Engine Off Operations

[turboplanner]

No, I came into it when there were single bitumen runways plus grass, and I have been No5 and got in but I think No 2 and 4 were go rounds.

 

Now it is a two runway system with opposing circuits, which is a bit more sedate, but it was good to see that bunch on final because there is a very heavy Industrial Development programme going on under the present lessee.

 

We're about to get a commercial helicopter link to the CBD for $25.00, so I would expect to see a rise in commuter aircraft soon.

 

Maybe the change was due to the pay grade, but the rapid sales of tricycle undercarriage, and the marketing strategy by Cessna and Piper of the "aerial car" wouldn't have helped.

 

Harry Hawker originally hunted rabbits on the site.

 

 

[facthunter]

Bankstown was an all over field when I first went there (from Newcastle). We generally preferred Kingsford Smith (with special VFR clearance.) Much simpler process getting in there though, even when the weather was marginal. Taxiing long distances when winds were strong, punished the brakes occasionally. The advantage with an all over field is most landings are into wind. A luxury today where you are required to land downwind a lot of the time at controlled aerodromes. You can object but you will be in the air a lot longer. Nev

 

 

[Guest ozzie]

Can't go slope soaring as you can't fly within 1000ft horizontal to terrain.

 

 

[Head in the clouds]

Can't go slope soaring as you can't fly within 1000ft horizontal to terrain.

Yes, but you don't need to be below the top of the ridge, or even on the windward face of the ridge to be slope soaring.

There's plenty of lift above the ridge and we'll out from the face, as you'd see at any hanggliding site.

 

World altitude records in gliders/sailplanes were set in USA at about 30,000ft flying mountain waves which is a form of slope soaring.

 

 

[Guest ozzie]

keep it real world.

 

 

[Head in the clouds]

keep it real world.

I was Ozzie, but my real world may well be different from yours.

 

Here in South East Queensland we don't have any Kosciuszkos, Blue Mountains or Flinders Ranges, and the humble 1000ft or so ridges that we do have are clad in rainforest. Consequently if you are slope soaring around here and ever get down as low as 500ft above the ridge you're pretty well committed to an outlanding if the donk decided to be stubborn to start, so you'd better have already moved yourself well out from the face of the slope too. In which case, either way you're not going to have a vertical or horizontal proximity-to-terrain issue.

 

Another favoured slope soaring site is the lighthouse bluff at Byron Bay which is only 250ft above sea level but has a SE face and is ideal for soaring the prevailing SE winds. The strong lift there goes to well over 1000ft with beach in all directions for bomb-outs if required. I've never actually tried it but on a good day I reckon you could get to 2000ft a mile or two behind the ridge without working too hard.

 

Why the grizzle about this Ozzie? I thought you were once a hangie weren't you?

 

 

[Ballpoint 246niner]

In my HG days I used to fly the east face and Tallows regularly, once even thermalled up to 1700 and stuck with it and went over the back eventually landing near the old dairy. A couple of the sky gods of the day have even gone over the highway!

 

Thread drifting but who cares the engine is off!

 

 

[RickH]

I am left wondering if any one on the board ever actually reads this forum. I often read posts refering to rules being enforced that don't actually exist. Another example of our organisation being stuffed up by desk pilots trying to build empires.

 

The board appears to forget that they are supposed to persue and represent the interest of the members' (being democratic I guess I should add "majority of " " views.

 

It seems to me from what I read on this forum that the majority of members would prefer no more rule changes, ie leave the bloody manual alone , "No More Ammendments".

 

Does anyone on the board actually give a SH-T about what the members of this organisation want or do they actually have their heads firmly somewhere other than in the clouds.

 

I would like to ask what can be done to get the board to listen to the members or do we need to start looking at forming an alternative organisation to RAA.

 

 

[turboplanner]

A good starting point would be to get the members to vote. If they don't vote or communicate then how do the board members determine what direction to take?

 

 

[RickH]

Is this forum not the best way to communicate? As for whether people vote I have no way of Knowing who votes and who does not.

 

Communication is no good if it is one way and as a member I do not recall once being asked to vote on rule changes or ammendments and would suggest that it would be a very simple thing to add a facility to this site where Ammendments etc could be promulgated and where members once having entered their member number could press a button to accept or reject. Very simple and totally democratic.

 

 

[Teckair]

Is this forum not the best way to communicate?

I think not, best way is to contact the board members, it works for me. Our biggest problem has been apathy of most of the members who do not vote, communicate or participate on this forum.

 

 

[RickH]

Have you ever been asked to vote on proposed rule changes?

 

I will be writing to the board suggesting that the facility I suggested above be added to this site.

 

I will be very interested to see what is their reply.

 

 

[Teckair]

Have you ever been asked to vote on proposed rule changes?I will be writing to the board suggesting that the facility I suggested above be added to this site.

I will be very interested to see what is their reply.

Once again talking to your board member would be the best way. The problem with forums is you get trolls and other morons that spoil things.

 

 

[RickH]

Teckair you didnot answer my question. Have you ever been asked to vote on a rule change?

 

 

[Guest ozzie]

I've flown Byron and the surrounds back in the seventies along with most east coast sites, Stanwell being my main site. The Lazair mixes pretty well with flexwings. It was based on Klaus Hills Superfloater. It does not mix well with sailplanes. Ridge soaring and thermalling, I'm capable, the Lazair is more than capable, the rules as they stand are not capable.

 

I was hoping that the electric conversion that Dale Kramer was working on would have made it all that much easier regarding restarts but that has fallen through.

 

 

[Ballpoint 246niner]

I've flown Byron and the surrounds back in the seventies along with most east coast sites, Stanwell being my main site. The Lazair mixes pretty well with flexwings. It was based on Klaus Hills Superfloater. It does not mix well with sailplanes. Ridge soaring and thermalling, I'm capable, the Lazair is more than capable, the rules as they stand are not capable.I was hoping that the electric conversion that Dale Kramer was working on would have made it all that much easier regarding restarts but that has fallen through.

We probably crossed wings at Tallows, Lennox, the old site, Monty, Coorabel and any number of great spots around there.

 

 

[Aerochute Kev]

I think Rich has a good point. We have voted in new Board members and whilst we are getting a bit more information the systemic problems are still there. A LITTLE bit more information but what as actually changed? The membership fees still rise (with no increase in service) and a million or so in the bank, that no one is prepared to say what it is specifically for. Registrations are still taking far too long. We have rule changes which do not seem for the betterment of the pilots that are supposed to be the focus of the organisation OR for increasing safety, and we have a new proposed Ops Manual that is so secret even the members are not allowed to see it. We even seem to have staff insistent on taking members to task over rules that do not exist.

 

The idea of voting on proposed changes to the organisation on a forum has merit, and if using single voting checks (like membership numbers), I don't see why it can't work. It doesn't even have to be this forum, it could be the RAAus website, but the biggest issue will be getting RAAus to actually inform us of proposed changes and set up the voting system. I know some will say it's the reps job to act on our behalf, but is also their job to inform us of their decisions and why they were made.

 

Its time the Board laid everything on the table and came clean and explained their actions and why they think the decisions they have made are for the betterment of RRAus (the members, not the staff and the Board). I don't think the current Board are able to do this. I said along time ago the entire Board should be dismissed and an administrator appointed so we can start again with a clean slate. I know we have some new Board members that say good things are happening, but they obviously can't do what they wanted to do, or should be doing, under the current regime. I still have not had enough information to make me change my mind.

 

And just because this is on a thread about engine off ops, I had a delightful flight this afternoon and shut down from 2000ft enjoying the peaceful journey to earth. I even survived and managed to do so without inconveniencing or injuring anyone else . RAAus have my details if they feel the need to "counsel" me.

 

 

[RickH]

I appreciate your comments Aerochute

 

This evening I E-mailed RAA Ops Admin

 

and made the same suggestion as I made above. I also posted a new thread under General Discussions labled Can we fix it.

 

The thread appeared after I posted it and remained on the forum for about half an hour afterwards.

 

I subsequently logged off ( had to cook dinner)

 

I have just logged back on and the thread seems to have dissappeared.

 

Is some one trying to gag me

 

 

[gandalph]

I appreciate your comments AerochuteThis evening I E-mailed RAA Ops Admin

and made the same suggestion as I made above. I also posted a new thread under General Discussions labled Can we fix it.

 

The thread appeared after I posted it and remained on the forum for about half an hour afterwards.

 

I subsequently logged off ( had to cook dinner)

 

I have just logged back on and the thread seems to have dissappeared.

 

Is some one trying to gag me

Relax RickH. Your thread is still there. It's just not at the top of the page anymore. Check the "What's new (24hrs)" tab. It's about halfway down the page.

 

 

[Teckair]

Have you ever been asked to vote on proposed rule changes?

No. That does not normally happen with any governing body.

 

I will be very interested to see what is their reply.

The answer will be no.

 

 

[turboplanner]

No. That does not normally happen with any governing body.

It happens in EVERY Association I know of; why wouldn't the owners of the Association be consulted?

 

 

[Teckair]

It happens in EVERY Association I know of; why wouldn't the owners of the Association be consulted?

Because it would not be practical. You would have to be naive to think that would work. It would be a real problem if the board members were silly enough to go for that idea. We have way to many people who do nothing but complain who don't vote or communicate with their Reps.

 

 

[turboplanner]

RAA has the ability to do a DAILY email/SMS to its members ..... if it wanted to end the secrecy

 

 

[facthunter]

It is not practical to run a members plebiscite on nearly every thing. After a while all you would hear is "We elected YOU GUYS to make the decisions get on with it, or we'll put someone else in. Nev

 

 

[turboplanner]

That may be so, many people are careless that what, but at least people like Rick would have been asked, and out of 8,000 people, many would have skills that would prevent errors, waste of money, improve the decision and so on.

 

We debated it 5 years ago so there's no point in wasting air, you can see the result for yourself today.