ave8rr Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 From the ABC News http://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2015-05-23/pilot-dies-in-hunter-valley-plane-crash/6492220 1
Teckair Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 Are you home already? This is terrible news. Richard. 1 1
ave8rr Posted May 23, 2015 Author Posted May 23, 2015 Are you home already? This is terrible news.Richard. Yes Richard. Heard it reported on the way home. Condolences to the family. Mike
farri Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 Yes! It is terrible news, always has been and always will be. My deepest sympathy to all concerned, especially family. Frank.
Guest asmol Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 One of the news story's say it was the pilots first flight in this plane.
Roundsounds Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/pilot-dies-in-light-plane-crash-in-hunter-valley-20150523-gh81qw.html
Guest Andys@coffs Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 Condolences to the family involved and the aviators of Cessnock who presumably were acquaintances of the pilot. What follows is general in nature and does not apply only to this incident. To those other members of RAAus it is more clear than ever over the last few months that accidents and fatalities related to flying Recreational aircraft don't just happen to others, they happen to us! The death toll of late is terrible and sure to invite closer scrutiny by the regulator and the coroners involved, when ever that happens additional "requirements" are laid on us to try and address at a whole of organisation level those things that we are individually responsible for , but are perceived to not be doing. Please, be mindful that aviation has no tolerance for mistakes and oversights, and each of these that you might get away with, puts you closer to the one that will kill you! We as a group must do better and determine how we can proactively try and address this, or others will do it for us. Andy P.S the views above are my personal views and should not be construed to be the RAAus Board position on this or other fatalities of late.
Roundsounds Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 Andy, despite the statement that your comments do not directly relate to the incident triggering this thread, they are inappropriate. Given your involvement as a Board member, I thought you would have better judgement. 2 1
Guest ozzie Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 About ten minutes by road from me. I wonder if weather may have been a factor as it has been going from heavy cloud to clear all afternoon. And have to agree with Andy it has been less than good this year. But this thread is not really the place to discuss it.
Guest Andys@coffs Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 To be blunt 3 in less than a month! 4 in just over a month...the time for being cautious with peoples sensibilities is past..... if we keep up the rate the next one is due in 10.5 days!
Kununurra Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 The past is for learning from not living in. When are these incidents going to be shared to minimise the potential for them to happen again. Maybe the closer look at RAA should be to work out a way to publish these as casa do. 6
farri Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 To those other members of RAAus it is more clear than ever over the last few months that accidents and fatalities related to flying Recreational aircraft don't just happen to others, they happen to us. Andy, I think I understand what you mean by that statement, but I don`t accept the "us" bit and never will!... RA-Aus is made up of individuals! When I go flying, it isn`t "us" going flying, it is me and no one else!.... I`f I were to be the next fatal accident, I would never want anyone else,being held responsible, nor can I see why they should. A very long time ago, I learnt that engine failure, could be fatal if there wasn`t a safe landing area within gliding distance. I taught it to all those I instructed and it saved a couple of them, more than once, in their own aircraft......To this day, there are aircraft still going down in areas, not suitable for a forced landing and they mostly end in a fatal accident....Please tell me how "us" (we) can be held responsible and what "us" (we) can do about it. I`ve said it many times in the past and I will continue to say it into the future!... If there is a problem with an individual pilot, deal with that individual!... If there is a problem with a FTF, deal with that FTF!....If there is a problem with the organisation, then deal with the organisation, but don`t hold everyone responsible, for the accidents that continue to occur. When a pilot decides to go flying, they have made that decision,therefore, as far as I`m concerned, the responsibility for their actions, rests with that pilot! if not, where will the line be drawn and where will it end. Frank. 17 1
farri Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 To be blunt 3 in less than a month! 4 in just over a month...the time for being cautious with peoples sensibilities is past..... if we keep up the rate the next one is due in 10.5 days! To be blunt! why bother with the obvious?.....No answer in that statement....Far better for you to come up with some answers. Frank. 2
Aldo Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 But this thread is not really the place to discuss it. Ozzie Why not if this hadn't happened we wouldn't have this thread? Aldo 3
Aldo Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 Andy, despite the statement that your comments do not directly relate to the incident triggering this thread, they are inappropriate. Given your involvement as a Board member, I thought you would have better judgement. Roundy I disagree, as far as I'm aware the board position is a voluntary position and providing the board members are objective in the discharge of their duties I don't see any reason for Andy not being able to have a personal opinion. Maybe you would prefer if he changed his name to Billy@Benowa to allow him to have an opinion! Aldo 6
Aldo Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 When a pilot decides to go flying, they have made that decision,therefore, as far as I`m concerned, the responsibility for their actions, rests with that pilot! if not, where will the line be drawn and where will it end. Frank I agree 100% once you strap your skinny butt to the seat it is you and only you that is able to determine the conclusion, if you are not current, capable, medically fit or competent in all aspects of what you are about to do you shouldn't be in the seat. For mine there are no excuses once you push the throttle forward. Aldo 4
Guest ozzie Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 OzzieWhy not if this hadn't happened we wouldn't have this thread? Aldo This thread is for this accident If a open debate to discuss this years dismal performance is needed then it should be done on a separate thread. I'd like to be able to return here and easily find the relevant information concerning this accident without having to scroll thru dozens of posts full of emotion to get to it. Andy start a new thread mate.
biggles Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 I think the general thrust of Andy's post is one of shear frustration ,both as a board member and a recreational pilot ,which I'm sure also applies to all here . It is also clear to me ,that if this state of affairs continues, the regulator could be forced to take action ,which could include grounding all aircraft until RAAus come up with a solution . We have already seen the lengths they are prepared to go to with the Jabiru issue, and many people would support that stand . I'm sure that those owners of aircraft and others ,that try to do the right thing ,not being able to use their aircraft for 6 months or more , would not be pleased ...... Bob 1 1
turboplanner Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 Andy, despite the statement that your comments do not directly relate to the incident triggering this thread, they are inappropriate. Given your involvement as a Board member, I thought you would have better judgement. He is giving you a safety message which duty of care obligates him to do. 1 4
Guest asmol Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 Has me wondering what type of plane it is, some reports say metal, some say it was Orange and others say it had a parachute ?
Guest Andys@coffs Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 To be blunt! why bother with the obvious?.....No answer in that statement....Far better for you to come up with some answers.Frank. Frank I believe the only answer that is worth a pinch of anything is the constant reminder that everyone of us as an individual is only one mistake away from demise when it comes to aviation. If there was an easy answer then I presume the many that went before us over the last 100 plus years may well have come up with the silver bullet answer..... Human nature, I guess in order to not be paralysed into doing nothing and going nowhere, is constantly downplaying risk, and applying the "yeah but that only happens to others" label... So sorry, I don't know the answer but I can sure start to visualise the question that will be asked.....
SDQDI Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 He is giving you a safety message which duty of care obligates him to do. Maybe. (Why not in a thread for it though?) But it seems to me that this thread is basically talking about human factors and human error before the dust has even settled and as far as I've read the cause isn't exactly out there yet. It's back to the subject of common decency, a pilot has died and a few hours later we are using the accident thread to discuss human factors. How soon is too soon? I would have thought we could wait until a 'reasonable' idea of the cause was known before blabbing on about every known cause in history. Anyway my condolences to all affected down there, no doubt we all feel for the family and friends involved. 2 1
dutchroll Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 Was it out of YCNK? I'm planning on going flying tomorrow morning. I'll be interested to see if the boys down at my hangar know anything much about it. I just ask people to brace themselves: "fatal ultralight crash" + "10 metres from Cafe in Hunter Valley" + have a glance at recent RA accident record.........well, it's not a bright picture. I'll be surprised if there's not some sort of action making RA quite uncomfortable if this continues too much longer. I feel for the RAA organisers, instructors, mentors, etc. They must be getting despondent. 3 2
Garfly Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 Yes, I've heard that it happened on late downwind for Runway 17 at Cessnock. The pilot was a member of the Hunter Recreational Flying Club based at YCNK. 1
dutchroll Posted May 23, 2015 Posted May 23, 2015 Bugger. I was a member of that club (though my membership has lapsed I still get occasional emails). I was actually planning on flying there today but wasn't really happy with the weather forecast so I've left it until tomorrow. It can't go on like this. 3 1 1
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