Bad batch of Mogas

[AVOCET]

If it has not been posted yet, ask to cancel the order and for a refund.Use the ebay message system.I take it you paid with paypal.

If they refuse, you can still return it for a refund under the paypal/ebay system.

 

You will need to return it at your cost and registered but I think it would still be worth it.

 

I,ve sold semi-professionaly for a couple of years, so know a bit about the system.

 

In your message, make sure you state you will be returning it for a refund if they do send it and you would be unhappy with their service. Be polite butfirm and do not threaten.

I have left a message querying the high price , ill see what he says on Monday and then if not satisfied with his answer ill do as you say

 

Thanks

 

Cheers

 

 

[cherk]

No it didn't , I did a double drain check , but no sign of that creamy crud that was in an around the filter ,I've drained and flushed the whole system , two wing tanks and sump tank three times until clear ,

I've also pulled the throttle body apart to check that those fine holes were ok , they were fine .

 

I pulled the sump tank out and have re sealed it , so it's back together tomorrow and have another go ,

 

G'day Mike,

 

out of interest; is the filter a paper element type??

 

 

[Downunder]

"Stuff" can come out of dilution when subject to pressure/vaccum.

 

Perhaps the filter forced it out?

 

 

[Keenaviator]

Hi Mike, that link I put on this thread takes you to the medium filter at Skyshop for $42.

 

Laurie

 

BTW, the really small one I got has a big filter element like the big filter, just a smaller 'container' part. I'll send a photo.

 

 

[AVOCET]

G'day Mike,

 

out of interest; is the filter a paper element type??

There the Pro Flow in line 100 micron stainless steel element that screws apart for cleaning & reuse ,

 

Running the SDS fuel injection at 40 psi .

 

I've just installed the ryco filters out of both wing tanks , so I can keep a visual on the contence in the filter , before the fuel gets to the sump , filters & pumps

 

Mike

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

Please be carefull folks installing multiple fuel filters. Extra filters can increase the load on fuel pumps, and interfere with gravity - feed systems.......................Maj...

 

 

[AVOCET]

Please be carefull folks installing multiple fuel filters. Extra filters can increase the load on fuel pumps, and interfere with gravity - feed systems.......................Maj...

Maj , thanks for that , in my set up I have two separate fuel systems . The SDS has two 100 micron filters , one befor the pump and one after ,

 

The other is throttle body injection low pressure , runs of facet pump x 2 and also has two 100 micron filters , one before , one after ,

 

I did think about what you've mentioned ,

 

And because I've added the extra filter on each wing tank , ill be doing a flow test , both gravity flow & pumped flow ,

 

I guess the problem can arrise

 

when the first filter becomes partially full of gunk and starts to strain the pump and starve the engine of fuel .

 

Mike

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

Mike, the fact that around 60% of all engine failures are fuel related, dictates that they be kept as simple in design as possible, to assist in reliability. The part you leave on the ground is the part that'll never give you any problem..If there is one system on the plane that needs to be simple it's the fuel system.....Maj....

 

 

[alf jessup]

No it didn't , I did a double drain check , but no sign of that creamy crud that was in an around the filter ,I've drained and flushed the whole system , two wing tanks and sump tank three times until clear ,

I've also pulled the throttle body apart to check that those fine holes were ok , they were fine .

 

I pulled the sump tank out and have re sealed it , so it's back together tomorrow and have another go ,

Mike,

 

We had an interesting thing a few years back with fuel.

 

We refuelled my mates Foxbat with the Mr funnel and did the fuel drain and it was clean as a whistle, the fuel was Shell Vmax, we flew from WSL to Marlo happily purring along at about 5000rpm and landed at Marlo after an hour no probs.

 

Had a cuppa at terminal and a chin wag for another hour, did our run up then departed back to West Sale from runway 25, at about 300ft and overhead the keys I thought we shed a prop blade for a moment as the rotax engine with just 14 hours on the clock just ran like a bag of sh!t at full power, we reduced power below 4000rmp and it purred like a kitten.

 

Hence to say a shallow turn at reduced power was made and a tight circuit back onto 25 was conducted testing the engine again a number of times on downwind with the same result would not run smooth above 3800 rpm.

 

I spent well over an hour trying to find out what was wrong including removing the carby bowls and tested the fuel free flowing out of the tanks and it was pure so I thought it was a ignition problem after that, (never once thought to check the sump as we had drained it before the flight and hadn't added any more fuel) we left the aircraft at Marlo in a hangar as I was due to catch a commercial to Perth that evening.

 

In the end after the distributor flew up to Marlo with his mechanic a couple of weeks later they found about 2.5 litres of milky crud in the sump which gob smacked me as I watched the owner drain the sump prior to taking off at West Sale. (Foxbat has no wing drain points)

 

End result we believe was the aromatics in the Vmax must have dissolved some excess sealant in the tanks over the 14 hrs since new as Vmax was the only fuel ever ran in it and when we turned final into Marlo it must have moved into the sump as that is where the fuel is picked up from (I found this out later).

 

We obviously had enough clean fuel in the lines for the run up and the 900 meters we went before it turned ugly.

 

Pilot did a great job handling the partial power failure and the aircraft flew well on the power setting we had available for the return to landing.

 

So it just goes to show that other things still can catch you out even if you filter every drop.

 

NB: aircraft has been run on BP ultimate since this episode with no further problems encountered.

 

Cheers

 

Alf

 

 

[rgmwa]

They are both the 19/20 liter/ min . ones ,that's the medium one .

I contacted the seller in WA and expressed my disappointment , hasn't got back to me yet ,i mean if it was only a few bucks difference I wouldn't care , but we're taking around the $ 90 buck mark ,

 

I'm to depressed to work it out exactly !

Good thing you didn't buy this one. Only $265 incl postage!! What a rip-off. Same seller?

 

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/MR-FUNNEL-FUEL-FILTER-FUNNEL-19L-PER-MINUTE-KEEPS-OUT-WATER-DIRT-4WD-F8C-/251147509455?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3a798edecf

 

rgmwa

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

That's the size I use, it's great !..........but not at that price............

 

 

[AVOCET]

Wow , these aromatics seem to be a bit of a problem don't they ,

 

I've creamed the fibre glass tanks with a new Batch to cover up the old 3M product that jabiru used to coat their tanks with.

 

This new stuff is supposed to be impervious to alcohol , ethanol , additives , but maybe not tolulean .?

 

Caltex says tolulean desolves rubber ?

 

Yet they put in their fuel !

 

Mike

 

 

[alf jessup]

Wow , these aromatics seem to be a bit of a problem don't they ,I've creamed the fibre glass tanks with a new Batch to cover up the old 3M product that jabiru used to coat their tanks with.

This new stuff is supposed to be impervious to alcohol , ethanol , additives , but maybe not tolulean .?

 

Caltex says tolulean desolves rubber ?

 

Yet they put in their fuel !

 

Mike

Well that's what we believed was the problem, I did have a bit of trouble with my trike when using Vmax as it was eating the lining in the clear poly tank blocking my idle jets, I only found this out by Wal at Bert Floods as he guessed the fuel I was using and highlighted to me that clear poly tanks with Vmax and sunlight don't get along, apparently black poly tanks don't get affected he said.

 

I have done a 100hrs in the Tecnam almost since getting it last November using only BP 98 ultimate and had no issues as yet.

 

Alf

 

 

[AVOCET]

I've had a good run with BP 98 for a number of years , I think this last 40 lts I put in must have been contaminated somehow .

 

When I get my Mr F ill be using it at the pump before it goes into the Jerry can

 

Cheers .

 

 

[alf jessup]

I've had a good run with BP 98 for a number of years , I think this last 40 lts I put in must have been contaminated somehow .When I get my Mr F ill be using it at the pump before it goes into the Jerry can

Cheers .

I just fill into the container at the servo then Mr Funnel as it goes into the plane as that is where the funnel stays (in the plane)

The BP servo I use has recently in the last couple of years had new tanks put in.

 

 

[Downunder]

Good thing you didn't buy this one. Only $265 incl postage!! What a rip-off. Same seller?http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/MR-FUNNEL-FUEL-FILTER-FUNNEL-19L-PER-MINUTE-KEEPS-OUT-WATER-DIRT-4WD-F8C-/251147509455?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3a798edecf

 

rgmwa

Something strange going on there......if you click on " 71 sold" you can see the price history.

 

Mostly sold for $64.99 ......

 

Could be the owner is away and someone else is filling in.....

 

 

[AVOCET]

Something strange going on there......if you click on " 71 sold" you can see the price history.Mostly sold for $64.99 ......

Could be the owner is away and someone else is filling in.....

Thanks for that , it wouldn't be the first time they've made mistakes and overcharged .

Never seems to work the other way round !

 

Mike

 

 

[AVOCET]

I've just looked again on e bay and the 19 lt/min has gone up another $100 to $ 264.00

 

???? And no it's not an auction !

 

Mike

 

 

[BoxFat]

Wow , these aromatics seem to be a bit of a problem don't they , I've creamed the fibre glass tanks with a new Batch to cover up the old 3M product that jabiru used to coat their tanks with.

This new stuff is supposed to be impervious to alcohol , ethanol , additives , but maybe not tolulean .?

 

Caltex says tolulean desolves rubber ?

 

Yet they put in their fuel !

 

Mike

Hi Avocet,

 

Toluene is a natural component of gasoline, typically being present at 5 - 7 % m/m. Perhaps Caltex add more though (I don't know), whether to increase the octane rating or for other reasons. It causes rubber to swell, this property apparently having been suggested as a quick semi-quantitative test for the toluene level in gasoline.

 

Cheers,

 

BF

 

 

[motzartmerv]

I reckon you could be on to something

 

Mike. Creamy crap as apposed to particulate matter sounds like something may be dissolving perhaps.. I was about to ask if you have changed anythjng in the system and then I saw your post re the sealant. I'm not an engineer but I have seen fuel eat sealants out before with varying symptoms. Once in a gazelle it manifest by black flakes, and once in a jab tank it was like slimy creamy crap. The jab tank was a home built that the guy replaced fuel hoses in and the hose wasn't rated for avgas. Something to consider anyway :)

 

 

[AVOCET]

Hi Avocet,Toluene is a natural component of gasoline, typically being present at 5 - 7 % m/m. Perhaps Caltex add more though (I don't know), whether to increase the octane rating or for other reasons. It causes rubber to swell, this property apparently having been suggested as a quick semi-quantitative test for the toluene level in gasoline.

 

Cheers,

 

BF

Toluene in caltex vortex 98 is 35to48 %

 

BP 98 in this part of the country SA is up to 17% ,all added to increase octane rating .

 

The caltex makes fuel lines go soft

 

BP not so bad

 

Source of info caltex customer

 

service

 

Cheers .

 

 

[BoxFat]

Strewth! 35 to 48 % Toluene in Caltex 98 ?? There is no way I want fuel that could be almost half toluene in my flipping tanks ! I use 95 not 98 normally but my tanks were filled with 98 during a recent service. Hmmm...

 

 

[facthunter]

You need a TT plane . Tolerates Toluene. Nev

 

 

[AVOCET]

Strewth! 35 to 48 % Toluene in Caltex 98 ?? There is no way I want fuel that could be almost half toluene in my flipping tanks ! I use 95 not 98 normally but my tanks were filled with 98 during a recent service. Hmmm...

My fuel lines went soft and expanded with the C al 98 . That's why I started to look seriously into what was in this stuff !

 

Once I had drained it out the fuel lines went back to their original shape

 

There is a lot all ready been discussed of another thread : carnt remember.

 

Cheers

 

 

[AVOCET]

Yes I thought that sounded a little expensive Mike,are we talking the small one or the bigger one?..Been a few years now since I bought my big one from a local motorcycle shop. I seem to recall it was about 75-80 bucks or so. I mean you just have to have one, the very fine filter is worth it, and the sump that doesn't let any water through is just a bonus......Maj...

I just got a reply from e bay ,

 

They said they put the price up to discourage sales because they are low on stock & when I bourght one they put the price up another $ 100 , " to discourage sales even more !

 

It's now $264 .00 !

 

Gees what's the world coming to

 

Mike