EFI done easy

[jetjr]

could be, I was considering 18lph a best case, even 20+ is a good result

 

I have no AFR data with carb but know from many hours changing jets in Bing, that you end up overfueling (badly) to control one cylinder in one phase of operation

 

For example my 3300 runs 29lph (2900rpm) and in cruise No 2 is ~ 700 deg C while No. 5 is 580 deg C. Have tried almost every thing to sort this out.

 

In descent, with load off, it all changes around and a different cylinder wants to run over 750. This no doubt linked to needle shoulder position but still real.

 

Incidentally this is only just above Jabiru expected FF numbers

 

Soooo you end up loading up fuel to keep No 2 under control in cruise, and avoid certain rpm in descent

 

Interestingly this trend in my air frame seems linked to airbox as it was similar with previous engine

 

How do you think would EFI handle this problem?

 

Is airflow being varied to cause this symptoms or simply fuel distribution in current carb setup?

 

I have to say I thought the RSA install was great, but was hoping for smaller EGT spread.

 

 

[Guest rv6ejguy]

We see the EGT spreads on many carbed engines even out a lot with the EFI. Since there is only dry air in the manifold, fuel does not have to turn different corners any more. Similar deal on Lycomings which can have a 100C spread in EGTs as well. Most Jab users report all that all their funky EGT and mixture distribution problems go away with the EFI. Speed up, FF down, smoother running.

 

 

[Guest rv6ejguy]

We've got most of the CNC'd parts available now for our aircraft ignition systems Rotax, Jabiru and Lycoming fours: http://sdsefi.com/cpi.htm The CPI is now being shipped.

 

In a couple more weeks, we should have all the parts available for the EFI/ EI kits for the Jab 3300 and Lycoming 320/360s.

 

 

[AVOCET]

The Avocet runs well with the SDS efi .those figures and fuel savings are correct ,

 

There is a HUGE difference in the fuel economy and power increase and smooth running EGT spread within 50deg .

 

Compared to carby ? Heaps better .

 

Im going to order the ignition module from SDS , as soon as ive replaced the clutch , gearbox & tranfer box on the Discovery !!! Cars , who needs em !!?

 

Mike .

 

 

[jetjr]

Isnt the ognotion module oncorperatd on the efi unit?

 

Maybe pnly 5F model?

 

 

[Guest rv6ejguy]

Mike, thanks for the info here. The EM-5 systems have full fuel and spark capability. If you have a fuel only D system, it could be reflashed and have some wiring and components added to run the ignition as well. Alternately, you could use the CPI to do the spark control.

 

 

[SDQDI]

Isnt the ognotion module oncorperatd on the efi unit?Maybe pnly 5F model?

Jet c'mon, poor dazza is busy enough as it is:amazon:

 

 

[jetjr]

O k s o r r y

 

W i l l t y p e s l o w e r f o r t h e q u e e n s l a n d e r s

 

Thanks Ross, thats what I thought

 

 

[AVOCET]

Mike, thanks for the info here. The EM-5 systems have full fuel and spark capability. If you have a fuel only D system, it could be reflashed and have some wiring and components added to run the ignition as well. Alternately, you could use the CPI to do the spark control.

I guess that means posting the computer back to you to be reflashed ??

I tried a couple weeks ago to buy the ign. Mod . off the SDS site , but our lousy internet sevice is ....... Well???

 

Since then ive had car $ issues , but might be a good time to send the unit back to SDS this winter , be ready for christmas .!

 

Mike .

 

 

[Guest rv6ejguy]

We can do the mods any time you're ready. Have to decide which coils you want to run. That part is the big expense compared with the other parts required to make the change to full ignition and fuel control. We may be able to save weight and money with the CPI six cylinder coil pack setup over the typical 6F stuff. Just working out the final details on that now. Email me if you have any questions.

 

 

[Guest rv6ejguy]

Just updating some new developments on the EFI/EI front. We'll be introducing V26 software for the EM-5 ECUs by week end. Notable changes for direct drive engines will be 100 rpm programming increments instead of 250 and in-flight adjustable individual cylinder fuel trim for 4 cylinder engines.

 

We have a new 45mm throttle body for Jabiru, Rotax and Continental O-200 engines.

 

We also have many new CNC'd parts coming out in the next 2 weeks for Lycoming 320/360/540 engines with some more Rotax parts to follow those.

 

The CPI ignition systems are now flying on 360 and 540 Lycoming engines and these have been updated to 100 rpm programming increments on DD engines as well, also have a switch to add advance to the programmed timing curves for more efficient LOP operation or for switching between mogas and 100LL and a MAP calibration window to synch the LCD readout with cockpit instrumentation.

 

 

[jetjr]

Sounds good, thanks for the update

 

Good upgrades, future plans for individual fuel trim for 6cyl?

 

Afraid our currency is slipping badly making $USD purchases a bit painful

 

 

[Downunder]

Yes, good to hear from you. Great to see companies innovating in Aviation which seems to be a battle at times.

 

Other industries move forward in leaps and bounds but aviation gets pulled along screaming and crying.......

 

I'm interested in Rotax 912 fuel injection using the original manifolds (weld-in injectors) but retaining the carbs to potentially have the option of swapping back to them.

 

Ideally doable inflight....

 

 

[Kyle Communications]

I looked at the webpages..it all looks really nice and I would love to put it on my 912 but it would be a very expensive refit by the look of it. The fuel pumps alone are about 1000 bucks aussie let alone the other stuff

 

 

[Downunder]

Yeah, the cheapest way as I see it is to weld the injectors into the existing manifold but retain carbs, at least as throttle bodies.

 

But would be good to be usable too.

 

On another thought, selling carbs, fuel pump etc would re-coup quite a bit (couple of grand?) ...... second hand Rotax parts not particularly cheap.

 

The price of new parts make it so.....

 

 

[Guest rv6ejguy]

I think we'll eventually do a 6 cylinder ECU with fuel trim but have a lot on the go at the moment. Yes, the USD exchange rate hurts most people buying from outside the US. Our dollar is way down these days too. Helps us when we exchange US dollars, hurts us when we buy components from the US which is where a majority of the parts come from. For sure this stuff isn't cheap to produce in small quantities. Customers are mainly folks who've had enough of fiddling with carbs and want better fuel economy and a bit more power.

 

One of our main 912 customers uses the stock manifolds and welds bosses on them, then uses modified, discarded 912S airboxes as the plenum with a single TB. Works well. We'll be producing a longitudinal plenum design shortly and probably a transverse one after that to hopefully suit most airframes.

 

You'll see some new photos of the trim screens up on the Aircraft Page shortly.

 

 

[Guest rv6ejguy]

V26 software is now flying in the US on a Lycoming RV. Initial testing found one cylinder was trimmed +2% and another -9% to even the EGTs.

 

 

[jetjr]

Sounds good

 

I can see some of the less polished engines benefiting greatly from this

 

6 cyl Jabiru particularly

 

 

[Guest rv6ejguy]

We have some demand in the US market to develop a 6 cylinder system for 540 Lycomings which could be applied to the 3300 Jabiru but not sure if we can meet the price point for the latter. Jab folks seem to have limited interest in EFI though to date. Would this change if they could even up the EGT spread?

 

 

[Gnarly Gnu]

One of our main 912 customers uses the stock manifolds and welds bosses on them, then uses modified, discarded 912S airboxes...

Is this viable compared to simply using the iS injected version which has all this sorted out?

 

 

[jetjr]

I think it would and be a great product. Trim is a big selling point.

 

EGT spread is what its all about for knowing Jab owners.

 

Current installations ive seen data from, whilst great dont fully sort out egt spread and there are a few carb models performing similarly.

 

Honestly it is a factor for me, not buying sooner as for a carb setup mine is pretty good. Spending that type of $$ and still seeing egt spread would be frustrating.

 

You have a good product no doubt, but as im sure youre aware a few issues working against it in AU currently

 

Firstly Jabiru owners have taken a real kicking from regulator. Brand is quite damaged and value of assets dropped.

 

Whilst Jabiru are very popular, majority of newer ones are under LSA rules and cant have changes done without factory approval. Your market is homebuilt versions which is limiting. Rumour is this might change.

 

$US, slipped around 30% in last year or two

 

Jabiru have been fighting their own battles last few years and defnsive about anything not developed in house.

 

There is a significant window for you with Camit Aero Engines, they are cementing a place with a more solid product and making headway.

 

They are facing the same issues and market limitations.

 

No doubt tight on funds but open to development ideas. Added advantage he can turn up almost anything to suit engines easier than anyone else so a kit could be fast tracked

 

They will have engines going through basic certification at some stage soon, to have an efi upgrade kit would sell well I think.

 

I do think a turn key kit would be beneficial, many still see difficulty on install

 

 

[Downunder]

Yes, it would be great for camit to become an "Agent" and supply this injected system as an option on their engines.

 

Local support, knowledge and parts backup.....but would owners pay for it? Would there be a market?

 

 

[Kyle Communications]

rv6ejguy

 

I have stock 912ULS what would it cost to fit it out with one of your systems?...not including freight to australia. I mean everything I would need to do the conversion electronics and hardware?

 

 

[Kyle Communications]

Camit could also make all your cnc parts too at a far better rate than you are getting them made now especially with the exchange rate

 

 

[jetjr]

I think they would pay especially if it came from camit or at least with their approval

 

Even as an add on, the numbers on fuel savings alone pay off pretty quick

 

Cost would need to be kept down, current kit will cost $5-6k plus all the extra bits

 

Maybe a more basic kit using carb as throttle body, single pump and plumbing more like earlier versions.

 

Someone in QLD has fitted one to Camit recently i think