Natfly 2014

[IanR]

I know it's a minor thing, but it begs the question...if it is a legal requirement to carry a current VNC for the flight you were doing, why did you fly without one?And "Because I thought I could get away with it" is a perfectly valid and honest answer. We all do it from time to time I guess. However, the more I hear and read about the opposition to ramp checks at Natfly, the more I think that there's an uncomfortable amount of pilots trying to get away with stuff.

In fact, looking at my current VNC, it is effective 14 November 2013 expiring 29 May 2014 - so anything older is more than a couple of months out of date

 

 

[kgwilson]

I used to keep VNC & VTC charts up to date all the time & then one day I sat down & tried to find the differences in a couple & they were so minor and obscure it effectively made no difference. Sometimes if there are big airspace modifications it is obvious and only the current ones show correct information. In the end I was only getting new ones every couple of years or when the AIP showed major change. No one ever asked if I had current charts many years ago in GA.

 

It is a lot easier now with up to date detail downloaded onto a GPS enabled tablet with Avplan, Ozrunways or EasyVFR installed.

 

 

[Guest Andys@coffs]

Maps ersa planning.....dates.......why wouldn't you look at the tablet based solutions which make all those "issues" go away for a fraction of the cost per year of doing the same with paper.....

 

Especially when the same device is damned handy for a bunch of other things including filling in your weekend when you've run out of things to look at but aren't ready to go home......

 

You can also run followmee so your significant other can track you as you fly.....MH370 issues? Nope none of that for me... SPOT for others that need guaranteed coverage away from the east coast or the major population centres

 

Andy

 

 

[gandalph]

Number one Son and I arrived by road around 10:15 Friday. Sadly I missed the Techman forum but there were plenty of things for us to do, gawk at and drool over. I tried several times to have a talk to Ian Bent at the CAMit booth but I couldn't get to the front of the queue til mid afternoon on Saturday. If he comes again next year he's better bring more staff! The Guys at the Rotec stand seemed to pretty busy as were the Bolly boys. The Bundy brigade were there with s few nice Jabs as were the Bristel, Sling, Piper sport, Aerochute, Technam Morgan, Pipistrel & Cirrus guys.. No sight of the rotorcraft guys though apart from one lonely single seat chopper. There were certainly less planes and fewer trade stalls that when I was here 2 years ago but I still found it a most enjoyable outing. All the trade guys were happy to chat without any hard sell. The flying displays were just breathtaking!

 

The RAA general meeting was a bit of a giggle with most of the time taken up with dealing the the 7 special resolution. The new Pres, Sec & Treasurer all seem to have their eye(s) on the ball and I came away moderately confident that we may at last be in good hands. There wasn't much time allowed for questions from the floor which upset the Colonel blimps there but.....will they ever be pleased???

 

The forum with Matt Hall was briliant but afterwards I overhead one of the Colonels mustaches bristling at the possibility that the RAA may have paid for his attendance. We didn't it seems, he (Matt, not the Colonel ) was sponsored by QBE so honour was saved.

 

The forum with mark Clayton was kinda hijacked by our immediate past Prez but his intentions were good I'm sure

 

The food in the food court was about the same standard (!) as last time bit a bit more exxy The coffee was good. The food in the pub was fine, the yobbo's in the pub weren't so fine and seemed threatened by the sight of my son wearing rabbits ears on Easter day! So much testosterone from so small testes!

 

Will I go next year? Maybe not because I'll probably be up to my ears getting my bird ready for flight but once she's ready I'll be there as often as I can. It Natfly dead? It sure as hell will be if the gloom and doomers continue to bag the event and the association promoting it.

 

To those who stayed away because of the fear of ramp checks. Well done - right decision. If you're not confident you've got it all together then you're best leaving it in the hangar and driving down, but best be sure your licence and rego is up to date on the car and it's roadworthy, I've heard a rumour that the REAL police are doing roadside checks. Bloody bureaucracy gone mad!

 

Uploaded some pics in the photo section

 

Retiring now to don my fireproof suit and wait for the firestorm.....

 

Regards

 

 

[geoffreywh]

still gotta have paper copies have you not? I thought that ipads were back up only?......

 

 

[storchy neil]

no ian this foram aint part of problem just some of the imbersiles that run down our organizers and don't contribute in a positive way

 

some use this foram to crititsize with half truths and down right lies

 

I was at temora thurs to sun the next person that blames casa for doing ramps checks at temora will need a good health insurance we have brought this on our selves

 

one imbercile was going ballistic about casa aparantly he did not have wheather no flight plan no map because he is only 35 min from temora and knows the area like the back of his hand

 

another idiot going ape about having to carry plb his life not worth 500 dollars or so

 

now casa want to be hard on us how would you like to have to put in tso instruments

 

now darlings what would do if a l2 l3 grounds your plane for having

 

bent under carriage

 

bent legs

 

cracked windscreen

 

crack in leading edge off wing

 

bent rudder peddles

 

egt not working

 

flap indercator not working

 

texta marks on wing at 10 20 30 40 degrees

 

bent engine frame

 

gasculator modified were you cant do a proper drain

 

now we have a flying school that has a training plane with a fuel tank that you cant fill to full as it will leek

 

I wonder were the xxx is that has a radio squeels like a stuck pig once again training plane

 

I wonder were plane that the brakes might work

 

now if you know where they are let raa know they will deal with it yeh:roflmao: and the dear l2 is not touched

 

our rules our lives comply with our rules and casa wont be around neil

 

 

[Guest Andys@coffs]

Storchy

 

Anyone who has been on these forums for a while will understand that there is definitely a story behind your posts, however without wanting to appear high and mighty or condescending (and perhaps failing in that!) , your posts every time make my eyes bleed as a result of torturous grammar and poor spelling, so much so that much of what you are wanting people to understand from your posts I'm pretty sure is lost in the translation. Do others agree with me, or am I Robinson Crusoe here?

 

Can I make a suggestion that you compose your post in Microsoft word and use the spelling and grammar checkers to tidy up your first draft and then run it past another human before you post. (Im volunteering, via PM, for that if your stuck for someone to bounce ideas off....)

 

That sounds condescending but I would expect to get the same thing if I tried to compose poetry and posted it here with a real message contained within.....or something similar and would hope that someone might point out that poetry isn't perhaps my forte......

 

Sorry for the blunt message but please consider it...my eyes demand it!

 

Andy

 

 

[Guest Andys@coffs]

still gotta have paper copies have you not? I thought that ipads were back up only?......

No, I understand it that the ipad can be used as the primary source (plenty of discussion on this in the past) some pilots depending on class of license need backup in the form of paper or another electronic device but as I understand it legally us RAA folk in the context of operating within our licensing regime can get away with a single ipad.

 

That said, putting the rules to the side for the moment, there are those among us (me included) who don't put 100% faith in a single electronic device and who may well choose to have a paper copy of a WAC or a vnc or an ersa.....in the cabin somewhere....who knows, it may even be in date.......but if perchance it weren't and gasp, the ipad failed...I sure wouldn't toss it out the window cause it was found to be expired and they've physically moved all the airfields and towns as they do when ever a chart expires thus rendering the old one useless.......

 

Personally I may be super cautious.... I have a garmin 295 panel mounted, an Aera 500 in the door pocket and a paper map or two with me....if I find myself with a failed ipad and inside controlled airspace....or lost...then perhaps its best I give away this flying caper...... After all we are really supposed to be purely vfr ....

 

 

[SDQDI]

No, I understand it that the ipad can be used as the primary source (plenty of discussion on this in the past) some pilots depending on class of license need backup in the form of paper or another electronic device but as I understand it legally us RAA folk in the context of operating within our licensing regime can get away with a single ipad.That said, putting the rules to the side for the moment, there are those among us (me included) who don't put 100% faith in a single electronic device and who may well choose to have a paper copy of a WAC or a vnc or an ersa.....in the cabin somewhere....who knows, it may even be in date.......but if perchance it weren't and gasp, the ipad failed...I sure wouldn't toss it out the window cause it was found to be expired and they've physically moved all the airfields and towns as they do when ever a chart expires thus rendering the old one useless.......

 

Personally I may be super cautious.... I have a garmin 295 panel mounted, an Aera 500 in the door pocket and a paper map or two with me....if I find myself with a failed ipad and inside controlled airspace....or lost...then perhaps its best I give away this flying caper...... After all we are really supposed to be purely vfr ....

That's how I understand it Andy. I use my iPad and have ozrunways on my phone as backup and also a few paper charts some of which are out of date incase things get really tough:lost:.

 

Although I did think if you were using an iPad or similar electronic device that you did need a backup which could be a second iPad

 

 

[Keith Page]

Good Morning Gandalph.

 

Thank you for your honest Temora report -- if the mob can not accept that, well bad luck.

 

We are in bit of pickle at the moment with careful direction we will trade out of it.

 

The other special thing you mentioned (I think your describing is perfect) was the Colonel Blimps and Colonel Mustaches sad to say -- world is full of them -- have you ever taken some time and thought about these gentlemen.

 

They would be great assets to any organisation if they could work as well as they can talk.

 

Thank you again Gandalph.

 

Regards

 

Keith Page.

 

 

[rankamateur]

If you can't be good at it Keith, you gotta look good doing it! Isn't that how thw whole world works. Or fake it til you make it!

 

 

[68volksy]

Attended all 3 days. As far as Fly-ins go it was one of the best you could ever attend. Great airport, great facilities, great food/coffee available from a couple of tents from the early hours well into the night and most of all a GREAT group of passionate aviators with which to swap stories and share in the whole aviation experience.

 

Many seem to be commenting on it as an airshow and in that regard i certainly agree that attendance numbers were down and the exhibitors didn't have much new stuff to show. One thing though - the aerobatics shows were great.

 

From where i sit Natfly is straddling the divide between airshow and fly-in. I think those that went expecting an airshow are probably right in feeling a little disappointed whereas those that were expecting a Fly-in seemed to have a great deal of fun and loved it.

 

 

[Keith Page]

If you can't be good at it Keith, you gotta look good doing it! Isn't that how thw whole world works. Or fake it til you make it!

What are you trying to fake here rankamature?

 

That is a cryptic statement..

 

Regards

 

Keith Page

 

 

[bushcaddy105]

More thoughts on Natfly:-

 

Having missed 2013 through registration delays, I again made the trip to enjoy the flying, the forums and the socializing. This being my 4th Temora after several Narromines.

 

What I find disappointing is not the event, but the steady decline of homebuilt aircraft and particularly so the innovation that is part of that scene. Every year the emphasis seems to shift further towards the flashy GA substitutes with their $100k + pricetags. Is it any wonder that we recreational flyers are collectively assumed to be filthy rich by the general population, just because we own an aircraft?

 

While not wishing to buy into the politics of proposed maintenance training, I came away from the relevant forums with the feeling that despite having spent over 1500 hours building my aircraft (including an engine conversion) I am not to be trusted to understand it enough to be allowed to continue maintaining and inspecting my creation without passing an exam and having to arrange for an L2/L4 inspection. Surely some form of recognition of prior learning should be allowed for.

 

I will continue to fly for the enjoyment - Sunday's flight home was 7 hours of glorious flying despite headwinds.

 

 

[turboplanner]

Surely some form of recognition of prior learning should be allowed for.

In a nutshell

 

 

[Russ]

Couple of pics of great stopovers central Qld, for those that get about. I have returned from gyro Nats ( wondai Q ) stopped each way.

 

1st 2, are Mt coolon pub and strip, about 100m strip to pub, friendly,comfy, good strip......no fuel tho

 

 

 

[Russ]

Dingo.....just east of Blackwater, ( Central Qld) ....roadhouse, great accom,food,fuel, good strip, approach from western end, taxi right up to roadhouse, huge parking area amongst road trains.

 

 

 

[gandalph]

More thoughts on Natfly:- I came away from the relevant forums with the feeling that despite having spent over 1500 hours building my aircraft (including an engine conversion) I am not to be trusted to understand it enough to be allowed to continue maintaining and inspecting my creation without passing an exam and having to arrange for an L2/L4 inspection. Surely some form of recognition of prior learning should be allowed for.I will continue to fly for the enjoyment - Sunday's flight home was 7 hours of glorious flying despite headwinds.

I believe that in the USA if you built it and it gets passed by the DAR you can maintain it, but if you sell it to someone else, they need to gain a maintainers qualification ( from the EAA I think). Why wouldn't that be an acceptable compromise over here?

 

 

[facthunter]

Be too logical. Nev

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

... despite having spent over 1500 hours building my aircraft (including an engine conversion) I am not to be trusted to understand it enough to be allowed to continue maintaining and inspecting my creation without passing an exam and having to arrange for an L2/L4 inspection. Surely some form of recognition of prior learning should be allowed for...

Too damned right, John. Bureaucracy unrestrained by common sense. My team has been rescuing people for decades and trains every week, yet we have to provide masses of documentary evidence to prove that we are qualified to keep doing so.

Sometimes it's easier to actually start from scratch and do the course than get Recognition of Prior Learning.

 

 

[Teckair]

Hi there Storchy I have been thinking about what happened to you and your plane. It sure was a lousy deal I would be really p!ssed off as well. The level 2 is a maintainer and not necessarily a crash repairer. Part of the responsibility of a L2 is not to take on work you cannot properly do.

 

Over the years I have noted crash repairs where the aircraft were sent back to the manufacturers like Jabiru, Lightwing and Drifter and I had not heard of too many complaints.

 

Now with so many imported aircraft the situation is different and what happened to you should be a warning to anybody thinking of buying or already owning an imported RAAus aircraft. You may think having you plane insured means it is secure but this appears to be an example how that may not be the case.

 

Richard.

 

 

[IanR]

Anyone know what make this cub replica is ? I had a good look at it but didn't write anything down.

 

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

Looks like an Aeropup.

 

http://www.aeropup.com

 

 

[IanR]

Looks like an Aeropup.http://www.aeropup.com

No - its a cub replica of some sort. Seemed to be quite a capable aircraft from what the person said. Would quite comfortable fly out of my back paddock !

 

 

[PapaFox]

Savage Cub IIRC