cficare Posted December 30, 2011 Posted December 30, 2011 I can't find it in the syllabus, i don't believe it is very useful for RAA pilots, and, I reckon it will prevent many cross-country pilots from getting the endorsenent (should the local CFI require a demonstration of ability to apply it)....any thoughts??? PS There are "other" ways of correcting your heading which I reckon are easier to apply and understand.
dazza 38 Posted December 30, 2011 Posted December 30, 2011 Yes I have thoughts, but Im not saying here.:)
dazza 38 Posted December 30, 2011 Posted December 30, 2011 Im with you CFI.I didnt have to do a 1 in 60 for my RAA X country.But that was because I did about 15 hours of Navs in GA where I had to demonstrate it and that is written in my log book and my instructors signature and ARN number is beside the entry.I have never used it since. I have added this post because my above post, may have opened up a can of worms.
Ignition Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 This again CFI??? Assuming you are going on about the same old 1 in 60 debate like last time where it would appear you are saying it is a waste of time and therefore shouldn't be taught, heres my response: There may or may not be anything set in stone saying 'you must do a 1 in 60 rather than other correction methods', I can't be bothered to dig through the RAA website at the moment for relevant documents. How ever, what is the big issue with it? Sure, it may not be the best method in your view, how ever it is one of many as you have already stated. Why not teach your students ALL of the different methods, and let them decide which they feel comfortable with, sure some will pick other methods as their preference, but other students will feel more comfortable with the 1 in 60 method. Ultimately, it comes down to the person flying the plane, everyone is individual, with individual preferences... In a way, saying instructors should completely stop teaching the 1 in 60 is like saying people should stop flying a Jabiru, and instead fly a Gazelle, because you find one is easier. Everyone is capable of deciding which they prefer, so teach them everything you can, and let them decide based on an informed decision with all the options rather than an incomplete list. If you would like CFI, (If they let you through customs) I am sure there are some instructors in Australia, maybe south of Sydney, that would be more than happy to show you how to do a 1 in 60 and why it is a perfectly reasonable and simple method; who knows, after you know how to do it, maybe you'll find that you like it compared to other correction methods. ;)
turboplanner Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 IGGY's right CFI, 1 in 60 is essential knowledge. Doesn't make any sense where you are because you have continuous landmarks, but it's a different story in many parts of Australia where landmarks are few and far between. Why dumb down students?
cficare Posted December 31, 2011 Author Posted December 31, 2011 i have no grieif with 1 in 60's...i do them all the time as a check on the VOR etc.... my worry is that many RAA pilots (ussualy, but not always older) are not good with numbers and have heaps of trouble grasping the concept...many have no trouble grabbing a protractor and reading the course correction (quite accurately) required... there is nothing essential about 1 in 60's..it's just another way of getting the job done...and fairly inefficient as well.. it ain't part of the RAA syllabus and needs to be acepted as another thing u can use to correct tracking errors... if u cant work out where u are on the map...your buggered!....doesn't matter what u are using! PPS i posted this in the hope that there will some vigourous debate (unlike happens in 'another place'....)
cficare Posted December 31, 2011 Author Posted December 31, 2011 seem to be 'scaring' a few off...from another site...
TAA Student Pilot Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 Was taught the 1 nin 60 rule when I started flying for a living over 30 years ago. Haven't used it since, have covered most of this country including remote/desert work never used it.
bas Posted January 2, 2012 Posted January 2, 2012 When doing DR, 1 in 60 is so easy and precise and can be done of the top of your head; nothing to measure or write down. I don't see why anyone would want to attempt to get a map spread out and flat enough to put a protractor on it while maintaining altitude and heading; basically an impossible thing to do on any aircraft with a stick between your legs.
coljones Posted January 21, 2012 Posted January 21, 2012 ! in 60 should be used as part of a flight planning process. You plan your flight, you choose waypoints based on a number of criteria including "can I see it if I am off course and will it assist me in getting back on course" and a method of gauging how far you are off course and how to get back. Some people use angle markings, some people use 1 in 60. Others use a GPS and others are lucky to find that everytime they fly they are bang on the mark of every waypoint. Others just follow roads and rail (IFR) NB following powerlines is not recommended as they can become invisible - we need to have them painted bright orange.. If your waypoints are in miles not minutes and they are in simple divisions of 60, say around 20 or 30 miles apart then the 1 in 60 is easy to use. (oh, bugger I have just got into the miles v minutes war - oops) 1 in 60 is OK provided you don't complicate it. Cheeers Col
cficare Posted January 21, 2012 Author Posted January 21, 2012 come for a fly with me turbs.....u will love it....
Guest avi8tr Posted January 21, 2012 Posted January 21, 2012 During my AFR today the instructor mentioned 1 in 60. Sounded too hard with the weather in front as a distraction so I pulled one out of the bag and used the VOR to find where I had to go. It was remarkably easy. Unfortunately the VOR isn't always available but it's great whilst they are nearby. 'Twas very quiet in the skies today even though it was a nice smooth ride.
bas Posted January 21, 2012 Posted January 21, 2012 If your waypoints are simple divisions of 60, say around 20 or 30 miles apart then the 1 in 60 is easy to use. Nah, I just pick easy to find points; crossing a road at right angles, a road intersection, abeam a town or lake, etc. then just round up to the nearest easy one; 13 miles is close enough to 4x, 18 close enough to 3, etc. We're not flying across oceans here, just 50 to 80 mile legs! It won't make much difference.
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