ave8rr Posted October 10, 2014 Posted October 10, 2014 Why are the ATSB investigating this incident involving an RAAus aircraft http://www.atsb.com.au/publications/investigation_reports/2014/aair/ao-2014-160.aspx but don't attend when the accident involves fatalities in RAAus aircraft?
ave8rr Posted October 10, 2014 Author Posted October 10, 2014 fare paying passengers in 2nd aircraft. Yep Ozzie. I thought the same thing. Cheers mike
Guest Crezzi Posted October 10, 2014 Posted October 10, 2014 Why are the ATSB investigating this incident involving an RAAus aircraft http://www.atsb.com.au/publications/investigation_reports/2014/aair/ao-2014-160.aspxbut don't attend when the accident involves fatalities in RAAus aircraft? innocent members of the public potentially affected rather than just informed participants. Hope the pilot was legal at Broome John PS Ozzie beat me to it
turboplanner Posted October 10, 2014 Posted October 10, 2014 ATSB said about 12 months ago they want to investigate as many RA accidents as they can afford. Innocent members of the public have been going down for years, but sure, maybe that triggered it. When I was researching engine failure induced forced landings over a five year period, I couldn't help but note MANY runway excursions, a lot with either a full end over or upend on to a wing tip, and that could also have triggered interest. Or it could just be that budget is available to do the investigation; don't forget there's a monthly menu of incidents in the RAA magazine which draws the attention of a lot of people.
Old Koreelah Posted October 10, 2014 Posted October 10, 2014 Maybe ATSB had investigators nearby. Why not use them?
AVOCET Posted October 10, 2014 Posted October 10, 2014 If the virgin jet wasnt there , there'd be no need for ATSB to got involved ,you'd think. But If they've got time on their hands then they might start "a cold case file " So there could be a knock on the door somtime in the future for any one whos filed an incident report .FWIW. Mike
turboplanner Posted October 10, 2014 Posted October 10, 2014 I don't think so Mike, because they are limited by funds availability. I think this was kicked off by some of the glaring mistakes in the spate of RA crashes, so they are more likely to cherry pick going forward. 1 1
rhysmcc Posted October 10, 2014 Posted October 10, 2014 It's disappointing they are choosing not to investigate the latest fatality and leaving it up to RA-AUS. 1
Guest Maj Millard Posted October 10, 2014 Posted October 10, 2014 ATSB are an investigative entity that chooses accidents to investigate on the basis of offerring an educational experience into the future for other users, or the opprotunity to learn something on a mechanical or technical level.
poteroo Posted October 11, 2014 Posted October 11, 2014 ATSB said about 12 months ago they want to investigate as many RA accidents as they can afford.Innocent members of the public have been going down for years, but sure, maybe that triggered it. When I was researching engine failure induced forced landings over a five year period, I couldn't help but note MANY runway excursions, a lot with either a full end over or upend on to a wing tip, and that could also have triggered interest. Or it could just be that budget is available to do the investigation; don't forget there's a monthly menu of incidents in the RAA magazine which draws the attention of a lot of people. Interesting. Would take money on 'wheelbarrowing' as a major cause of these excursions. Too much reliance on brakes - not enough on prior aerodynamic braking. happy days,
turboplanner Posted October 11, 2014 Posted October 11, 2014 I would too. In fact there were some instructors teaching "point and shoot" - point the nose down to descend rather than reduce power with the stick back.
motzartmerv Posted October 11, 2014 Posted October 11, 2014 Jeezz louise!!! Glad he didnt go for an "excursion" through the 5 blades of the turbo prop. 1
DonRamsay Posted October 11, 2014 Posted October 11, 2014 I wonder if seeing the big (relative to J230) Fokker might have distracted him at a critical moment? What's that Fokker doing there? Has that Fokker seen me or is he about to fokkin enter the runway and ruin my day? 1 2
ave8rr Posted October 11, 2014 Author Posted October 11, 2014 Broome airport is class D. J230 would of had an airways clearance.
Guest Maj Millard Posted October 11, 2014 Posted October 11, 2014 Broome airport is class D. J230 would of had an airways clearance. Class D when tower is in operation...........
ave8rr Posted October 11, 2014 Author Posted October 11, 2014 Class D when tower is in operation........... Would have been on watch for this flight Ross, incident happened at 11:52. Tower is manned 0700 to 1900 daily. Mike.
rhysmcc Posted October 11, 2014 Posted October 11, 2014 Would have been on watch for this flight Ross, incident happened at 11:52. Tower is manned 0700 to 1900 daily.Mike. Maybe it was closed for lunch :D
Cooda Posted October 14, 2014 Posted October 14, 2014 The pilot is the owner and very experienced in the aircraft. From what I've been told, he shifted his focus during the roll out towards a taxi-way entrance. On looking forward again, he found the Jabiru had unexpectedly veered to the left and he was now heading towards the drain. A boot full of right rudder and he ground-looped. The damage is being buffed out as we speak. 1
poteroo Posted October 14, 2014 Posted October 14, 2014 The pilot is the owner and very experienced in the aircraft.From what I've been told, he shifted his focus during the roll out towards a taxi-way entrance. On looking forward again, he found the Jabiru had unexpectedly veered to the left and he was now heading towards the drain. A boot full of right rudder and he ground-looped. The damage is being buffed out as we speak. Reads pretty much like the usual loss of directional control when the Jabby nosewheel makes early contact while the aircraft is rolling a tad fast. Just shows how easy it is to be distracted - probably by the traffic chatter and the ATC presence at even a Cat D airport. It's an added amount of 'pressure' when you know that there are many sets of critical eyes upon your landing performance. probably not as bad as at an airshow, but can 'get' to a pilot. happy days, 2
motzartmerv Posted October 14, 2014 Posted October 14, 2014 Ground looped a jab? Was this a tail wheel?
Cooda Posted October 14, 2014 Posted October 14, 2014 Nose wheel. Left wing and tail lifted from the way it's been described to me. Thanks for the explanation on the possible cause of the instability Poteroo. I've never felt comfortable with landing the J230's. Thought it was just my unco-ordinated size 12's.
motzartmerv Posted October 14, 2014 Posted October 14, 2014 You have to get him slow . Don't let it land till it's got no flying left . If you skateboard a 230 on you will be dancing like Fred estare!! At least keep the nose wheel up until The elevator runs out of puff.!! The nose wheel steering is direct and will get squirmy. 2
poteroo Posted October 14, 2014 Posted October 14, 2014 You have to get him slow . Don't let it land till it's got no flying left . If you skateboard a 230 on you will be dancing like Fred estare!!At least keep the nose wheel up until The elevator runs out of puff.!! The nose wheel steering is direct and will get squirmy. Agree with it all. Merv - forget Fred Astaire - it's Dancing With the Stars these days. Done right and you have the controls full back against the stops. Bit of power gives better elevator command and helps get the roundout taken through to a nose high attitude. happy days, 2 1
Cooda Posted October 15, 2014 Posted October 15, 2014 Trouble is, that's the way I land 'em. Stall warning sounding before the mains run on and stick hard back until the nose drops of its own accord. Still feels like skating on a frictionless surface - but it certainly keeps you focused throughout the landing roll.
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