Jabiru Engine 2200 Mechanical Problem Reporting

[Russ]

So........with these Bing compensating carbs, alls good at alt, ?? and fuel burn ( at cruise ) is less........( carbs doing their thing ). From memory, i THINK...... i read in the POH, that over 5000 was "untested"..........i think.

 

The "tinkering bit".........nar...won't go there.

 

R

 

 

[Guest Andys@coffs]

as you increase altitude air quantity per same volume decreases. Carbs job is to produce right mixture of fuel vs air quantity. Lower total air/fuel mixture equals less power that's why naturally aspirated engines have a ceiling, once the power available as alt increases is no more than cruise requirements then all you can do is cruise, climbing no longer possible. At 9500 (talking J230 here) you still have power in excess of cruise, but not heaps and as such it takes longer to achieve the climb you want.

 

At the same time less dense air means your pitot instruments under read real speed, which picks up due to lower drag of less dense air. Of course even though the readings are lower, real speed on the GPS isn't, so the risk of exceeding vne becomes an issue to consider.

 

Regarding original question, it's my experience that if per km travelled you use more fuel its because you do that km slightly faster and there is no such thing as a free lunch. We aren't talking big deltas here the differences are small

 

Andy

 

 

[Keenaviator]

Indicated VNE stays the same with altitude for the same reason of decreased density.

 

 

[facthunter]

Whether you do better or worse depends on a lot of factors. If you consider what you gain and what you lose, the main thing you gain is the air is thinner so potentially less drag. If you don't have much power or a fairly big wing with extra lift capacity, you won't get there anyhow and be able to fly much above the stall speed in cruise. Colder air helps if you are going for height.

 

If you don't have a proper leaning of the mixture situation, I doubt you will gain anything much.

 

If you have a C/S prop and turbocharger and mixture leaning you have the tools to get some good figures.

 

AND as Andy says there are TRUE airspeed considerations with aeroelasticity (flutter). RV have some good stuff on that. You are mainly likely to encounter that on descent. where you might wind it up a bit..Nev

 

 

[Keenaviator]

When you descend your altitude decreases and the air density increases. If you 'wind it up a bit' you are increasing your IAS. If you monitor your IAS and keep it within the designer's limitations all will be good.

 

 

[facthunter]

No. all will not be good. It's important to get this right. Read the Vans stuff (but there's plenty of other material out there). The designer was trying to talk people out of overpowering his designs for that reason. Nev

 

 

[jetjr]

Follow Jabiru manuals to the letter and youll find plenty of mismatching data/advice

 

They arent certified and need tailoring to airframe and each pne is different

 

Blindly following maint manuals causes pleny of problems too

 

 

[rick-p]

No problems and still going strong!

 

 

[Russ]

yrs back, i was put onto K&N filters.......oil filters in particular, K&N produce a high performance range, high flow, high filtration etc etc.....this range also has easy removal / fitting......there is a large hex nut as part of the shell of the filter, it also has a suited hole through this nut for tie wire.

 

I have used these for yrs on my soob engines.........great.

 

The K&N part # ...KN HP-1003........( ryco Z386 ) order min 3, and they are freight free. Total landed $59.85.....( [email protected] )

 

russ

 

 

[jetjr]

Id suggest with nut it wont fit Jabiru engines even if they make a similar part, its a nice feature though.

 

The claim of high flow and fine filtration simply dont align, apart from a few exceptions they it is near impossible to achieve both with out increasing filter media surface area, ie bigger filter

 

Ive seen some K&N air filters let plenty of dust through - not really relevant for aircraft though

 

 

[Yenn]

Has anyone any experience of Rotec water cooled heads?

 

Talking to s friend of mine today he commented that he was having less trouble with his jab engine, now that he had removed the rotec heads and gone back to the jab heads. He said that after 230 hours there was wobble in the valves in the Rotec heads.

 

Reading their ads.they are touted as solving all your engine problems.

 

 

[facthunter]

They are probably almost essential in a pusher installation. How good is your friends aircleaner? Nev

 

 

[jetjr]

"Reading their ads.they are touted as solving all your engine problems."

 

So does info on new heads, hydaulic lifter, new throughbolts V 1,2,3 , roller lifters, flywheel attachments.

 

Guide wear is a common problem in air cooled too. Without changes to geometry or materials similar things will happen

 

Conceptof watercoolong is sound especially when done with better material used in heads but it isnt without compromise.

 

 

[Yenn]

I would assume his air cleaner was in good condition. I believe he went back to the old heads rather than installing new. His comment was that Rotec quality was not up to scratch

 

 

[geoffreywh]

Really, What did Rotec say about the problem?

 

 

[ricky m]

http://www.aviationsafetymagazine.com/airplane/LSA-Engine-Safety.html

 

Seems like a fair and well balanced article:)

 

 

[facthunter]

I couldn't find the date of publication. The HKS is not on the scene now, as far as I know. Well constructed by a Japanese maker. so indicative of how difficult this market is.

 

The article is balanced, I agree Perhaps the message is something like... No engine has a perfect record and attention to looking after it is necessary with all of them. If you are looking for a black and white answer ie "A" good "B" bad it's not there. There isn't one anyhow. There's no single silver bullet. Nev

 

 

[ricky m]

I couldn't find the date of publication. The HKS is not on the scene now, as far as I know. Well constructed by a Japanese maker. so indicative of how difficult this market is.The article is balanced, I agree Perhaps the message is something like... No engine has a perfect record and attention to looking after it is necessary with all of them. If you are looking for a black and white answer ie "A" good "B" bad it's not there. There isn't one anyhow. There's no single silver bullet. Nev

Absolutely agree nev.. Was nice to read a balanced non judgemental opinion. ;) that shows all things made have problems.

 

 

[febuys]

Hi my co-pilots, but especially those operating the Jabiru with the 22A engine.

 

I am very close to buying a SK 80 with a replaced engine (286 hours engine time) but the more I read and research these machines, the more I am getting confused.

 

I came across the following report which is damning for Jabiru in general. http://www.atsb.gov.au/publications/2013/ar-2013-107_research/

 

Here is the listed aircraft that I am looking at buying: Jabiru SK80 Microlite

 

Any input would be much appreciated!

 

Francois

 

 

[Camel]

Hi my co-pilots, but especially those operating the Jabiru with the 22A engine.I am very close to buying a SK 80 with a replaced engine (286 hours engine time) but the more I read and research these machines, the more I am getting confused.

 

I came across the following report which is damning for Jabiru in general. Engine failures and malfunctions in light aeroplanes 2009 - 2014

 

Here is the listed aircraft that I am looking at buying: Jabiru SK80 Microlite

 

Any input would be much appreciated!

 

Francois

Perhaps this explains a little.

 

 

 

[Camel]

Hi my co-pilots, but especially those operating the Jabiru with the 22A engine.I am very close to buying a SK 80 with a replaced engine (286 hours engine time) but the more I read and research these machines, the more I am getting confused.

 

I came across the following report which is damning for Jabiru in general. Engine failures and malfunctions in light aeroplanes 2009 - 2014

 

Here is the listed aircraft that I am looking at buying: Jabiru SK80 Microlite

 

Any input would be much appreciated!

 

Francois

Perhaps this helps too !

 

 

 

[Camel]

Hi my co-pilots, but especially those operating the Jabiru with the 22A engine.I am very close to buying a SK 80 with a replaced engine (286 hours engine time) but the more I read and research these machines, the more I am getting confused.

 

I came across the following report which is damning for Jabiru in general. Engine failures and malfunctions in light aeroplanes 2009 - 2014

 

Here is the listed aircraft that I am looking at buying: Jabiru SK80 Microlite

 

Any input would be much appreciated!

 

Francois

I am the person who obtained the freedom of information FOI from Casa and can be found on the website on another forum !

 

 

[Camel]

Hi my co-pilots, but especially those operating the Jabiru with the 22A engine.I am very close to buying a SK 80 with a replaced engine (286 hours engine time) but the more I read and research these machines, the more I am getting confused.

 

I came across the following report which is damning for Jabiru in general. Engine failures and malfunctions in light aeroplanes 2009 - 2014

 

Here is the listed aircraft that I am looking at buying: Jabiru SK80 Microlite

 

Any input would be much appreciated!

 

Francois

Casa are EXPERTS and Have successfully stamped out aviation manufacture to a minimum in this country ! a TRUE DISGRACE and the GENIUS PEOPLE who done all this are still at CASA except for the Director and they just keep coming and going as the rest run wild with their antics !

 

 

[facthunter]

That little effort by the CASA won't be regarded as their finest hour. . I doubt we can gain much by retrying the whole history here at the moment.. but the picture is blurred to say the least.. This aircraft may suit you But, the rudder and nosewheel have been modified since the early ones. The non hydraulic lifters( from my perspective) are better than the later ones. Some people got good service some others didn't. How your engine is serviced will be important. I also don't like the throttle position on the early planes either.. They perform well if a little more demanding in pilot skill than some of the later models also a bit cramped.. Jabiru's overall are quite safe planes. by most comparisons.. Keep a wooden prop on them and treat the nosewheel gently.. Flywheel retention and tappet adjustment and head tensioning/ compression checking are very important. IF a cylinder goes soft fix it. It won't fix itself. Parts were cheap but future availability is not assured for the older models.. The later stuff is better in my humble opinion, but that's your choice. There's always more planes for sale. Get advice from owners. who are still actively flying them. Nev

 

 

[derekliston]

I have a 2200 solid lifter engine on my CH701. I also have the new composite prop supplied by Jabiru. I am very happy with the engine performance and as a retired LAME I am convinced that a lot, if not all of the problems are caused by insufficient or improper maintenance. One problem I did have however was an oil leak that proved very difficult to trace. It was not a lot but would leave Aline of oil along the bottoms of the pushrods tubes and a very light smear on the bottom cowling. So little that after a couple of hours flying the difference was barely noticeable on the dipstick. Eventually found that it was what I consider a design glitch by Jabiru. They had apparently a problem with oil draining from the rocker boxes back to the crankcase on hydraulic lifter engines and their solution was to drill a small hole inside the top of the rocker box through to the area between the fins. When I eventually figured it out and blocked those holes, no more oil leaks. I hope that as a solid lifter engine I won’t have the oil drainage problem, but I will monitor the situation closely. I’d be interested to hear of anyone else with a similar experience. The main problem I have is not flying often enough, between ‘grey nomad’ travel and crappy weather I’m just not getting the hours.