Wellcamp

[Keith Page]

H62/14

 

Here is the link to make life a tad easier, happy reading.

 

http://www.airservicesaustralia.com/aip/current/sup/s14-h62.pdf

 

Regards

 

KP.

 

 

[dazza 38]

Its all good, I am flying out on a QANTASLINK -8.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

If you have made it this far, keep reading. Seems I am in esteemed company with my opinions about the economic viability of the airport.

 

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/features/the-wagner-family-the-airport-and-the-toowoomba-neighbours-feud/story-e6frg8h6-1227085551523

 

 

[Keith Page]

If you have made it this far, keep reading. Seems I am in esteemed company with my opinions about the economic viability of the airport.http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/features/the-wagner-family-the-airport-and-the-toowoomba-neighbours-feud/story-e6frg8h6-1227085551523

Oi! F_T,

 

If I could open it, I will know who you are esteemed with and/or which company.

 

Regards,

 

KP.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

try this

 

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCAQqQIwAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.theaustralian.com.au%2Fnews%2Ffeatures%2Fthe-wagner-family-the-airport-and-the-toowoomba-neighbours-feud%2Fstory-e6frg8h6-1227085551523&ei=lYs4VIDRAcr38QWls4DwDA&usg=AFQjCNH2yaNjn97VVtChPZFx1Xt31oRSqQ&sig2=0nmM7o9S_HYR_K7qiuQdUw&bvm=bv.77161500,d.dGc

 

 

[fly_tornado]

The Wagners say the airport will be mainly a passenger operation, a hub for the 344,000 people living in its catchment area on and to the west of the Great Divide. They’re also hoping to siphon business off Brisbane’s congested main airport. The company has joined a consortium bidding for the $1.7 billion second Toowoomba Range crossing that will run past the Wellcamp site, servicing both the airport and the industrial park, still a work in progress. John Wagner argues the new road will cut the travel time from Brisbane’s growing western suburbs to 50 minutes, and parking will be cheaper. (Brisbane Airport points into Moreton Bay, on the opposite side of the city, but is serviced by a state-of-the-art car tunnel and elevated train.)

 

The Wagners’ business model forecasts 401,921 passengers in the first year of operation, the majority of them local, rising to 1.364 million in year five. By then, projected outputs would have grown from $161.6 million for 2015 to $595.8 million to deliver a return on the family’s investment. More than 3200 jobs would be created in the first 12 months, a quarter of them in Toowoomba. Premier Newman says: “This will make a huge difference to the city. It will mean that people will be able to travel here for tourism, it will mean that the gas and energy sector will be able to be well-served … also we see great opportunities for air freight.”

 

Yet Dick Smith is not the only aviation figure to doubt the new airport’s earning capacity. Former Qantas chief economist Tony Webber can’t see how the numbers stack up on the passenger side. “The outbound traffic is too small, there is not much inbound to a place like Toowoomba and you might get a bit of fly-in, fly-out to the mines in central Queensland, but it won’t be enough in my view,” he says.

 

Wagner is adamant the project will fly. For a start, he wants to change how air freight is done. Wellcamp will have none of the capacity constraints that limit operations in Melbourne, Brisbane and Sydney airports, the latter with a curfew. He points to the air trade in live goats to the Middle East. “They take the goats from Charleville, west of here, and truck them right past our door to put them on a jumbo out of Sydney every Sunday. How crazy is that?” Fresh milk and dairy exports into China are another lucrative market, Wagner believes. “We can put produce on a plane here and have it to the market just about anywhere in Asia next morning.”

 

 

[Keith Page]

There is some of the answers.. Thank you F_T.

 

* A marketing programme and there is one 747 load of goats a week................................... 1st. plane load.

 

* I had heard about the milk to China.. A big part of the milk will come from NSW.

 

*I do ask why is so much importance placed on the new road up the range.. Is there something we have not heard?

 

*Could it be chilled beef from Dinmore?

 

*How many veggies grown in the Lockyer these day? Could it be veggies?

 

What is the time saving (loading, flight time, transport in and out of terminal)to get to China, Asia, Middle East...........by leaving from Welcamp?

 

Regards

 

KP.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

The problem with a lot of Wagner's claims is they have had no proper scrutiny, if the traffic figures for passengers are anything to go by much of the business the airport will generate will occur some time in the distant future.

 

I pity all the people living around there is they have 747s coming and going 24/7, that would really suck.

 

 

[Keith Page]

Standing back and looking at the large picture :-

 

*Nearly all what Wagners are up to is secret, till the project starts.

 

*Who ever started the pasenger numbers idea --- looks hard to get the pasenger numbers.

 

*To me the produce exercise fits. e.g. fresh fruit and veggies, milk and meat.

 

*The smell of a rat is about the exercise -- I think it is produce of some form.

 

Just imagine freight 747's in and out all night, through in a couple of Antonovs just for good measure.

 

What about fuel for the monsters?

 

Regards

 

KP.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Well don't forget they need to fly in freight as well to make it viable and you need to ship most of that to Brisbane or Sydney.

 

The fuel needs to be shipped up too Wellcamp as well.

 

I don't know how much they expect to make per plane, I can see Brisbane airport being very aggressive in their pricing once they get their second runway operational. Wagners need to be making $1.6M a day, every day of the year to make a profit. That's a lot of planes.

 

• The Wagners’ business model forecasts 401,921 passengers in the first year of operation, the majority of them local, rising to 1.364 million in year five. By then, projected outputs would have grown from $161.6 million for 2015 to $595.8 million to deliver a return on the family’s investment.
   
   
  

 

 

 

 

[ExJourno]

...Maybe Ian's using a server in Kiwi land.

I'm posting with my local area set to Brisbane time.

 

I'm also up at odd hours - sometimes for work reasons, other times just because I want to be (and I do my best work during those peaceful hours).

 

If the server starts changing my posts to reflect kiwi phonetics, I'll have to pack up meh fush'n'chups, grab meh jandals and puss off bru.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Skytrans lose the contract for Western 1 and 2 to REX, no actual increase in services

 

I think this means there in no airline servicing TWB any more

 

 

 

[Dafydd Llewellyn]

Well, not to those centres perhaps. However, see http://www.qantas.com.au/travel/airlines/flights-to-wellcamp/economy/global/en

 

 

[fly_tornado]

have you had a closer look at qantas's deals on offer?

 

most of the time you are still better off flying out of brisbane.

 

Flying to EU, if you fly out of wellcamp you spend from 9am to 4-5pm sitting in the sydney airport before flying on to dubia for a 3-4 hour stop. makes for a very long trip to be spending so much time sitting in sydney. There is no option to take the later flight out of Wellcamp.

 

 

[Dafydd Llewellyn]

No, I haven't, because I very seldom travel by airline. Where is EU? Where is dubia? And where do you find the flight times?

 

Any hub-and-spoke airline system always entails stupid amounts of sitting around; there was an excuse for that in the days of F-27s, which needed water/methanol, but the Dash 8s etc do not need this, so it's well past time the airlines got more useful. No, I'm NOT better off flying out of Brisbane, because there's nearly five hours driving in that, for a round trip, plus the exorbitant Brisbane parking costs. I am not defending the airline services - I think they stink. But I WAS contradicting your comment that there were no airlines servicing Toowoomba.

 

 

[turboplanner]

Maybe you were right all along FT.

 

Looking at Dafydd's air fares, I wouldn't get caught paying $259.00 to get from Melbourne to Wellcamp, when I could get to Cairns for $169.00

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Sadly, there aren't any new services, Skytrans was operating those two services via TWB. The reason why very few ppl used Skytrans was the services where fairly limited

 

Don't drive to the Brisbane airport take the shuttle, it will save you paying for parking or if you have to drive there is plenty of off airport parking.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

TP if you really need to get too Toowoomba you can fly direct to Brisbane and rent a car there, most of the time you'll get that first day car hire for free.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

interesting article on the business of running an airport

 

http://www.aviationbusiness.com.au/news/the-plight-of-larger-rural-airports

 

 

[turboplanner]

I did find it interesting FT, although I wonder if some of the growth referred to refers to the construction phase of the mines. In some towns that's over and there are luxury houses for sale at half price, and their public transport requirements are near zero with computer controlled mines. Same goes for areas where coal has been badly affected by competition.

 

On the other hand all places like Mildura need are a few entrepreneurs - look what happened to bare and lonely goat farm - Hamilton Island.

 

I'm not saying I'd come to Toowoomba voluntarily, even if you said you would put a lei around my neck at the airport though.

 

 

[FlyingVizsla]

Emerald Qld was predicting profits and did invest in a separate terminal for charter (without security) and upgraded security at the RPT terminal, including paid parking. A good amount of that was financed by Government grants. Now 5,000 mining jobs have gone in 2 years from the mines it serves and more from the town that served them.

 

 

 

Currently the fees stand at -$20.60 per passenger embarking or disembarking, passenger screening $15.96, landing fees RPT (not disclosed), others $11.50 per tonne. Parking $10 per day, annual fee $3,000, hire companies $2,900 per parking spot. Working on one passenger getting off and one on, both with a car in the park (pick up / set down or left there for the day) on an RPT that is $35.96 for the seat. Multiply that by the capacity and add landing fees to work out the max return per RPT. Similar costs per charter aircraft, except we know landing fees.

 

 

 

Qantas & Jetstar have flights. Q has up to 7 flights a day, Dash 8s. Working on 50 seats max that's $1,798 + landing fees per flight. Weekends are quiet, but you can get the idea. Wagners can charge what the market will bear. At these rates Emerald is thriving and just finishing another paid car park facility. Council is trying to stop people parking in the nearby retail and industrial sector roads. Depends on the investment to determine if the return is suitable.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Wagners have gone over their budget and costs are projected to be close to $200M.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

http://www.couriermail.com.au/sport/motor-sport/toowoomba-v8-racetrack-likened-to-bathurst-set-to-hold-championship-race-by-2016/story-fnp0lxk7-1227102210038

 

QUEENSLAND is set to become the motorsport capital of Australia with Toowoomba almost certain to have the state’s fourth V8 Supercar event by 2016 on a track likened to the famous Mount Panorama.

 

The Sunday Mail can reveal the multi-millionaire company who built Australia’s first new airport in 44 years have designed and engineered a state of the art track set to built next to the $100 million West Wellcamp Airport in Toowoomba.

 

John Wagner, Chairman of Toowoomba-based construction and logistics giants Wagners, will be trackside with his BRW rich list brothers at this weekend’s Gold Coast 600 as a guest of V8 Supercars boss James Warburton.

 

 

[RKW]

V8 supercar racing is a bore.

 

 

[cherk]

Rather.......a BIG bore!