noise certification or pandora's chocolate box

[DrZoos]

Absolutely right - and yet, there are still yobbos who ride around and intrude on private property (mine, for example) on MX machines with shrieking exhaust notes and that generates huge angst and police presence - I am not kidding here. We need to understand the negative effect that 'intruding' with excessive and unpleasant noise has on people and both develop and preserve a reputation as decent members of society or we will lose 'ground'.

Im a mx rider on a registered bike on public trails where its still 100% legal.... Not sure if you have a different bread doing illegal crap or you regard all as yobbos ... but I hope your just talking about the ones braking the rules / trespassing. Otherwise the same argument could be said about every yobo that flies over in an aircraft with noise encroaching on the residents below.... I ride a 450F which is about as noisy as they come but at 5m from exhaust at full throttle it has to be under 94db

At 50m at 75% throttle its less then 50db. If

 

And in a typical bush scenario about 70% of the time is spent under 75% throttle.

 

We have them measured at our race track and the sound is surprisingly low even with 40 bikes racing, once you get over about 30m from directly behind it.

 

A complaining neighbour had measurements taken at his place when the prevailing wind was in his direction. The sound was less then 5db. But we still got slapped with a 9am to 5pm curfew. The unfair thing is he built inside a designated sports and motorsports precinct after the track was built.

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

Did you put signs up warning them about the low level tensioned cables?

You don't have to be a motorcyclist to find that a pretty extreme response.

 

 

[Guest ozzie]

When Ramblers were using it was a short term deal while owners, council and developers fought it out. Always going to rezoned and built on.

 

 

[Guest ozzie]

Sometimes I wonder why I moved out of Sydney. We have a dirt track behind us about to have a road built on it but for now sees dirt bikes riding flat out on it, sometimes the local cop trying to bush bash my expensive highway patrol car chasing unregistered 10 dollar bikes. Noise is annoying but the dust is worse. The road when built will access around 200 new houses so why complain about a few bikes on the weekend. New road will be like a freeway when the houses go in. Let the kids have fun driving the cop and ranger nuts. The coal trains about 2k away with 140 wagons with the squealing wheel at 3 am really piss me off. Refuse to put any sound barriers along the line. A few Tigers overhead, can handle that. Barking dogs, 3 on one side 2 on the other, one starts and the whole village fires off. But what really and I mean really annoys me to no end is that bloody rooster. The rooster is going to get fixed soon but can't do anything about the Kookaburras, magpies and everything else that's fires up at sparrow fart. The only time I can sleep in is when I stay at the drop zone. Aircraft are pretty quiet in the overall scheme.

 

 

[Dafydd Llewellyn]

When Ramblers were using it was a short term deal while owners, council and developers fought it out. Always going to rezoned and built on.

Hmmm. The usual council run-around, then. The B50 had IGSO-480 Lycomings, not Continentals, I thought. With ejector exhausts, which act as megaphones. The really annoying noises are the ones that keep happening all day; the occasional Tiger or whatever puttering overhead is only a nuisance if it keeps doing it; if it goes past on its way to somewhere else, it's not really an issue. So any operation that is repetive at the same site is likely to provoke a response if it continues long enough.

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

What sounds we find offensive can be pretty subjective. Others may complain about the loud noise of a Ducati engine-braking into a corner; I find it one of the most stirring sounds in creation.

 

Birds are another matter. While I am quite fond of the sound of a nesting pair of willy-wagtails, I know of one farmer who poked his shotty out the bedroom window and gave them both barrels.

 

 

[Oscar]

Im a mx rider on a registered bike on public trails where its still 100% legal.... Not sure if you have a different bread doing illegal crap or you regard all as yobbos ... but I hope your just talking about the ones braking the rules / trespassing. The genuine trail riders, say Dads with sons pottering along on legal, quiet bikes (mainly 4-strokes) and 'treading lightly', I can approach, tell them they're on private property, they will without exception apologise and ride quietly away - no problems. The ones with no damn cans who tear up my fire trails with full-throttle every twenty yards to slide/wheelie everywhere, can get seriously aggressive ( I've had one threaten to 'punch your (fornicating) head in, you (fornicating female genital part) - while recording it on his Go-Pro (and while I was holding my doberman by the collar - that would have been a seriously bad career move on his part) after riding with several mates right past the house and sheds, and telling me he was on 'national park' area - problems. And it's not just me who perceives these as problems, or we wouldn't have the NSW Police recreational motorcycle squad routinely patrolling the area as a result of complaints.

 

Otherwise the same argument could be said about every yobo that flies over in an aircraft with noise encroaching on the residents below....

 

And that is exactly my point. There will always be someone who complains about something, but if that becomes a widespread community reaction, then local Councils are encouraged to 'do something about these noisy bastards' - i.e. close the airfield, sell it off for development. WE lose.

 

I ride a 450F which is about as noisy as they come but at 5m from exhaust at full throttle it has to be under 94db

 

At 50m at 75% throttle its less then 50db. If

 

And in a typical bush scenario about 70% of the time is spent under 75% throttle.

 

We have them measured at our race track and the sound is surprisingly low even with 40 bikes racing, once you get over about 30m from directly behind it.

 

A complaining neighbour had measurements taken at his place when the prevailing wind was in his direction. The sound was less then 5db. But we still got slapped with a 9am to 5pm curfew.

 

I think you have just superbly demonstrated the validity of my contention!

 

The unfair thing is he built inside a designated sports and motorsports precinct after the track was built.

And closed the case for the Prosecution, m'lud. Even if it's irrational, unreasonable or not even particularly demonstrable, a batch of complaints against noise WILL get the 'offenders' penalised by officialdom, and once an airfield is sold off and turned into houses, it's gone forever. We don't have any convincing arguments of social value for recreational aviation that we can use to try to combat community annoyance about our noise. Our best - and I think only - defence is to do our level best to ensure we do not become the target of such complaints.

 

 

[Oscar]

What sounds we find offensive can be pretty subjective. Others may complain about the loud noise of a Ducati engine-braking into a corner; I find it one of the most stirring sounds in creation.Birds are another matter. While I am quite fond of the sound of a nesting pair of willy-wagtails, I know of one farmer who poked his shotty out the bedroom window and gave them both barrels.

Agree on both counts (and the noise of a Ducati pulsating along is delightful, especially when you're astride it (Darmah and just once, a 900ss round-case with Contis, of treasured memory) - and generally, it's gone again very quickly. I very recently spent two weeks in Bundaberg rebuilding my Jab. engine and there was a Col that started at 0300, that had the entire caravan park where I was staying at hair-tearing levels of irritation.

 

However, officialdom finds it far easier to arrive and slap a noise-order on the side of an aircraft than serve a cease-and-desist on a damn Col. If we set ourselves up as low-hanging fruit on the tree of complaints, we'll get picked. I don't think I'm being paranoid here, we've seen it happen.

 

 

[dazza 38]

Being a bike rider , I can't understand why so many dudes riding boat anchors have super loud exhaust pipes. Having said that, I think my KTM single cylinder thumper sounds cool even with its super trap silencer. I do wear ear plugs when riding it though.

 

 

[Dafydd Llewellyn]

Yeah, well I'm about half-deaf - and it's not entirely a disadvantage. But Oscar is dead right.

 

 

[turboplanner]

I know of one farmer who poked his shotty out the bedroom window and gave them both barrels.

I've got a friend who tried to that to a blackbird from the bedroom window and shot off his tap.

 

 

[facthunter]

What part of the Blackbird is the tap attached to? Nev

 

 

[turboplanner]

Aircraft are pretty quiet in the overall scheme.

That is correct, and the above regulation level not only leads to that, but leads to a generally low level of complaints about flying.

 

Sure the urban myth about people building houses next to airports then complaining, leads to comments about "low hanging fruit", but in the overall Planning world aircraft are at the lower level of noise disputes.

 

Most airfield noise issues are fabricated with the hidden agenda of softening up the scene to allow a subdivision, and can be overcome with a good strategic approach based on planning regulations.

 

However, this thread started with squeals about the draconian noise regulations for aircraft we had to comply with and how the world was coming to an end, and the only complaint that seemed to be missed was that George Bush had schemed to get this for his evil plans - all proved false when we actually compared the regulation with the cars we drive etc.

 

 

[turboplanner]

What part of the Blackbird is the tap attached to? Nev

It got away. He lived in the country and had to drive into town for a new tap etc

 

 

[metalman]

B

 

What part of the Blackbird is the tap attached to? Nev

Bloody good shot, best I can do is a head shot, a 'a tap shot' ,impressive, won't kill the bugger but he'll think twice about getting chirpy around there again!

 

 

[Guest Andys@coffs]

It got away. He lived in the country and had to drive into town for a new tap etc

I've heard of the tap shot...spy's use them but usually shoot both the hot and the cold...which in the trade is known as a double tap...When you shoot someone's hot and cold tap it seems they are immediately out of the game and are no further problems..... Hope the bird played by the spy rules

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

....there was a Col that started at 0300, that had the entire caravan park where I was staying at hair-tearing levels of irritation.

What's a Col?

 

 

[Oscar]

What's a Col?

Actually, a Koel, form of cuckoo, apparently migrates south from Asia. According to the locals, they come down looking to mate, so become (far less than affectionately, may I add) as 'Col's by the locals, (for the males, with the females being nicknamed by me at least as 'Eva' (Brickattit) )

 

 

[Gnarly Gnu]

You don't have to be a motorcyclist to find that a pretty extreme response.

Warning signs are extreme eh? In my area signs like 'beware of the dog' etc are pretty common, generally seen as a cheap and moderately effective trespassing deterrent.

 

 

[Yenn]

A col is something you read about in the Himalayas, alomg with a serac. Not sure what it is but maybe you could hide from a Yeti behind it.

 

 

[cscotthendry]

This is the strip I mean; I enquired several times about it, because I was looking for a site that I could use occasionally as a base for a day or two for aircraft cooling and climb performance testing over the water, along the beach just north of Noosa. That sort of testing needs smooth air with no temoerature inversion, and those conditions occur just offshore in gentle sea-breeze conditions. It's on private property; each time the answer was as I described. I've no idea what's there now. I suppose it could have been the B50; a Queen Air is just a B50 on steroids. Whatever, it did nobody a service by getting the place closed.

Dafydd:

The strip is not closed, but it is a private field. I have flown in and out of there often and my trike instructor is based there. The owner of the field charges landing fees, so if you're heading there, take some cash with you.

 

 

[Dafydd Llewellyn]

Dafydd:The strip is not closed, but it is a private field. I have flown in and out of there often and my trike instructor is based there. The owner of the field charges landing fees, so if you're heading there, take some cash with you.

Thanks for that

 

 

[cscotthendry]

Thanks for that

I forgot to mention, that they keep the gate locked, so if you have someone come to pick you up, you'll need to walk to the gate, which is a bit of a distance from the field.

 

 

[cscotthendry]

Meanwhile, : I put in the form for the noise certification yesterday and, unusally for a government department these days there was NO application fees, and got my certificate by email within a couple of hours.

 

Obviously, this department has adequate staffing to do the job it's tasked to do, so it MUST be a target for budget cuts.

 

 

[Dafydd Llewellyn]

I forgot to mention, that they keep the gate locked, so if you have someone come to pick you up, you'll need to walk to the gate, which is a bit of a distance from the field.

Thanks, again. Do you by any chance know the owner's name?