BoxFat Posted June 9, 2015 Posted June 9, 2015 Late coming into the thread sorry. I own a Foxbat A22LS and have 75 hours on it now. I think most if not all of your technical/logistics questions have been answered SrPilot so I will just opine three things: 1. You have to see and fly one. I bought mine after a close look convinced me the build was super professional and the thinking gone into the design (not always obvious at first) - ditto 2. Agent support is critical to enjoying the experience with any imported aeroplane. I am lucky in that we have an excellent Australian agent/importer here in Peter Harlow (SilverWings in this forum) and also the local WA (Western Australia is a long way from the rest of Australia !) flying school and agent at White Gum Farm (Gordon Marshall). Both have been super supportive. 3. If you really can't find one to fly and are seriously thinking of spending the $$$ come out here for a holiday in sunny Perth (think "San Diego with kangaroos") and I will happily let you try mine. It's great fun. Finally, with few exceptions any owner will sing the praises of their current steed but more objective observers in this forum do generally speak favourably of the FB. The useful load is one key thing in my opinion..it enables a lot of stuff. Cheers BF 1 1
Guest SrPilot Posted June 9, 2015 Posted June 9, 2015 Late coming into the thread sorry. I own a Foxbat A22LS and have 75 hours on it now. . . . I will just opine three things: Thanks BF for the response. I am pleased to hear from an owner, particularly one who took a close look before buying (which is what I keep trying to do). The Perth invitation is a great opportunity but I have no "miles" on Quantas, and I doubt that Delta does Perth. Besides, my wife liked Australia after an earlier visit so each time I'm headed that way, she wants to tag along. Ergo, 2 tickets. (We have not been to WA . . . yet, so one of these days I might visit White Gum Farm, meet you, and see your Foxbat. In the States, it seems easier to buy 3 or 4 other light sport airplanes and I have looked at 2 of them, but I keep on track checking out the 22LS. The problems aren't insurmountable, although if I were in Alice Springs I would have less of a challenge in getting one, methinks. Keep 'er flying BF. And thanks again.
BoxFat Posted June 9, 2015 Posted June 9, 2015 Thanks BF for the response. I am pleased to hear from an owner, particularly one who took a close look before buying (which is what I keep trying to do). The Perth invitation is a great opportunity but I have no "miles" on Quantas, and I doubt that Delta does Perth. Besides, my wife liked Australia after an earlier visit so each time I'm headed that way, she wants to tag along. Ergo, 2 tickets. (We have not been to WA . . . yet, so one of these days I might visit White Gum Farm, meet you, and see your Foxbat. In the States, it seems easier to buy 3 or 4 other light sport airplanes and I have looked at 2 of them, but I keep on track checking out the 22LS. The problems aren't insurmountable, although if I were in Alice Springs I would have less of a challenge in getting one, methinks. Keep 'er flying BF. And thanks again. Delta is code share with Virgin who do Perth several times a day through Sydney and Brisbane. It IS an awful long way, however, I am back and forward from the US for work. Most recently took the opportunity to attend Sun n Fun in Orlando, which was excellent. Talked with Yuri, the Foxbat designer there - seems like they have never had a particularly effective distribution/marketing network in the US, not sure why. Surprisingly, Jabiru has done better in this respect, possibly assisted by periods of low A$ to US$ exchange rate, as now. My FB is based at Bindoon by the way rather than WGF, about 30 mins flying between the two. What are the others you are looking at ? 1 1
BoxFat Posted June 10, 2015 Posted June 10, 2015 This has just come out today... http://foxbatpilot.com/2015/06/10/new-aeroprakt-a32-announced/ 2 1
mAgNeToDrOp Posted June 10, 2015 Posted June 10, 2015 looks slick, 110-115 knots would be handy indeed. Hopefully the useful load will also be similar to the A22LS
Bennyboy320 Posted June 10, 2015 Posted June 10, 2015 All the specs are on the Foxbat web site, weights the same only real difference is 90ltrs of fuel, but then you do have a 25% speed increase for probably the same fuel burn, interesting to see the price, agree attractive looking a/c.
Geoff13 Posted June 10, 2015 Posted June 10, 2015 One would hope that their quoted speeds for cruise are more realistic then those quoted for the A22LS. I am a huge fan of the Foxbat, but I wish these people would try and get some truth in advertising. The figures that they quote for the A22LS cruise speeds are not only unrealistic but not achievable in any of the 3 that I have flown in. The ones I have flown will cruise comfortably between 80 -85 knots, depending on prop settings. Nowhere near the 100 knots plus quoted on the website. Applying that same reduction to the A32 gets a maximum cruise somewhere around the 100 knots unless I am somehow mistaken. Don't get me wrong, I still can't wait to fly one. 1 1
skeptic36 Posted June 10, 2015 Posted June 10, 2015 The Aeroprakt website has the POH for the A22LS quotes 104 mph which equates to a touch over 90 knots...
Guest SrPilot Posted June 10, 2015 Posted June 10, 2015 It IS an awful long way, however, I am back and forward from the US for work. Most recently took the opportunity to attend Sun n Fun in Orlando . . . . seems like they have never had a particularly effective distribution/marketing network in the US, not sure why. . . . My FB is based at Bindoon by the way rather than WGF, about 30 mins flying between the two. . . . What are the others you are looking at ? Thanks Bobfat. Last time I came to Canberra, I decided it wasn't that far just to keep going so I ended up with a round-the-world journey, all Delta Code. The US distribution lags behind Australia's for sure. Just count the airplanes in country and factor in the relative sizes. The US should have many more than they have. It may be the size of the operation in the US, or the amount of competition, or the desires of the potential customers. If one is flying over a station looking for sheep or camels, he or she may not be in such a hurry. But many sport pilots in the states want one or more of the following: speed, useful load, ramp appeal, taildragger, kit built (experimental), etc. And the Foxbat sometimes simply loses out to another light sport (even a more costly one) or to an older Cessna or Piper that will meet light sport or to an experimental. I have been considering a Savage (Zlin) (formerly a Savage Cub, now a Nomad, I think - name change due to the name belonging to someone else). I looked at the composite planes but most of them are way more costly and are built more for speed which is not my main concern. There is one composite with a couple of used aircraft available that interest me at least to some extent. I looked at the Bushcat, but I didn't research it much after stumbling over the Foxbat which seemed more like what I wanted. So I may be down to a Foxbat (if I ever can get one), a used Savage "Cub", or a Foxbat A-32 (as soon as I can find out about that one. At present, the US distributor is in Europe returning from a business trip and will not be back in the US for at least a week. Ergo, I am in limbo on that end but may use the time to look at a Savage Cub that's on the market to see if it would fit into my "downsizing" to a simpler life from the faster, heavier, and/or more complex stuff I've had over the last few decades. To date, I've captured one fuzzy picture and one decent but not very revealing photo of the A32, if that's what it is. I know nothing about it other than what I have seen over the past 48 hours or so. Anyone have more?
Downunder Posted June 10, 2015 Posted June 10, 2015 I recon they would have made a killing with simply putting "cruise" wings on the standard fuse. As the stall would be higher the large rudder and elevator could be reduced in size also, improving performance again. Pretty simple and opening up the market for airport to airport travellers that want 110-120kts cruise.
BoxFat Posted June 10, 2015 Posted June 10, 2015 Well we will see...I hope to have a look in a few weeks time and compare the A32 directly with my A22LS. If it is a significant upgrade my wallet-hand will be itching and then I will be looking for someone wanting a 75 hour, always hangared etc etc A22LS.....
Guest SrPilot Posted June 22, 2015 Posted June 22, 2015 Well we will see...I hope to have a look in a few weeks time and compare the A32 directly with my A22LS. If it is a significant upgrade my wallet-hand will be itching and then I will be looking for someone wanting a 75 hour, always hangared etc etc A22LS..... I will be interested in the delivery date in Australia for a customer-ordered A32. In the U.S., the expected arrival of an A32 based on current information would be far (too far) in the future. Perhaps I will see one at OSH 2016. Maybe if I were quite a few years younger . . . . Meanwhile, I am speaking with the U.S. factory contract about the possible delivery time on an A22LS based on a cash purchase. I finally sat in, and flew, my first A22LS this morning at my home airport. (see my post about this local interest-grabbing event in another posting in the forum). The A32 - for me at least - is in a galaxy a long time in the future, far, far away. Maybe in Australia, but I am not in Australia. Oh well, I never owned (and never will own) a P-51 Mustang, a Corsair, or a P-38 either.
facthunter Posted June 22, 2015 Posted June 22, 2015 I had a chance to go halves in one, P-51 with 4 hours TT from new. for a very low price a fair while ago now. Not really sorry I didn't procede. It's an easy way to end up with a small fortune as long as you start with a very large one.
Guest SrPilot Posted June 22, 2015 Posted June 22, 2015 I had a chance to go halves in one, P-51 with 4 hours TT from new. for a very low price a fair while ago now. Not really sorry I didn't procede. It's an easy way to end up with a small fortune as long as you start with a very large one. Ah, facthunter, but I have to quibble a bit with your math. Starting with a large fortune (and that is what it would take to buy a P-51 anytime after about 1955), you probably would end up with an even larger fortune (because those puppies keep climbing in price). On the other hand, had you bought a restaurant instead of a P-51, you'd probably be penniless and hungry. I decided long ago that one's money was better invested in things like scarce airplanes that are either historically famous or very, very handsome; automobiles of the same nature (but only if they are very old or are about 30 years old so that those who craved after them during their teen years now have the children out of the home and have earned enough money to buy the car they always wanted); horses that will - not can, will - win the Triple Crown, gold, oil, or American professional sports teams (football, baseball, or basketball - Australian League, Cricket, Hockey, and Beach Volleyball do not bring big returns on investments). Me? I invested in Croquet. Didn't do so well there either. Get a real, honest to goodness warbird - say on of the 3 I mentioned in the earlier post, . . . or better yet, one of each to go along with the Foxbat in your hangar.
facthunter Posted June 22, 2015 Posted June 22, 2015 I know it would have become very valuable stored and inhibited. I am also and have been over time involved with people who fly them still and you really need some considerable resources to keep them operating safely. They are not all reliable designs new and unless you know your stuff and spend it's not real safe to be over cities on one donk that is long out if production, and a safe glide speed over 100 knots. Don't get me wrong, I would fly any old primitive thing but pick the aerodrome and surrounds to do it. By the way How is Harrison Ford getting on after the Ryan incident?. I get my substitute from older bikes. If you do all the work yourself, it isn't expensive. Nev
Guest SrPilot Posted June 22, 2015 Posted June 22, 2015 y the way How is Harrison Ford getting on after the Ryan incident?. I understand the concerns about flying older stuff although none of the planes I own or have owned were flying when I was born. I did own and fly a Cessna 120 that was only some few years younger. Haven't seen Harrison of late, but I'll tell him you were inquiring. (Actually, things have been a mite quiet post-incident. I think they are keeping things under wraps.).
fly_tornado Posted June 22, 2015 Posted June 22, 2015 last i heard, he was flying his bell helo last week 1
Guest SrPilot Posted June 22, 2015 Posted June 22, 2015 last i heard, he was flying his bell helo last week Thanks ft. See. I get all my news out of the Great Downunder. It's easier, faster and cheaper. Really. I flew an A22LS today thanks to the info received from a couple of you guys that put me into contact with someone just an hour and a half away from my home field. 200+ TV channels, high speed internet, gobs of the latest gadgets, and I get more info from you fellows than I get from all of my "stuff." Go figure. But, hey, it works for me!
BoxFat Posted June 22, 2015 Posted June 22, 2015 Did you post your thoughts having now flown an A22LS somewhere SP? Would be interested how you found it. If I do get into an A32 in a few weeks I will write up the comparison here. Cheers BF
Guest SrPilot Posted June 22, 2015 Posted June 22, 2015 Did you post your thoughts having now flown an A22LS somewhere SP? Would be interested how you found it. If I do get into an A32 in a few weeks I will write up the comparison here. Cheers. BF I flew an A22LS yesterday at my home airport. The owner of the plane I flew is an Aeroprakt rep for the U.S. He was on a journey and deviated so I could fly his airplane. We had a nice chat and I got my chance to fly his plane. I posted a note about the flight yesterday in the Foxbat forum on the site. I will look forward to your observations about the A32. I cannot tell Foxbat pilots much about A22LSs. You already know about them. All I can give is my impressions of the airplane as one who until yesterday had never even sat in one. On the other hand, you can tell us about an airplane that none of us have flown, and few if any have even seen. But I am told that the first A32 to reach our shores probably isn't even scheduled to be built at this point in time. I have the impression that it will be at least 2016 before they are available to us. If one shows up at OSH 2015, I'll be surprised. Let us hear about your A32 experience - even if it's only walking around the puppy for a look.
BoxFat Posted June 22, 2015 Posted June 22, 2015 Whoops missed that sorry - will go and have a look. Glad you finally got to have a go. It certainly would have felt odd coming out of the Nanchang !
Guest SrPilot Posted June 24, 2015 Posted June 24, 2015 Whoops missed that sorry - will go and have a look. Glad you finally got to have a go. It certainly would have felt odd coming out of the Nanchang ! Well, BF, it was a bit different. As much visibility 360 as a CJ6, but more looking down and out the door. Oh, and doors, not a sliding canopy. Side-by-side, not tandem seating, and yokes, not sticks, but with hand brake as is the case with the CJ. Wings on top, not something to climb up on to enter the cockpit; no seat-pack chutes or helmets. No manual rotating of a huge 3-bladed prop against a high compression radial engine to move oil from the cylinders to eliminate the chance of a bent rod. No big bang from sending compressed air into the pneumatic starter and no smoke on engine start. No oil drips. Instant start, and the quietest engine on the airport (so said everyone). I think the on-lookers fell asleep during the start; CJ engine starts usually send on-lookers running for cover. (You gotta get some entertainment out of that big smoke and oil belching radial monster under the cowling.) Smooth running engine, quick acceleration, short takeoff, respectable climb. Bit lighter in the wind and more responsive to thermals. Did I mention great visibility? Cruise just over CJ pattern speed; pattern speed probably just below CJ full-flap stall speed. Slip is a no-brainer; final is perhaps slower than CJ taxi speed. Touchdown was a swish, not a squeak but the CJ has trailing link gear and if you're really, really decent on landing, it too will make you look good. Fuel burn on the whole flight probably equal to the CJ fuel burn for engine warmup, taxi for takeoff, and initial climb to pattern altitude. Other than those minor differences, they are very similar. Both are called airplanes, both have tail-numbers (registration numbers), and both draw crowds of admirers (or maybe that was just me).
dazza 38 Posted October 24, 2015 Posted October 24, 2015 I just finished reading the A32 Vixen flight review in the latest edition of the Australian Flying magazine. Sounds like it is a great LSA. 1
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