joy flights

[rhtrudder]

Just wondering if there is a legal way to perform paying joy flights in a 24 reg ul

 

 

[rankamateur]

Are you an instructor? If so then call them trial introductory flights over interesting terrain.

 

 

[kasper]

Are you an instructor? If so then call them trial introductory flights over interesting terrain.

LOL - indeed.

 

 

[Akromaster]

Does it not depend on whether you're earning an income? For instance, if your passenger only pays the cost of fuel...

 

 

[rhtrudder]

Seen it done at Mt Beauty with trikes and tourists lining up to have a go , so would they were being done under the banner of TIFs. Got a son keen to follow his training through and thought it may be a way to help with cash flow. Lots of tourists in our area.

 

 

[facthunter]

Referring to the ORIGINAL question and the word "legal" you can't do paying joy flights. RAAus was never intended for that kind of thing. If you want that activity then do it properly with a COMMERCIAL and a GA plane. properly serviced and licenced. You won't be covered by insurance to start with . Carrying even non paying passengers in RAAus planes is fraught with hazards if you want to keep your house.. Nev

 

 

[rhtrudder]

I understand the need for a COMMERCIAL licence, the plane would be 24 reg and looked after by a LAME and the pilot would have a instructor rating. How do paragliders and hanggliders manage it or do they follow different rules

 

 

[Happyflyer]

I understand the need for a COMMERCIAL licence, the plane would be 24 reg and looked after by a LAME and the pilot would have a instructor rating. How do paragliders and hanggliders manage it or do they follow different rules

The commercial licence doesn't matter. The only way you can charge for flying in an RAAus registered plane is for flying training. The TIF is sometimes misused as a way of charging for a scenic flight. The pilot in all cases must have an RAAus instructor rating on his RAAus licence and it must be in a factory built RAAus aircraft.

 

 

[Mriya]

Just wondering if there is a legal way to perform paying joy flights in a 24 reg ul

Summing up your question and the answers you have got so far: There is no legal way to do joyflights (or any other form of commercial work except flight training) in a 24 reg UL.

 

Plenty of people try to get around this rule by offering 'scenic TIFs', however I suspect this practice would quickly become a legal and/or financial nightmare when an accident occurs and insurers start examining the circumstances.

 

The ONLY LEGAL way to fly a 24 registered UL and be paid commercially is as an instructor in a flying school.

 

Cost sharing between private parties is the limit of any other exchange of money that may occur between people who fly together privately.

 

 

[Downunder]

And the GA schools/operators that are authorised to do this, won't be shy in bringing you down if they get wind you are doing it on the sly....

 

 

[cscotthendry]

The direct answer to your question is NO. There is no way to do paying joy flights in ANY RAA registered plane. Anything else is dodgy. Don't do it because you'll bring bureaucratic retribution down on the heads of all the rest of us.

 

 

[facthunter]

Like we have had for several years already. An instructor in RAAus has a PPL medical (class 2) and doesn't have to have a commercial licence. In fact the RAAus system is based on a Pilot Certificate, and we are supposed to have less strict rules for reduced privileges, one of which is not being commercial beyond the necessary training required..Nev

 

 

[SDQDI]

Don't know what all the fuss is about, of course we can do paying joy flights in RAA. BUT the pilot has to be the one to pay:cheers:.

 

If you want a pax to be paying more than cost you will have to be in a VH reg unless of course you are instructing.

 

I agree with Scott trying to do it through RAA won't win you any friends among your fellow RAA pilots as at the end of the day we are the ones to cop the extra regs caused by dodgy ops.

 

I enjoy giving joy flights to people but I only do it for fun ((no money) after all it obviously gives me an excuse to go flying) after all that's what RAA is all about.

 

 

[rhtrudder]

Thanks for all the replies and I sort as figured as much , never intended to do anything illegal, and I fully understand the ramifications thought I would just ask the question , still unsure how the trikes , paragliders and hanggliders at Porepunkah manage it, surely they aren't flying pas as TIFs , I know someone who took a flight in a paraglider recently and paid to do it.

 

 

[facthunter]

Yes they have done that for years and it's openly advertised. (at Porepunka) I knew a CASA FOI who inspected one of the organisations on that field and would have well aware of the way they operated It might have been under a GA overlay like an AOC. We are going back a few years now. Nev

 

 

[turboplanner]

Another key factor, which cleans sections of the industry up from time to time, is that when someone has paid, and is badly injured, or killed, he/she or the estate are quick to sue for very large amounts of money. I posted about a manslaughter charge against a woman who reversed the charter boat over a swimmer, and she had all the legal permits - operating illegally, you are in a far worse situation.

 

 

[kaz3g]

Another key factor, which cleans sections of the industry up from time to time, is that when someone has paid, and is badly injured, or killed, he/she or the estate are quick to sue for very large amounts of money. I posted about a manslaughter charge against a woman who reversed the charter boat over a swimmer, and she had all the legal permits - operating illegally, you are in a far worse situation.

I understand that the charges were withdrawn.

 

I worked for the Maritime Heritage Unit of Heritage Victoria back in the mid-90s and our job was to survey and protect historic shipwrecks. We dived all around the coast of Victoria but spent a particularly large amount of our time around Port Phillip Heads. I actually spent a few hours at the helm of Moonraker while we worked a reef just inside the heads adjacent Point Lonsdale with the then owner.

 

Kaz

 

 

[turboplanner]

I hadn't heard;it's one thing to be charged, another to be convicted

 

 

[facthunter]

In Japan it is close to the same thing. Nev

 

 

[Chocolate]

Have a look at casa website for NPRM scenic flights. Commercial pilot licence required etcetc

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Thanks for all the replies and I sort as figured as much , never intended to do anything illegal, and I fully understand the ramifications thought I would just ask the question , still unsure how the trikes , paragliders and hanggliders at Porepunkah manage it, surely they aren't flying pas as TIFs , I know someone who took a flight in a paraglider recently and paid to do it.

Its not illegal as long as the passenger is aware they are doing a "training" flight. There is no definition of what being aware is.