Teckair Posted October 23, 2014 Posted October 23, 2014 It was reported on the news last night a trike caught fire during refueling at Hervey Bay airport and a person was in hospital with burns.
Guest Maj Millard Posted October 23, 2014 Posted October 23, 2014 Yes and I 'll bet it was an Airborne.......not the first refuelling accident with a trike. My theory is that the plastic tanks exposed to the slipstream in flight build up a high static charge and it is not disapated via grounding. Plastic in those tanks may not be static safe....
Teckair Posted October 24, 2014 Author Posted October 24, 2014 If that is the case that would be a real worry.
Guest Maj Millard Posted October 24, 2014 Posted October 24, 2014 Just a theory now , but if it is an Airborne it'll be the third I've heard of...static spark during refuelling ..
skeptic36 Posted October 24, 2014 Posted October 24, 2014 Thread on the subject here: http://www.recreationalflying.com/threads/fire-while-refueling.68617/
kaz3g Posted October 24, 2014 Posted October 24, 2014 http://www.careflight.org.au/page/news/Latest_News/2014/Man_suffers_serious_burns_while_refuelling_aircraft/ Appears either refuelling the aircraft from a plastic container, or filling a plastic container from a bowser...contradictory reports. Kaz
FlyingVizsla Posted October 24, 2014 Posted October 24, 2014 Was at Maryborough, not Hervey Bay Qld. Local story here http://www.frasercoastchronicle.com.au/news/man-burnt-while-refuelling-plane-maryborough-airpo/2429671/
Guest Maj Millard Posted October 24, 2014 Posted October 24, 2014 Was talking to a friend today who flys an Airborne trike...told me every time he lands he gets a noticeable zap through his body........seems the whole wing and trike can build up quiet a bit of static especially when dry and cold.
planet47 Posted October 24, 2014 Posted October 24, 2014 Would it be plausible that this could happen in any machine that has plastic tanks exposed to the slipstream/elements?
Guest Maj Millard Posted October 24, 2014 Posted October 24, 2014 Would it be plausible that this could happen in any machine that has plastic tanks exposed to the slipstream/elements? Yes I would imagine so..........
facthunter Posted October 24, 2014 Posted October 24, 2014 I often get that when getting out of any aircraft, so it's not just plastic tanks. When I think of it I don't have hold of the plane when my foot touches the ground. Nev
Teckair Posted October 24, 2014 Author Posted October 24, 2014 The news last night showed an XT 912 trike, a black plastic funnel and jerry can and the pilot was reported to be in a critical condition. They are now saying it happened at Maryborough.
facthunter Posted October 24, 2014 Posted October 24, 2014 That's very sad. There's a lot of energy in a bit of petrol. Getting burned is one of the worst things to happen. Nev 3
planet47 Posted October 25, 2014 Posted October 25, 2014 Is there a way to reduce the risk if you do have plastic tanks that are exposed
skeptic36 Posted October 25, 2014 Posted October 25, 2014 Is there a way to reduce the risk if you do have plastic tanks that are exposed Read the thread I linked to above, there is a lot of good info there. Here it is again: http://www.recreationalflying.com/threads/fire-while-refueling.68617/
Guest Maj Millard Posted October 25, 2014 Posted October 25, 2014 I've used Mr Funnels for over 30 years now (black ones) in combo with the red 20 Ltr fuel containers in two continents as have many many other pilots. I have never had a problem and about the only precaution I take is to make sure I ground the fuel containers (place them on the ground) before decanting from them. This is about the third fueling fire I am aware of ( there could be more) involving trikes. After chatting with a long- time trike flyer yesterday and having him tell me that every time he touches down he get a shock go through him tells me that these machines probabily build up a high positive static charge whilst flying especially if the air is cool and dry.....I really don't feel that the black Mr Funnels are at fault here as they anti - static........Maj.....
facthunter Posted October 25, 2014 Posted October 25, 2014 This is quite important and we need to investigate what factors are at play here. In flight fires are bad but getting seriously burned while refuelling is another situation. MFB's have investigated plastic tank safety with cars but the emphasis there was on structural integrity. Other aspects should fall under their area of expertise like static electricity build up. I've usually just earthed all parts but I find myself not really knowing much about plastic containers or tanks. Nev
eightyknots Posted October 25, 2014 Posted October 25, 2014 Yes and I 'll bet it was an Airborne.......not the first refuelling accident with a trike. My theory is that the plastic tanks exposed to the slipstream in flight build up a high static charge and it is not disapated via grounding. Plastic in those tanks may not be static safe.... There are quite a few aircraft with plastic tanks, e.g. X-Air Hanuman, Skyranger. How come these don't have the fire problems?
eightyknots Posted October 25, 2014 Posted October 25, 2014 Someone has devised a way of reducing or preventing static-induced fires in trikes. Go to page 9 of this article for an interesting possible solution: http://southernmicrolightclub.com.au/linked/smc news 2012-11.pdf
Guest Maj Millard Posted October 25, 2014 Posted October 25, 2014 There are quite a few aircraft with plastic tanks, e.g. X-Air Hanuman, Skyranger. How come these don't have the fire problems? Maybe they don't produce the same amount of static electricity as a trike wing travelling through the air.........,....
Guest Maj Millard Posted October 25, 2014 Posted October 25, 2014 Someone has devised a way of reducing or preventing static-induced fires in trikes.Go to page 9 of this article for an interesting possible solution: http://southernmicrolightclub.com.au/linked/smc news 2012-11.pdf Yes interesting article for sure........
Downunder Posted October 25, 2014 Posted October 25, 2014 Maybe the tanks need an anti-static strap? http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Auto-Anti-static-Earth-Strap-Red-Reflector-Ground-Belt-Black-41cm-Length-/151401247548?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item234037b33c 1
Guest Maj Millard Posted October 25, 2014 Posted October 25, 2014 Maybe the tanks need an anti-static strap?http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Auto-Anti-static-Earth-Strap-Red-Reflector-Ground-Belt-Black-41cm-Length-/151401247548?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item234037b33c Quite possibly....and the whole airframe a way to disapate static once on the ground (grounding wick by tire ?)........
Keenaviator Posted October 25, 2014 Posted October 25, 2014 Is it known whether or not proper earthing practices where carried out where these refuelling fires have happened?
facthunter Posted October 26, 2014 Posted October 26, 2014 If your tank isn't made of the right stuff, what would be a safe procedure?. Anyhow we are talking about it and that is a good thing. I think a bit of real research is needed on this matter. Probably our majority of refuelling is done from drums and it pays to put that through a filter too. Nev.
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