Wellcamp

[bexrbetter]

Fleas would suggest that she goes outside. .

I was asking the dog.

 

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Geoff just because you believe something doesn't always make it true. Sometimes you need to look at things you disagree with to get a better understanding.

 

But like you say there is no fool like an old fool.

 

 

[Geoff13]

I was asking the dog.

Very Good :)

 

 

[ExJourno]

What spite, I am talking facts and figures and he is spouting rubbish

No. You are spouting rubbish. Total and utter rubbish. And asking for figures you know damned well people will not be able to provide you.

 

Stop being a... whatever it is that best describes you... just stop it.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Adam if you don't know anything just say that.

 

 

[turboplanner]

You don't know anything either FT. This is a private business which has set its own strategy and are not likely to waste their time giving personal one on one briefings to spectators.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Correct, it is a private business my main interest is TWB. Adam and Geoff have both demonstrated the power of dogma. If you are rich your biggest single expense is tax, the more you are worth the more time and effort you spend avoiding paying it.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

TP how do you know I don't know anything?

 

 

[turboplanner]

Process of elimination.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Like you always say there is no fool like an old fool.

 

I can't imagine Geoff or Adam taking much interest in the machinations of local politics, there is nothing in it for them. The Wagner's are a fairly well known entity in Toowoomba, when I started looking into this new airport it wasn't hard to find people that had done business with them.

 

 

[Geoff13]

It is very rare that I resort to cutting and pasting preferring to use my own words but this kind of sums it up pretty well.

 

FT I think you fit into the harsher end, the only thing that really disappoints me is how long it took me to pick you. You would not last more than 5 minutes on most of the forums I moderate or visit. Have a fun life.

 

Question: What Is an Internet 'Troll'? How Should I Deal With Trolls?

 

Answer: An internet 'troll' is an abusive or obnoxious user who uses shock value to promote arguments and disharmony in online communities. Named after the wicked troll creatures of children's tales, an internet troll is someone who stirs up drama and abuses their online anonymity by purposely sowing hatred, bigotry, racism, mysogyny, or just simple bickering between others. Trolls like a big audience, so they frequent blog sites, news sites, discussion forums, and game chat. Trolls thrive in any environment where they are allowed to make public comments.

 

At the lighter end of the troll spectrum, trolls can be personal friends who like to goad and joke with their buddies online. In this case, 'trolling' will mean 'stop hassling me, or I won't invite you to my birthday party'.

 

At the harsher end of the troll spectrum, trolls are cruel and malicious users who want to set an online community on fire with hate and discord.

 

The Sad Truths of Internet Trolls:

 

1. Trolls are immune to criticism and logical arguments. True trolls cannot be reasoned with, regardless of how sound your logical argument is.
    
    
   
2. Trolls do not feel remorse like you and me. They have sociopathic tendencies, and accordingly, they delight in other people having hurt feelings.
    
    
   
3. Trolls consider themselves separate from the social order.
    
    
   
4. Trolls do not abide by etiquette or the rules of common courtesy.
    
    
   
5. Trolls consider themselves above social responsibility.
    
    
   
6. Trolls gain energy by you insulting them.
    
    
   
7. Trolls gain energy when you get angry.
    
    
   
8. The only way to deal with a troll is to ignore him, or take away his ability to post online.
    
    
   

 

 

 

 

How Should I Deal With Internet Trolls?

 

You cannot win with a troll. Publicly retaliating against them just fuels their childish need for attention. There are only 3 reliable ways to deal with trolls, all of which focus on removing their audience, removing their power, and depriving them of the attention they seek.

 

1. For a casual or emergent troll: completely ignore the person's postings. While it is difficult for most users to to let a troll have the last word, this tactic successfully takes the wind out of a casual troll's sails.
    
    
   
2. For repeating troll offenders: report them to the moderators of the system. If enough people report the toll, this will often prompt the moderators to take action (see number 3 below)
    
    
   
3. Have the moderators take away the troll's ability to post online. This will commonly mean that the troll is kicked from the system, or blocked by IP address. Even better is when the troll is allowed to continue posting, but unbeknownst to him: all of his postings are deleted from everyone else's view. This will lure the troll into wasting his efforts while still feeling proud of his childish antics. This moderator move is sometimes called 'muting' or 'bonzo-ing' the offender.
    
    
   

 

 

 

 

[fly_tornado]

I just realised most[all] of you blokes have never looked at the site map for the airport

 

http://www.wellcamp.com.au/media/3836/WGN13010-SIte-Map-mK2.pdf

 

Have a look at how small the carpark/terminal area is. The airport is 20kms to my house because its so far and the road gets congested I reckon $40-50 for a cab is about right. Google maps has it as a 20 minute drive. There is no public transport in Toowoomba to speak off, so its car or car. Don't know how its going to go with FIFO workers the long term carpark is a long way from the airport, doesn't look very secure.

 

Geoff, grow up and stop lecturing people

 

 

[fly_tornado]

I've got a question for the "brains trust" which you should be able to answer

 

What is it going to cost to get a B double full of jet fuel delivered from the Port of Brisbane into Wellcamp, its about 180kms drive through Brisbane.

 

 

[rhysmcc]

I just realised most[all] of you blokes have never looked at the site map for the airporthttp://www.wellcamp.com.au/media/3836/WGN13010-SIte-Map-mK2.pdf

 

Have a look at how small the carpark/terminal area is. The airport is 20kms to my house because its so far and the road gets congested I reckon $40-50 for a cab is about right. Google maps has it as a 20 minute drive. There is no public transport in Toowoomba to speak off, so its car or car. Don't know how its going to go with FIFO workers the long term carpark is a long way from the airport, doesn't look very secure.

 

Geoff, grow up and stop lecturing people

When was the last time you caught a taxi from ANY CBD to the airport and it cost under $50?

 

There is no public transport to Cairns or Melbourne Airport, they seem to both turn a profit. Long term carpark is generally further from the airport.

 

I've got a question for the "brains trust" which you should be able to answerWhat is it going to cost to get a B double full of jet fuel delivered from the Port of Brisbane into Wellcamp, its about 180kms drive through Brisbane.

Because Wellcamp is the first ever airport in Australia to be built inland from the sea?

 

I think you have made your point. You know more then everyone else and Wellcamp is going to fail. Can we move on to some real discussion without you hating on everything now?

 

 

[mnewbery]

Jet fuel will be the same price as it costs at Amberley, Roma, Emerald and everywhere else it goes ...

 

http://www.recreationalflying.com/threads/all-jet-fuel-in-australia-to-be-imported-in-2014.103914/#post-388710

 

 

[ExJourno]

I can't imagine Geoff or Adam taking much interest in the machinations of local politics, there is nothing in it for them.

That is one incredibly flawed imagination, you have.

 

Oh, about your insistence that the airport has something to do with avoiding tax... the last time some one spent millions of dollars on infrastructure to avoid tax, they still spent millions of dollars. And avoided less tax than they spent.

 

 

[rankamateur]

the last time some one spent millions of dollars on infrastructure to avoid tax, they still spent millions of dollars. And avoided less tax than they spent.

And that will always be the case until our highest marginal tax rate rises above 100%...unless the proponent is enjoying a 120% investment allowance, which hasn't happened for a considerable time in our great country.

 

 

[bexrbetter]

If you are rich your biggest single expense is tax, the more you are worth the more time and effort you spend avoiding paying it.

Sure but that's not the fault of the "rich" people, it's the fault of the system and it would be silly of them not to take advantage of it.

 

If you pay an accountant $100K per year (whatever) and he can save you a million, I would thank that's a a rather smart move - and again, the fault of the system.

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

Sure but that's not the fault of the "rich" people, it's the fault of the system and it would be silly of them not to take advantage of it.If you pay an accountant $100K per year (whatever) and he can save you a million, I would thank that's a a rather smart move - and again, the fault of the system.

Bex in a legal sense you are correct, but there are other factors governing human behaviour. If I feel it my civic duty to pay my tax rather than spend huge amounts on a tax-dodging mechanism am I, as you say, "silly"? Are the low income masses, who can't evade taxes also "silly"? You blame "the system" for providing opportunities to avoid taxes; who found and exploited those loopholes?

 

One of the pillars of any stable and progressive society is a fair and effective tax system to fund the transport, communications, education and rule of law on which our economy is based. If you can't see this, take a look at Africa.

 

Do our wealthy reinvest their money into building and sustaining the very infrastructure their wealth is based on? Or do they spend it on tax-avoidance?

 

Any country with more tax accountants than scientists won't go far.

 

 

[dazza 38]

With wages , I honestly don't think high income earners should pay more tax than under acheivers. Every body should be on the same tax rate.

 

Not that this has anything to do with the current thread. But this does-

 

The Wagners employs truck load of people with their business interests. I wish them well and I hope this airport succeeds.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

So here is an interview with the mayor recorded today

 

https://soundcloud.com/abc-southern-qld/tmba-region-mayor-paul-antonio-on-convention-center-plans-with-belinda-sanders-on-abc-southern-qld

 

After the local show grounds (RASQ) offered a $5M option to upgrade the existing facilities to host conventions, the show ground already hosts some big events.

 

[MEDIA=soundcloud]abc-southern-qld/damon-phillips-ceo-of-rasq-on-a-toowoomba-convention-center-proposal-with-belinda-sanders-on-abc-sq[/MEDIA]

 

The council budget is $270M, so a $40M convention centre with a 5 star hotel for Toowoomba is madness, imagine the overheads of having too run that.

 

The only way the council could afford that is too sell off TWB or take on $40M of debt.

 

My point about wellcamp being poor value. The cab fare is $80 round trip, the shuttle down to Brisbane is $155 return, that's a door to door service.

 

Compare the Brisbane fares to what Qantas are offering direct.

 

http://www.qantas.com.au/travel/airlines/domestic-flight-specials/from-wellcamp/economy/global/en

 

that hobart fare is a joke you have to go tmba->syd->mel->hob to get if for $199

 

Of course, if you want to head north you have to go via Brisbane.

 

 

[metalman]

Do our wealthy reinvest their money into building and sustaining the very infrastructure their wealth is based on?.

I've pretty much stay out of this , but to answer very simply ,in the case of Brisbane west airport ,,yes they have!

 

 

[WayneL]

Anyone going to the airport open day on the 28th? Last open day was very well organized.

 

 

[ExJourno]

Probably... if I'm in town that day... I wonder if FP will go... he could hassle John Wagner and get answers...

 

Those answers may be less than cordial. Perhaps some of us could rock up with folding chairs and popcorn?

 

 

[WayneL]

Probably... if I'm in town that day... I wonder if FP will go... he could hassle John Wagner and get answers...Those answers may be less than cordial. Perhaps some of us could rock up with folding chairs and popcorn?

Sound good to me.