas available for transplant purposes. Either lots of riders gave up motorcycling or the number of deaths decreased.

 

 

[Mark11]

I wear a helmet playing cricket and in my trike... Always have, always will!

 

 

[Deskpilot]

Anyone ever considered an open faced rally helmet with integral mic. Open faced but with some protection for your face in the event of a nose dive.

 

 

 

[Mark11]

I need the visor... But otherwise good idea

 

 

[ianwells]

Great thread. No has mentioned weather wearing protection actually increases the risk of an accident happening.

 

In England every weekend the weekend warriors on their Roadbikes head to the Yorshire Dales or North Wales to blast around the country side in full racing leathers with knee sliders to travel along roads designed 200 years ago for the horse and cart. No amount of body armour will save them when going through a drystone wall at 100 mph, but being so dressed they feel invincible.

 

Several people have already commented that they don't wear a helmet normally, but always do when doing ag work or test flying. So does wearing safety gear, helmets, leathers, fire proof suits, Death proof cars! actually make us take more risks and become less safe?

 

Just my thoughts

 

Ian

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

Bugger it, I've gone all wimpy and got myself a flying helmet! Took the grinder to my wife's old cycling helmet. The Dave Clark headset bolts in easily. Test fly tomorrow.

 

 

[M61A1]

Great thread. No has mentioned weather wearing protection actually increases the risk of an accident happening.In England every weekend the weekend warriors on their Roadbikes head to the Yorshire Dales or North Wales to blast around the country side in full racing leathers with knee sliders to travel along roads designed 200 years ago for the horse and cart. No amount of body armour will save them when going through a drystone wall at 100 mph, but being so dressed they feel invincible.

 

Several people have already commented that they don't wear a helmet normally, but always do when doing ag work or test flying. So does wearing safety gear, helmets, leathers, fire proof suits, Death proof cars! actually make us take more risks and become less safe?

 

Just my thoughts

 

Ian

I think he idea is that you use protective gear, when you know there is a higher risk. Nothing will guarantee your survival, but it turn an unsurvivable incident into a survivable one, or a major injury into a minor one.