Congratulations & Thanks Andy & Michael

[DonRamsay]

. . . Don, how often are you in your local library?

Wouldn't be seen dead in one. But plenty of the target market for RA-Aus (baby-boomers) still use libraries.

 

Personally, in this day and age if people want to read the paper or a magazine or a novel, I think they should go to a newsagents and buy one rather than bludge on ratepayers. Same story for CDs and DVDs. Reference libraries are a great asset for students of all ages and that's where the Library budget should go not on the latest edition of House & Garden.

 

Don

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Don, have you noticed there's no reward for being a good rep or a penalty for being a bad one? Eugene will be hanging around forever

 

 

[DonRamsay]

For somebody other than Eugene to be elected we need a good alternative. We had good alternatives but they didn't get enough votes and Eugene got too many. Why? Members did not know of Eugene's performance on the Board. We also need good old fashioned campaigning even candidate debates at local aero clubs.

 

We also need the President has to turn the wick up under those who coast along basking in the reflected "glory" of being on the Board. The President needs to start reporting routinely on the performance of individual Board Members. Things like who voted for, who voted against and who didn't get around to participating in the debate and voting at all. We should know who worked on which project - e.g. Trevor Bange did a great job on the Insurance.

 

For the democratic process to work, members needs to know who's rowing, who's coasting and who's doing a "Sally Robinson". Then we can rely on the good sense of members to vote and vote with good knowledge of the candidates.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

I somehow never imagined a SFR would spend his days or nights rereading Eugene's pearls of wisdom. Obviously electing people based on location is a stupid system and doesn't work.

 

But we've always done it that way so why fix it?

 

 

[DonRamsay]

We must get away from the postcode qualification for Board membership. The current system doesn't always deliver duds but it does narrow choices and can allow people to be elected (returned unopposed) on very few votes out the 10,000 strong membership. Bit like what's going on in the Senate .

 

I wouldn't care less if all Board Members were from WA. Aviation laws and CASA's reach are independent of parochial region boundaries. Ther is nothing that a WA dominated Board could do to advantage WA and disadvantage, say, NQ. Geography is simply irrelevant - skills, qualifications and experience are what we will get value from. A Board member for NSW that lives in say Coffs Harbour is not going to be able to make drop in visits to people in Broken Hill. He/She are going to have to rely on modern means of comms - email, phones, etc.

 

We need fewer Board Members and lets be grown up enough to not get our flaps in a knot if we don't have one from our region.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

That will never happen, too many vested interests

 

 

[DonRamsay]

Vested interests? Other than our state is better than your state crap or I don't want my seat merged out of existence, what vested interest could anyone have?

 

 

[fly_tornado]

I don't want my seat merged out of existence

 

 

[DonRamsay]

They're all quite comfortable with somebody else's seat being merged just not their own.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

And the conventional logic is that a reform like this only benefits the members not the board

 

 

[coljones]

It seems that 13 can't think outside the square why would/should we expect 7 to be any more visionary?

 

 

[Guest Andys@coffs]

I also had the discussion with Don that while the board of RAAus has to from time to time shift gear and become hands on managers as Tubs has alluded to, when we are between CEO's or have someone filling the seat, taking the salary, but not so much in delivering the results........In such times (not exactly unheard of within RAAus) perhaps the additional numbers can be advantageous, although I can see the argument that today we have 13, and of that 13 not all actually extend themselves to anything beyond reading email....so perhaps 7 that were prepared to roll up the sleeves when necessary, but equally kept their hands out when not necessary may be advantageous.

 

Andy

 

 

[kgwilson]

We must get away from the postcode qualification for Board membership. The current system doesn't always deliver duds but it does narrow choices and can allow people to be elected (returned unopposed) on very few votes out the 10,000 strong membership. Bit like what's going on in the Senate .I wouldn't care less if all Board Members were from WA. Aviation laws and CASA's reach are independent of parochial region boundaries. Ther is nothing that a WA dominated Board could do to advantage WA and disadvantage, say, NQ. Geography is simply irrelevant - skills, qualifications and experience are what we will get value from. A Board member for NSW that lives in say Coffs Harbour is not going to be able to make drop in visits to people in Broken Hill. He/She are going to have to rely on modern means of comms - email, phones, etc.

 

We need fewer Board Members and lets be grown up enough to not get our flaps in a knot if we don't have one from our region.

The real issue imho is the fact that we are an incorporated association bound by antiquated A.C.T. act of parliament & a constitution that does not & can not work for a modern business. We should get out of this mode and re-invent ourselves as a not for profit company & become RA-Aus Pty Ltd. Simple, and only have 5 or 7 directors inclusive of the Chairman. They'd all get paid but the cost of having the current number would cover this. It is how we effect this change that is the challenge.

 

 

[turboplanner]

The Associations Incorporations Act are pretty much the same throughout the Country kg

 

What happened with RAA was that the starting gun fired and they are still looking at their running shoes, and the only barriers, the only two things preventing the Association from being moulded into a cutting edge 21st Century showpiece are Motions and Votes.

 

It might seem hard to believe, but it's as simple as that; the RAA's Constitution is still very close to the Model Rules given out to the masses to start their first Gumleaf Whistle Association with some very self centred changes, such as the rules which allowed the Executive to manage in secret, but it's still waiting for the day to day systems and rules which would have made it thrive years ago.

 

 

[turboplanner]

Anyhow, perhaps you could suggest copies for Libraries to your local Board Member?

That would be a bit like dropping of a few horse shoes at the Ford dealership Don.

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

It seems that 13 can't think outside the square why would/should we expect 7 to be any more visionary?

Sorry Col, have to disagree with you there. By necessity the board is definitely thinking outside of the square lately !........Maj

 

 

[rhysmcc]

How can you get 10 invalid papers in the NQ election, when there is only 2 candidates. Can anyone who was present at the counting give some examples?

 

Congratulations Maj, looking forward to seeing some of the items we have discussed being implemented.

 

 

[coljones]

I don't think that there is any particular legislation which controls rogues any better than any other. In any business, the thing that really focuses the interests of stakeholders are dividends and share price and a few big bully boys on the share register - it helps if they went to the same school as the directors. Most of the big, bad bankruptcies and fraud occurred under federal corporations law.

 

The major thing lacking in our rules at the moment is the ability to have a postal ballot - a limitation of ACT law. The NSW Act does provide for postal ballots of both "ordinary" and "special" resolutions. Perhaps we should resurrect the constitution review panel and consider moving to a more enlightened domicile. We don't need to go to the Companies act to solve our most basic problem.

 

 

[DonRamsay]

How can you get 10 invalid papers in the NQ election, when there is only 2 candidates. Can anyone who was present at the counting give some examples?

The thing that causes most votes to be declared invalid is if the member number is not written on the back of the envelope or it is written on the ballot paper.

 

There is, I agree, a terribly high level of informal votes and it doesn't reflect well on those who can't follow instructions particularly if there are only two candidates.

 

The NSW ballot paper and instructions were not wonderfully clear this time but even still, it is not hard to write 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 and your member number on the back of the envelope.

 

 

[DonRamsay]

Col, you've hit the nail on the head there. ACT Legislation is behind NSW. NSW does give us a chance to be more modern with postal voting.

 

And, as Turbo says, we can re-write the Constitution to say pretty well anything we want as long as we stay within the Act.

 

We do need the Constitution review Committee revived, again. That would make it CRC Mark III.

 

I understand that our new CEO has some very relevant experience with Constitution reform and could be a great help in getting the reform happening.

 

 

[turboplanner]

Col, you've hit the nail on the head there. ACT Legislation is behind NSW. NSW does give us a chance to be more modern with postal voting.

I could be wrong, but it could possibly be that RAA has never written to the ACT Department of Justice requesting postal voting.

 

If that was the case, then a letter of request might not be a bad idea, particularly if the State Acts are quoted.

 

I couldn't see them objecting or creating too much delay in bringing themselves into line with the States, perhaps even by immediate dispensation.

 

 

[DonRamsay]

Good point Turbo and no, to the best of my knowledge, nobody has asked for a way around the legislation. We actually passed a motion to amend the Constitution to allow for postal voting but had to pull it out again when we found we were in conflict with the ACT legislation. It wouldn't take much for the ACT to update their legislation to match other jurisdictions but the real point about getting out of Canberra is that it is a a very expensive city to be based in. Labour and accommodation costs are high Canberra is an expensive destination to fly in and out of.

 

It is very convenient at the moment to have our President domiciled in the same city as the HQ especially as RA-Aus pulls itself up out of the mire of the last five years. However, "in the fullness of time" RA-Aus needs to get out of Canberra to a sizeable Regional Centre with handy airport facilities. I've worked in steel plants, mine sites and swanky head offices and it is very clear in my mind which location focuses the staff on the business at hand and the real purpose for being.

 

 

[rhysmcc]

I can't see getting out of Canberra will be high on the CEO's list considering it's his place of residence. Lets focus more on moving the HQ to a digital setup and worry about where the fewer staff that should be required after, are going to be housed.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Getting the RAA ops automated will save a fortune in wages, not only from losing positions but from demoting people because they are no longer supervising staff.

 

 

[turboplanner]

Good point Turbo and no, to the best of my knowledge, nobody has asked for a way around the legislation.

What I suggested was asking for the legislation to be updated, certainly not for "a way around it" which would bring a certain flea to the ear.

 

There would be other national bodies registered in the ACT, and if the references to the State Acts were provided it's probably only as far away as the parliamentary programme.

 

If it's in the queue to be tabled, it's sometimes surprising how quickly things happen. Some years ago trucks in Victoria by law had to have the owners name and address on the driver's door in large letters. I was visiting a customer in Griffith NSW one day and he was complaining about an $85 fine on his NSW truck. From his office I phoned a friend at Vicroads who promised to reverse the fine since the law only applied to Victorian trucks, While he was on the phone I suggested he get rid of the law since Vicroads had the details databased with the registration plate. The Government announced its repeal about 8 weeks later.

 

So a letter of request would be well worthwhile because postal voting will encourage more people to vote, and if more think about voting more will take ownership.