jabiru down brisbane

[Oscar]

Agreed FT, but when RAAus finally gets our registration records computerised it should be a doddle for someone to extract quite useful statistics.

Trouble there is, at the moment (as far as I know) what is being done is scanning the paper docs. Unless they're using a very sophisticated OCR programme to turn those into text (and in my experience, OCR is extremely haphazard at recognising text unless it's all in one font, which it won't be), that makes the records unsearchable. So - apart from the fact that with the scanned records available, actual human reading of the records to extract information can be outsourced from the RAA HQ, actually getting a specific piece of information from the records remains a highly labour-intensive task.

 

What is desperately needed is for RAA to get the records into a database with a sensible field structure AND using normalised vocabulary. To a degree, applying Google search algorithms to a data source can produce impressive results, but you really need very advanced data mining techniques to get anything like reliable search results.

 

 

[planedriver]

Might work if you get unbiased people who have real experience at troubleshooting. I'm dropping in at CAMit in about 5 weeks. Today is my last day on this computer for 7 weeks Nev

We'll all miss you Nev, have a great time whatever you do mate.

 

No doubt you'll return to the fold with more wise words.

 

Kind Regards

 

Planey

 

 

[reggie]

Fit a carby temp gauge, then it's just a matter of scanning every few minutes along with all the other gauges. Makes for interesting viewing.

 

 

[turboplanner]

Try the Courier Mail.

No comments in the Courier Mail story

 

 

[RKW]

Turbo, it may not be in the online version but it was certainly in the printed version!

 

 

[Guest Andys@coffs]

Which is all why he should have just said "we are investigating the cause and will make comment following a full investigation".As a lawyer he should know better...

 

For me - he needs to make a statement clarify his position because I am very unimpressed by his reported actions in publicly denigrating and devaluing my aircraft and I question his ability to do the job if this is how he operates. He represents the recreational aviation industry to the public, including pilots and manufacturers and he needs to get it right.

I believe that what was said, paraphrased was "one crash is a crash too often" and "we notify CASA when we have safety concerns".

 

From that we got what the papers published.

 

If, given what I have provided was 3rd hand to me, that is what he said then he in no way did he say anything that relates specifically to Jabirus' rather to participants these are motherhood statements. They are true but have as much weight to them as a helium balloon.......

 

So "publicly denigrating and devaluing my aircraft......." I don't think that occurred at the CEO level but rather at the next level in reporting.

 

Andy

 

 

[turboplanner]

If the board members don't want to follow their constitution and they let others to do their work, things can go wrong, and backfire on them.

 

I did see RAA quoted as saying something a bit stronger than your quote Andy, but as someone has said, it has gone as RKW suggested, but I don't recall it being attributed to the CEO.

 

I remember thinking it strange that they would be asking CASA to do something about the situation when they have the power to take action themselves.

 

 

[Oscar]

Can you tell us where he said this?

No, I cannot, I have only the report on this thread. I did say 'it seems', and if no such statement was ever made, then obviously my comment is not based on fact. If the reported comment is either the imagination of a reporter OR of the poster of that information, then I unreservedly apologise to the CEO - and am very happy that no such statement was, in fact, made. The specifics of the reputed statement suggest more than just a complete fabrication on the part of a reporter.

 

HOWEVER: if there is any truth in the post made on this thread, I stand by my comment. Leaving aside any issues about whether IN FACT, Jabirus have a statistically damning rate of 'crashes' ( and for that to be correct, we need the total hours flown for the breed vs. 'accidents' that are NOT pilot error - and on that score, injury/fatal results need to be considered), the proposition that the most populous aircraft brand being flown under RAA auspices has been branded as 'unsafe' by the CEO of RAA, has a huge reflection on RAA operations.

 

Just think about this: an in-depth 'investigation' by a tabloid reporter takes this alleged statement as proof that RAA is condoning the operation of a majority of its aircraft despite it admitting that they are 'unsafe'. Where does that leave we RAA aircraft owner/operators? Up a certain creek, and sans paddles.

 

Is that what you seek? That RAA should be excised from the scene as some sort of 'outlaw' operation, promoting/accepting the use of 'unsafe' devices? How many regional airports continue to exist because of RAA operation? How many FTFs, L2's, manufacturers exist on RAA activity alone? How many people fly under RAA auspices?

 

 

[turboplanner]

You are tying yourself up in knots Oscar drawing conclusions of your own which go way beyond what I remember seeing.

 

 

[AVOCET]

No, I cannot, I have only the report on this thread. I did say 'it seems', and if no such statement was ever made, then obviously my comment is not based on fact. If the reported comment is either the imagination of a reporter OR of the poster of that information, then I unreservedly apologise to the CEO - and am very happy that no such statement was, in fact, made. The specifics of the reputed statement suggest more than just a complete fabrication on the part of a reporter.HOWEVER: if there is any truth in the post made on this thread, I stand by my comment. Leaving aside any issues about whether IN FACT, Jabirus have a statistically damning rate of 'crashes' ( and for that to be correct, we need the total hours flown for the breed vs. 'accidents' that are NOT pilot error - and on that score, injury/fatal results need to be considered), the proposition that the most populous aircraft brand being flown under RAA auspices has been branded as 'unsafe' by the CEO of RAA, has a huge reflection on RAA operations.

 

Just think about this: an in-depth 'investigation' by a tabloid reporter takes this alleged statement as proof that RAA is condoning the operation of a majority of its aircraft despite it admitting that they are 'unsafe'. Where does that leave we RAA aircraft owner/operators? Up a certain creek, and sans paddles.

 

Is that what you seek? That RAA should be excised from the scene as some sort of 'outlaw' operation, promoting/accepting the use of 'unsafe' devices? How many regional airports continue to exist because of RAA operation? How many FTFs, L2's, manufacturers exist on RAA activity alone? How many people fly under RAA auspices?

That would make a good Australian feature film ! Your on a roll Oscar .

 

 

[RKW]

I now have the article from the courier. Quote "Recreational aviation Australia chief Michael linke said his organisation which will lead the investigation into the latest crash, had safety concerns about jabirus before yesterday's incident. ' we've written to Casa about this particular type of aircraft, so we've advised them that crashes have happened once too often' he said.

 

Thanks to Michael at our local coffee shop who helped me crawl through a dumpster to retrieve the courier mail. Regards, Bob

 

 

[turboplanner]

Thanks RKW.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Hardly slanderous!

 

 

[Oscar]

You are tying yourself up in knots Oscar drawing conclusions of your own which go way beyond what I remember seeing.

Fair enough, Turbs. I presume you had a hardcopy of the Courier Mail to support your side of the debate?

 

 

[01rmb]

 

It appears that Michael Linke was quoted as saying that there were "safety concerns about Jabirus" and that "they had written to CASA about this particular type of aircraft so we've advised them that crashes have happened once too often" rather than the reporter simply misinterpreting safety as being "one crash is a crash too often" so I stand by what I said and I believe he overstepped the mark and the board should pull him back in line.

 

Not slanderous but certainly denigrating and as the representative of the organisation I am a member of as a pilot and an aircraft owner of the type that is being commented on, I expect better of him in his public presentation of the recreational aircraft industry he represents.

 

 

[motzartmerv]

See...Steps:) the wheels turn slowly, but they turn..

 

 

[Oscar]

Oh dear. I guess the text in this scan was Photoshopped to include the reported comments from Michael Linke. Damn neat job, I have to admit, as an industrial user of Photoshop.

 

 

[motzartmerv]

Well, I say not a day too soon...maybe we finally have a CEO with a pair hey?

 

 

[Chird65]

Well, I say not a day too soon...maybe we finally have a CEO with a pair hey?

Actually there is a difference between having "a pair" and being effective. Is the media the place to air this or is it really up to CASA and ATSB to investigate and make recommendations. I think if RAA have a concern then they have done the right thing, and could even go as far as offering statistics and reports to these bodies.

 

 

[dodo]

The CASA audit of RA had the following to say re Jabiru:

 

 

 

[Oscar]

Well, I say not a day too soon...maybe we finally have a CEO with a pair hey?

Hallejulah! Testosterone is WAY, WAY more important than intellect, especially when lives, incomes and progress is considered. Shut down those 2,000 or so Jabiru owner/operators. Obliterate about 2/3rds of the RAA fleet. Excise the foundation stone of the Australian LSA industry. Oh, and by the way, you will be getting your Brumby parts from China in future..good luck with that..

 

 

[Keenaviator]

Distracted from turning the fuel on? You wont get to experience that too many times.

Especially if you get distracted from flying the plane - ask John Denver.

 

 

[Dafydd Llewellyn]

The CASA audit of RA had the following to say re Jabiru:

So? That just says to me, there are more Jabirus around than any other type.

 

 

[kaz3g]

[ATTACH=full]31478[/ATTACH]It appears that Michael Linke was quoted as saying that there were "safety concerns about Jabirus" and that "they had written to CASA about this particular type of aircraft so we've advised them that crashes have happened once too often" rather than the reporter simply misinterpreting safety as being "one crash is a crash too often" so I stand by what I said and I believe he overstepped the mark and the board should pull him back in line.

 

Not slanderous but certainly denigrating and as the representative of the organisation I am a member of as a pilot and an aircraft owner of the type that is being commented on, I expect better of him in his public presentation of the recreational aircraft industry he represents.

In my limited dealings with the popular press, I have been quoted out of context on a couple of occasions when two statements made a short time apart were joined together to get the maximum sensational effect.having a law degree doesn't immunise you from this.

 

.kaz

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

Trouble there is, at the moment (as far as I know) what is being done is scanning the paper docs. Unless they're using a very sophisticated OCR programme to turn those into text (and in my experience, OCR is extremely haphazard at recognising text unless it's all in one font, which it won't be), that makes the records unsearchable...

Good grief, if that is what they call computerisation of record, then it's another short-term bandaid fix- and we'll have more grief down the track.

But then again, this is Australia.