Light AC down in Lawson NSW

[gandalph]

The 'Volvo Driver' analogy seems somewhat appropriate.

 

Hey!

[alf jessup]

I just went through a lot of that data base. Taken a whole lot of lives!This was the 55th deployment of the CAPS chute.

 

All the ones that used the chute resulted in survived occupants, minimal injuries.

 

Of all the attempts to fly the aircraft down, there are many (mostly) fatalities.....

 

Also quite a few fatalities during take-off and other maneuvers. Must be a very unforgiving aircraft....

 

And a surprising number of engine failures!

 

JG

JG

 

Interesting reading isn't it, I only went through the 1st page and there were a lot of CFIT in crap weather too.

 

I think it is a fairly advanced aircraft for the average pilot to fly, a little bit like the doctor killers the Bonanza was unfortunately given earlier on in it's life.

 

As you say quite a lot of deaths in the Cirrus since it's inception in 2002 and would be a lot more if it wasn't fitted with the CAPS system.

 

Alf

 

 

[jetjr]

Not sure of the facts but wasnt the CAPS implemented accross the range due to its unforgiving nature or maybe as a response to poor performance in spin testing.

 

I am too interested on engine failures, seeing they are all near new engines From the good old skool design why are they stopping?

 

Comparison to bonanza is probably right, high performance aircraft in average performance pilots has poor outcomes

 

Lots of ways to read stats, but even with caps its reported fatality rate is only just below that of GA singles presumably running older engines and no chute

 

 

[Guest Andys@coffs]

To me a BRS should be an additional layer of safety that the aircraft owner can choose to have fitted. A BRS that is an alternate to the usual safety characteristics.....that has the hair on my neck raised, I want more options for safety not ones that are used to hide the fact that the usual ones aren't there.....

 

A statement that says "Nope we never formally tested it so it never formally failed " what a load of total BS, they may never of formally tested it because they already informally knew they were going to fail!!!! I mean who designs an aeroplane and then thinks wont bother testing for stall/spin entry/exit characteristics.........swallow that and I can sell you a relatively new bridge over a pristine harbour in Sydney for a very reasonable price!

 

 

[Mick]

I mean who designs an aeroplane and then thinks wont bother testing for stall/spin entry/exit characteristics.........swallow that and I can sell you a relatively new bridge over a pristine harbour in Sydney for a very reasonable price!

That bridge sounds alot more stable than a Cirrus!!!!!!

 

 

[Tadge]

G'day,

 

I just had a read of the SR22 ECL.

 

After the 'Engine Failure In Flight' memory items the checklist then reads

 

"If the engine fails at altitude, pitch as necessary to establish best glide

 

speed. While gliding toward a suitable landing area, attempt to identify

 

the cause of the failure and correct it. If altitude or terrain does not

 

permit a safe landing, CAPS deployment may be required. Refer to

 

Section 10, Safety Information, for CAPS deployment scenarios and

 

landing considerations".

 

So depending on the terrain in the area it appears the pilot in this case followed the ECL as published.

 

Regards,

 

Brendon

 

 

[Rotorwork]

Noticed another Cirrus SR22 Caps deployment on ASN

 

http://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/wiki.php?id=166871

 

Following a loss of engine power, the aircraft, a Cirrus SR22, experienced the deployment of the Cirrus Airframe Parachute System (CAPS) and came to rest upright in wooded terrain in Burlington, northeast of Laurence G Hanscom Field Airport (KBED), Bedford, Massachusetts. The airplane sustained unreported damage and the two occupants onboard received minor injuries.

 

 

[dlegg]

Just gotta love this:

 

"Watch this" says the salesman/instructor as he puts the cirrus into a spin........

 

Aviation safety investigations & reports

 

Loss of control involving a Cirrus SR22, N802DK, near Katoomba, NSW on 10 May 2014

 

Investigation number: AO-2014-083

 

Investigation status: Completed

 

Summary

 

On 10 May 2014, an accredited Cirrus salesman conducted a sales demonstration flight of a Cirrus SR22 aircraft, registered N802DK, in the local training area, from Bankstown Airport, New South Wales, with a pilot (and potential aircraft buyer) seated in the front left seat and one passenger on board. At about 1330 Eastern Standard Time, the aircraft departed Bankstown and the salesman, as pilot in command (PIC) elected to track towards Katoomba at about 6,000 ft above mean sea level.

 

After demonstrating a series of turns and a straight and level stall, the PIC selected 50% flap, rolled the aircraft into a left turn at about 25° angle of bank, reduced the power to idle, and raised the nose of the aircraft. The right wing dropped rapidly and the aircraft entered a spin to the right. When about 2,000 ft above ground level, the PIC was unsure whether he then had enough height remaining to recover control of the aircraft, and elected to deploy the aircraft’s parachute. The rocket fired, the aircraft initially pitched up slightly and then as the parachute deployed, the aircraft pitched down rapidly into a nose low attitude. About 6 seconds after the rocket fired, the right snub line of the parachute released, followed by the left snub line, which then established the aircraft in a wings level attitude.

 

The aircraft narrowly avoided powerlines, collided with branches of a tree, and came to rest on a fence in the garden of a residential dwelling.

 

This incident provides a reminder to pilots to know your own limitations and those of the aircraft.

 

 

[djpacro]

Highlights the need for pilots to be totally familiar with the stall/spin characteristics of their aircraft such that they can readily determine the difference between a stall with a wing drop, an incipient spin, a fully developed spin and a spiral dive.

 

The recovery actions for each are significantly different (refer the CASA Flight Instructor Manual).

 

 

[David Isaac]

Huh.... funny how the truth changes the whole perspective. What happened to the alleged engine failure???? Explain that one to the insurers, a deliberate aerobatic entry where there was insufficient height to recover. I wonder if he even did his basic HASEL checks.

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

I can think of better places to do those sort of manoeuvres than over the Blue Mountains!

 

 

[SDQDI]

I can't think of a worse place to do it...... I'd reckon there would be some sucking up happening to the potential buyer to try and mitigate any litigation. I also reckon the pic would be feeling pretty small at the minute.

 

 

[Oscar]

Jeez, give the salesman some slack! If anybody has ever better demonstrated: 'and by the way, DON'T do this' to a potential customer, then he/she deserves a Gold Elephant Star and a beer in the pub afterwards.

 

 

[gandalph]

Just gotta love this:"Watch this" says the salesman/instructor as he puts the cirrus into a spin........

Aviation safety investigations & reports

 

Loss of control involving a Cirrus SR22, N802DK, near Katoomba, NSW on 10 May 2014

 

Investigation number: AO-2014-083

 

Investigation status: Completed

 

Summary

 

On 10 May 2014, an accredited Cirrus salesman conducted a sales demonstration flight of a Cirrus SR22 aircraft, registered N802DK, in the local training area, from Bankstown Airport, New South Wales, with a pilot (and potential aircraft buyer) seated in the front left seat and one passenger on board. At about 1330 Eastern Standard Time, the aircraft departed Bankstown and the salesman, as pilot in command (PIC) elected to track towards Katoomba at about 6,000 ft above mean sea level.

 

After demonstrating a series of turns and a straight and level stall, the PIC selected 50% flap, rolled the aircraft into a left turn at about 25° angle of bank, reduced the power to idle, and raised the nose of the aircraft. The right wing dropped rapidly and the aircraft entered a spin to the right. When about 2,000 ft above ground level, the PIC was unsure whether he then had enough height remaining to recover control of the aircraft, and elected to deploy the aircraft’s parachute. The rocket fired, the aircraft initially pitched up slightly and then as the parachute deployed, the aircraft pitched down rapidly into a nose low attitude. About 6 seconds after the rocket fired, the right snub line of the parachute released, followed by the left snub line, which then established the aircraft in a wings level attitude.

I guess the question arises: Was the salesman selling the plane or the parachute.....? Another strong candidate for the Darwin awards

 

 

[motzartmerv]

So who was in command?

 

 

[alf jessup]

So who was in command?

The BRS by the sounds of it Motz, at least it knew what it was doing

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

Cirrus Circus........

 

 

[DrZoos]

I have been electrocuted and i have been hurt by gravity and inertia.......i will take voltage any day....

 

 

[David Isaac]

So who was in command?

One assumes the accredited Cirrus Salesman .... but a good question, cause he was in the right seat (even though you can still be PIC in the right). Who could ever really know, maybe the potential client cocked up? There was also a PAX in the back.

 

 

[DrZoos]

They all survived so i guess its the ultimate selling point...usually when u corknup a

 

Flat spin we all start sending condolences

 

 

[bexrbetter]

I have been electrocuted and i have been hurt by gravity and inertia.......i will take voltage any day....

That's a shocking attitude Mate.

 

 

[DrZoos]

Really , Its a current issue?

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

He didn't have AMPle time to pull out........

 

 

[bexrbetter]

..... Watt?

 

 

[David Isaac]

Oh please ... you guys ... go to bed. LOL