Does a Passenger need to be a RAA member

[Thruster87]

Under the new requirements do passengers have to be RAA members so as to be covered by insurance? Cheers

 

 

[Guest J430]

Under which new requirements?

 

Did not have to before

 

J;)

 

 

[Thruster87]

It's in the followingNPRM 0603OS Reg 103.010 paragraph 2. Flight experience Cheers

 

 

[slartibartfast]

Surely Flight Experience covered in 103.010 is a different thing.

 

The carrying of passengers seems to be covered in 103.009 :-

 

103.009 Flight activities – all pilots(1) A flight for the following purposes may be conducted by a pilot in

command who is qualified and authorised by CASA or by a RAAO:

 

(a) the personal transport of the pilot;

 

(b) the personal sport or recreation of the pilot, including flights conducted

 

to seek sponsorship or to compete for a prize, trophy or award;

 

© practice in flying the aircraft;

 

(d) taking the aircraft to or from a place where maintenance on the aircraft

 

can be done, or has been done, or where the aircraft is to be

 

demonstrated or delivered to another person;

 

(e) carrying out a test, demonstration or display of the aircraft, including

 

but not limited to air displays and demonstrations for sale.

 

(2) A passenger may be carried on any flight that meets the criteria in

 

subregulation (1) and is authorised by the procedures manual of the relevant

 

RAAO or, if the aircraft is not administered by any RAAO, authorised by

 

CASA.

 

Note: In regulation 103.009 private arrangements apply between the pilot and passenger

 

in accordance with the parameters set out in the relevant RAAO manual.

Seems to answer my sponsorship question too.Ross

 

 

[Thruster87]

(2) For paragraph (1) (b) a flight is an air experience flight if:

 

(a) the purpose of the flight is for each passenger to experience a flight in

 

the aircraft;

 

(b) the procedures manual of the relevant RAAO contains procedures for

 

the authorisation of operators and pilots to conduct air experience

 

flights;

 

© the flight is conducted in accordance with the procedures for air

 

experience flights contained in the procedures manual of the relevant

 

RAAO;

 

(d) each passenger is a member of the RAAO.

 

Note: The purpose of membership for an air experience passenger is to ensure that the

 

passenger has acknowledged that the flight does not meet the safety requirements that

 

would apply to an airline flight and to provide a measure of compulsory insurance

 

protection to the passenger and the RAAO [Whats the diff I wonder] Cheers

 

 

[Guest brentc]

The wording of the above sounds like it's from the Warbird category ops manual where the passenger must acknowledge that the flight is a high risk exercise. I would suggest that an Air Experience flight is one where someone actually pays the operator for a joy-flight as such and your 'membership' is the fee that you pay for the experience and the RAAO is the operator of the flight using the aircraft for hire and reward.

 

What does this mean? My interpretation is 'joy flights' in RA aircraft, however as in warbirds they aren't allowed to be called 'joy' flights, but rather adventure flights or air experience flights.

 

 

[Thruster87]

Found this

 

1. CASR Part 132 development and improvement

 

Initial development

 

CASR Part 132 will prescribe the regulatory requirements and standards for the approval of operators that provide air experience flights in Australian-registered aircraft, other than those operations that are conducted under a CASR Part 149 organisation. The term 'air experience' in the context of this Part includes 'joy flights' and 'adventure flights' in either normal or limited category aircraft (e.g. 'warbirds').

 

Air experience flights are usually flights involving the carriage of passengers in aircraft used in trade and commerce, other than flights that are classified as air transport. However, flights in aircraft not used in trade and commerce and operated by, or on behalf of, community groups where CASA believes that some regulatory provisions in addition to the provisions of CASR Part 91 are required in the interests of safety, may also be classified as 'air experience flights' for the purposes of this Part.

 

Air experience flights will be limited to flights:

 

• undertaken in an Australian-registered aircraft with a certificated seating capacity of not more than 6,
   
   
  
• that takeoff and land at the same aerodrome, with no intermediate landing, and
   
   
  
• that remain within 50NM of that aerodrome during the flight.
   
  

 

 

 

 

[Guest disperse]

i can understand some of this but basicly .........no they don't ? is that correct ...ie i invite my mate to go for a fly.....he dosen't have to be a member . but he is not covered by any insurence from RAA....is that correct

 

 

[Guest brentc]

That is a fair assumption and is my understanding. He (your passenger) isn't covered by RA-Aus insurance as that is only for external 3rd parties for $5m. You'd need to obtain passenger liability insurance for him to be covered.

 

 

[Guest pelorus32]

Found this1. CASR Part 132 development and improvement

Initial development

 

CASR Part 132 will prescribe the regulatory requirements and standards for the approval of operators that provide air experience flights in Australian-registered aircraft, other than those operations that are conducted under a CASR Part 149 organisation. The term 'air experience' in the context of this Part includes 'joy flights' and 'adventure flights' in either normal or limited category aircraft (e.g. 'warbirds').

 

Air experience flights are usually flights involving the carriage of passengers in aircraft used in trade and commerce, other than flights that are classified as air transport. However, flights in aircraft not used in trade and commerce and operated by, or on behalf of, community groups where CASA believes that some regulatory provisions in addition to the provisions of CASR Part 91 are required in the interests of safety, may also be classified as 'air experience flights' for the purposes of this Part.

 

Air experience flights will be limited to flights:

 

• undertaken in an Australian-registered aircraft with a certificated seating capacity of not more than 6,
   
   
  
• that takeoff and land at the same aerodrome, with no intermediate landing, and
   
   
  
• that remain within 50NM of that aerodrome during the flight.
   
  

The exception in the first sentence will apply to us when Parts 103 and 149 are eventually passed. We will be "...under a CASR Part 149 organisation".

 

Mike