W & B even the big boys can get it wrong...

[Old Koreelah]

http://m.smh.com.au/business/schoolkids-tip-balance-of-qantas-plane-20140903-10bv5i.html

[Downunder]

What's more of a worry is putting all the children up the FRONT and the adults down the back.

 

Qantas luck......still holding out.

 

 

[Jabiru7252]

Standard adult weight of 87kg. I remember when it was 70kg.

 

 

[Downunder]

Standard adult weight of 87kg. I remember when it was 70kg.

Wishing I was 87.......probably close to 30% over that. However, thinking about it, my wife is under 50.

Does that mean we have to always travel together?

 

 

[turboplanner]

87 doesn't sound too bad; I adjusted up to 90 kg for truck calculations recently.

 

We have a growing mean weight like USA with plenty of people over 110 kg, but more at 70

 

 

[rankamateur]

Even at 87Kg i can see merit in MTOW above 600Kg for a tourer, going to be interesting getting the co-pilot on the scales, she is a bit shy about things like that. It is just going to be in the rules, "no weigh, you stay!".

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

The obvious solution; from a part of the world that needs it:

 

http://www.samoaair.ws/index.php/booking-2/pay-by-weight

 

 

[dazza 38]

We have 3 Qantaslink flights on wednesday from Brisbane to Miles and back. Our first flight today was 1 hour 45 minutes late. The 2nd flight, my flight was 1 hour late. Weight and balance is important to me, but more importantly is the plane farking turning up ;)

 

 

[dutchroll]

I've always had a healthy disrespect for load sheet calcs. Sure, most of the time it's pretty right, but on some occasions on the B767, and now on the A330, I've input backstick at rotate speed only to have the plane try to leap into the air with gusto and require a quick check forward, or for little effect and requiring a significant extra effort!

 

This is usually followed by a "well so much for the f*ing stab trim setting!" comment or similar after takeoff!

 

Fortuitously the big jets are responsive to corrective inputs over a wide CG range. The big problem occurs if the TOW is undercalculated on a performance limited takeoff (aka Melbourne and Emirates a while back, which almost had tragic results).

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

...Fortuitously the big jets are responsive to corrective inputs over a wide CG range...

The smaller domestic jets on which I've travelled have a huge range of movement in the tailplane (independent of the elevator.) Do you blokes use all this in normal flights?

 

 

[Guernsey]

On then smaller domestic jets I've travelled on the tailplanesWow!! I bet that was uncomfortable. .

 

Alan.

[red750]

"On then smaller domestic jets I've travelled on the tailplanes

 

Wow!! I bet that was uncomfortable. .

 

Alan."

 

Who said commas don't make any difference to how you read something?

 

 

[dutchroll]

On then smaller domestic jets I've travelled on the tailplanes seem to have a huge range of movement (independent of the elevator.) Do you blokes use all this in normal flights?

There is no such thing as elevator trim on these jets, so yes the horizontal stabiliser moves quite a bit in response to pitch trim inputs in various configs (esp when taking flaps etc). But the full range is much more than you need for "normal" operations, just as an elevator trim can move to much greater extremes than you normally need in a small plane.

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

Okey ewes blokes! I have corrected my cruddy post so it makes sense.

 

 

[dutchroll]

T

 

Okey ewes blokes! I have corrected my cruddy post so it makes sense.

Think yourself lucky.

On an unofficial company chat forum recently we had guys copping it for incorrect use of possessive apostrophes, unnecessary past participles (well ok that criticism might've been my contribution!), starting sentences with conjunctions, and the crème de la crème: the incorrect use of the second person possessive pronoun instead of the second person present tense of the verb "to be"! That's "your" versus "you're", if you're wondering!

 

 

[poteroo]

TThink yourself lucky.

 

On an unofficial company chat forum recently we had guys copping it for incorrect use of possessive apostrophes, unnecessary past participles (well ok that criticism might've been my contribution!), starting sentences with conjunctions, and the crème de la crème: the incorrect use of the second person possessive pronoun instead of the second person present tense of the verb "to be"! That's "your" versus "you're", if you're wondering!

One example of 'RPT-speak' that my students try to emulate is speaking in the 3rd person....eg

 

Foxtrot November Delta rolls runway 14........................ we mere lighties say 'rolling' or 'is rolling'

 

 

 

Foxtrot November Delta joins downwind runway 32....... we try to get our students to say 'joining' or 'is joining'

 

 

Without being too anal about it - why does the language seem to change with the tonnage of the aircraft?

 

happy days,

 

 

[Guest ozzie]

I'm only 55kg but i don't get any credit if i'm a kilo over on my carry on.

 

And I'll take full giddy up and bloody go on take off thank you. You can pull the power as we go through 500 ft.

 

 

[pylon500]

Standard adult weight of 87kg. I remember when it was 70kg.

I can't remember when I weighed either of those weights!

 

 

[dutchroll]

One example of 'RPT-speak' that my students try to emulate is speaking in the 3rd person....eg

I don't personally recall any of my company colleagues talking in the 3rd person like that, but I've heard other airlines do it (BA is notorious) and I cringe when I hear it. I'm right with you & would fully support debriefing students on that one!

 

 

[poteroo]

I don't personally recall any of my company colleagues talking in the 3rd person like that, but I've heard other airlines do it (BA is notorious) and I cringe when I hear it. I'm right with you & would fully support debriefing stidents on that one!

Great - we need support to resist this. The problem is that this affected and pretentious speech habit is more infectious than a virus! Instructors are not immune to it! cheers,

 

 

[biggles]

Even at 87Kg i can see merit in MTOW above 600Kg for a tourer, going to be interesting getting the co-pilot on the scales, she is a bit shy about things like that. It is just going to be in the rules, "no weigh, you stay!".

" My way or the Highway " doesn't work for me Steve . I just say " I think you have lost some weight lately dear " and that usually gets a fairly quick response to the bathroom scales ,quickly followed by me as the observer . By the way that's only one of two things I've learned during the past 50 years of married life !

 

Bob

 

 

[biggles]

We have 3 Qantaslink flights on wednesday from Brisbane to Miles and back. Our first flight today was 1 hour 45 minutes late. The 2nd flight, my flight was 1 hour late. Weight and balance is important to me, but more importantly is the plane farking turning up ;)

Just sayin '. eh Dazz

 

 

[dazza 38]

Just sayin '. eh Dazz

Yup, even though everything is true in what I said. Hopefully people realise that I meant it in a light hearted kind of way. I'm not sure why our aircraft was late VH-SBJ, but first aircraft VH-SBB wouldn't start in Brisbane. I guess the aircrew didn't have a can of 'Start ya bastard' handy to spray into the turbine inlet.;)

 

 

[rankamateur]

One example of 'RPT-speak' that my students try to emulate is speaking in the 3rd person....egFoxtrot November Delta rolls runway 14........................ we mere lighties say 'rolling' or 'is rolling'

 

 

 

Foxtrot November Delta joins downwind runway 32....... we try to get our students to say 'joining' or 'is joining'

 

 

Without being too anal about it - why does the language seem to change with the tonnage of the aircraft?

 

happy days,

Are they in a way dissociating themselves from the action of the plane , in the same way that if it rolls through the fence at the end of the landing roll, they were not responsible.

 

 

[Downunder]

Are they in a way dissociating themselves from the action of the plane , in the same way that if it rolls through the fence at the end of the landing roll, they were not responsible.

You could be onto something there.

Saying "I am" denotes ownership of the aircraft and it's actions?