Additional cost of CASA imposed Jabiru Check-flight

[fennis]

Hello,

 

Is it just a fact of life that training has now gotten more expensive with the new CASA instrument? The chek-flight requirement means that instead of solo students finalizing their preparation for the test in the training area they now have an added (approx. $100) cost per week to get re-certified in the Jabirus? As far as I can see this check flight adds no value whatsoever and the time period between checks is way too short.

 

sinnef

 

 

[Gnarly Gnu]

Welcome Sinnef (sinner?). Can you explain what you mean by the regular Jabiru check flights requested by CASA? I'm a bit beyond the solo student stage (although in a sense we all still are students) so not aware of this requirement.

 

The CASA assault on Jabiru seems not too popular in the industry - except perhaps at the Rotax sales office (hmm, not sure how close this is to the CASA office). The correct response would be for the industry to put CASA on notice to lift their game & comply with all aspects of the Forsyth report within 3 months or be folded.

 

 

[turboplanner]

The so-called Forsyth report has come and gone, which is no surprise considering that virtually all of the submissions were simple assertions rather than hard evidence which could be worked on. Simply saying the people at CASA are bastards, doesn't give the government of the day any chance of taking action.

 

 

[aro]

Welcome Sinnef (sinner?). Can you explain what you mean by the regular Jabiru check flights requested by CASA?

5 The CFI of a flying school must not permit a student pilot of the school to undertake a solo flight in a Jabiru-powered aircraft unless the CFI has:

 

(b) before subsequent solo flights by the student pilot at a flying school:

 

(i) confirmed that the student pilot has competently performed engine failure exercises at the school in either the preceding 2 hours of flight time or 7 days, whichever is the more recent

 

(ii) noted the competence in subparagraph (i) in the student pilot’s record, countersigned by the student.

 

5(b)(ii) is obviously designed to make compliance easily auditable even if there are no incidents - I am waiting for CASA to announce that they are conducting (or having RAA conduct) an audit, with the aim of shutting down schools that are not complying with this requirement.

 

 

[Guest Andys@coffs]

Been a while since I went through the school....who holds the log book? Student or school? If the former (as I think I recall...but it was a HGFA school at the time) then auditing is likely much more difficult..... I have a feeling I should look in the Ops manual where perhaps that answer will lie...but as I am not, nor am I ever likely to be a FI I haven't bothered....

 

Andy

 

 

[aro]

The student has a log book, but the school will be required to keep their own records as well. I would expect these to be more detailed than what is in the logbook - information about strengths/weaknesses, whether sequences have been completed satisfactorily etc.

 

I think one of the criticisms out of the ferris wheel crash was about the adequacy of the particular school's student records.

 

 

[Camel]

The student has a log book, but the school will be required to keep their own records as well. I would expect these to be more detailed than what is in the logbook - information about strengths/weaknesses, whether sequences have been completed satisfactorily etc.I think one of the criticisms out of the ferris wheel crash was about the adequacy of the particular school's student records.

You should not quote what you don't know about as you are wrong, the person you are referring to was a converting GA pilot not a student pilot so don't start making a comparison ! The point is here that the student must not go solo without recent engine failure practice .

 

The most serious issue I believe is CASA are not acting in a way that good results are a likely outcome as they have proved to be wreckers not fixers !

 

 

[facthunter]

Recent engine failure practice doesn't guarantee you will do the right thing when the fan actually stops. People who haven't experienced a geniune emergency are in the dark as to what they will actually do. WE all like to think we will be cool and do it perfectly, but if there is an industrial estate or dense housing off the end of the strip, it's likely to be a few bruises and dollars involved even if you do everything totally correctly.

 

I think the main reason for requirement this is to have done SOMETHING. ANY aircraft can have an engine failure at take off, ( and it may not be the fault of the engine itself) so IF a different make has one why wouldn't the lawyers ask CASA why the training wasn't needed for it. AS I see it the figures only make the BEST 50% better than the one we seem to regard as the worst.. Nev

 

 

[DonRamsay]

. . . Simply saying the people at CASA are bastards, doesn't give the government of the day any chance of taking action.

Provides a good reason to try out a new Director of Aviation Safety and Head of Avmed.

Also, puts them on notice to change their ways or . . . we'll do another study and report :-(

 

 

[facthunter]

I am optimistic they will be better, ( as they would be pushing to be worse from our point of view) Nev

 

 

[turboplanner]

we'll do another study and report :-(

Will we?

 

David Forsyth handed over his report last June and it dropped like a rock.

 

The laugh was on the people who took part in the "blowing off steam exercise"

 

I'm more in favour of a Senate Committee having scouted out a couple the week before last, the benefits being:

 

• The agenda is a little wider than the Minister's comfort zone
   
   
  
• The Senate has the power to summons people before it and compel them to give sworn evidence
   
   
  
• A Senate Committee has members from both the major parties
   
   
  

 

 

 

 

[facthunter]

How would you get them interested? we eventually need the legislation spelling out the function(s) of CASA, changed if we are going to get anywhere. Nev

 

 

[turboplanner]

I haven't worked that out yet.

 

A Committee needs to uncover hard evidence before making their recommendation, and while some of the Senators are very astute, I think the subject matter needs to be narrow, like an executive summary, which will then lead to a wider number of people with detailed knowledge being able to participate.

 

 

[facthunter]

The issue is, will we have a vital GA sector to train OUR and overseas pilots as we once did, into the future and will the CASA act to assist their ability to function by facilitating the industry more than just saying what it can't do. (and not even getting that very easy to understand). Don't use my words though, but you get what I mean.. Nev

 

 

[turboplanner]

The base policy needs to be turned on its head to make the industry thrive, yes.

 

 

[Kununurra]

As soon as I heR the word committee I think hmmm that will take a while to get a decision

 

 

[turboplanner]

Do a bit of research on Senate Committees and how they work K.

 

Usually it's about six people grilling someone way beyond where he wanted to go.

 

 

[Kununurra]

Hi TP why would I do the research when I can rely on you?

 

 

[turboplanner]

Fair enough , well the other job you can do is get at least 2,500 to vote at the next election because I'm not getting excited until that happens.

 

 

[Kununurra]

Fair enough , well the other job you can do is get at least 2,500 to vote at the next election because I'm not getting excited until that happens.

Now that's a hard one I think the research would have been much easier ha ha

Cheers TP

 

 

[turboplanner]

I agree.