CASA caves in on safety

[pmccarthy]

This is a headline in today's Australian. I don't subscribe, so will have to buy a paper later to find out what this is all about. Can anyone provide details?

 

Edit... I found it. They will allow airport ground staff to provide safety and weather information to pilots as in the USA.

 

 

[Guest SrPilot]

They will allow airport ground staff to provide safety and weather information to pilots as in the USA.

Well, I was going to read the article but like you "I don't subscribe," and I cannot find a copy of The Australian in a local news stand. Oh well. I would like to read the article to see if the description of the developments in Australia are "as in the USA." In the US, there are a number of rules governing airport and flight operations, and it's a rather broad sweep to say that "airport ground staff" are allowed to "provide safety and weather information to pilots" in the USA. I can neither agree nor disagree because the "devil is in the details." Provide what, when, under what conditions, by whom? The answer may change at every comma. Does anyone know where a copy of the article can be found online without a subscription? Thanks. j

 

 

[Cosmick]

Hang 5, someone may copy and paste to here today

 

 

[Guest SrPilot]

Hang 5, someone may copy and paste to here today

Thanks Mike, I'll be "hanging."

 

 

[turboplanner]

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/aviation/aviation-watchdog-casa-shares-safety-role/story-e6frg95x-1227383785233

[Geoff13]

Subscriber only article TP

 

 

[fly_tornado]

I can't believe you blokes don't subscribe to the Australian!

 

 

[Geoff13]

I don't subscribe to any online newspaper. If I want the news I will buy a paper copy. That is a rare occurrence nowdays.

 

 

[ave8rr]

I was the ARO (Aerodrome Reporting Officer) for 6 years at Argyle (YARG) in the Kimberley.

 

We were also trained met observers and did the hourly met reports. We also gave the surface conditions for all in bound flights to Argyle so no problems with ground staff passing info if trained to do so.

 

Our MK 1 eye ball info was often better than was being transmitted by the AWIS.

 

Mike

 

 

[old man emu]

I think that they are getting at something that seems to operate in the USA where the airfield is privately owned and there is a company whose business is on the airport. They call them Fixed Base Operators (FBO). The idea is that if you want to land at the airport you call up the FBO on a specific frequency (Unicom ??) and someone on the ground answers and is able to give you current information that you can use to make a safe arrival.

 

It is a bit like making an "All Stations ..." call at an uncontrolled airfield - like Narromine - and having Kev from "Kev's Propwash Shop" reply to tell you that there is a Drifter doing circuits on 06, the wind is 8 kts at 080, air temperature is 27C and QFE {local barometric pressure on the ground} is 1016.

 

Obviuosly, if CASA's ancestors in the 1930's had taken the approach to bolstering aviation that the FAA did at the same time, we would have a bustling general aviation sector servicing this wide brown land, and this whizzo new idea would be Ops Normal.

 

OME

 

 

[turboplanner]

Subscriber only article TP

Interesting, I'm not a subscriber and it was open to me before.

 

Try googling "CASA caves in" which was how I got it.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

In other CASA news

 

CASA's planned yearly flight review requirement for the low-level rating has been extended from 12 to 24 months. A requirement to maintain a minimum of two hours' low-level flying over six months has also been removed.

 

But a "recent experience" requirement for pilots will remain in place, meaning pilots must have a minimum of 20 hours' experience aerial mustering in the preceding year.

 

If mustering pilots can't meet this requirement, they can complete a flight review, proficiency check or flight test including aerial mustering.

 

Mr Canavan said it was an issue he "took up on behalf of the cattle industry" and welcomed the authority's "change of heart".

 

"CASA has acknowledged the concerns from the helicopter industry in particular with the low-level rating, where there would have been minimal safety benefits from the new requirements, but a lot more paperwork and administrative issues for pilots and air operators," he said. "I applaud the efforts of the cattle mustering industry who mobilised their opposition to the proposed changes."

 

 

[Guest SrPilot]

I think that they are getting at something that seems to operate in the USA where the airfield is privately owned and there is a company whose business is on the airport. They call them Fixed Base Operators (FBO). The idea is that if you want to land at the airport you call up the FBO on a specific frequency (Unicom ??) and someone on the ground answers and is able to give you current information that you can use to make a safe arrival. OME

OME is describing an "uncontrolled field" in US parlance. No control tower; no FAA; no landing or takeoff instructions; no ground control. "Everyone be safe out there, you hear?" Pilots rule the roost and follow the rules. FBO personnel may answer on Unicom (one of an assortment of unicom frequencies assigned to that field). Broadcasts on unicom may be heard by other aircraft in transit or at other airports which use the same frequency. Not exactly one-party calling; more like an open frequency. You must listen closely to communications. Position reports are the norm so other aircraft can know who's in the area. But "downwind for 22" could be traffic for any number of airports on the same frequency, so we must use the airport name. "Blackstone traffic, Foxbat 22 Heavy downwind for 27, Blackstone." The problem is, the unicom operator may be filling the tanks on a transit, or towing an airplane into a hangar. Thus, you may or may not get a response to a call for conditions. Even if an answer is forthcoming, it may be from the FBO's teenage non-flying offspring. And no-radio aircraft may be sharing the airspace with you. Of course, many towered airports today are manned by non-FAA personnel such as city employed controllers, and many towers close in the evening so that even normally towered airports become unicom airports during the night. FBO operators do not "control" traffic in the way tower personnel do There is no clearance to land, for example. No assigned runway. No weather reporting other than casual information. Airplane calling Blackstone unicom, traffic in the pattern using runway 27. Wind from the west. Thunderstorm south the the airport. " Approaching aircraft: "No crock, Dick Tracy! I am looking at a 60k mother of a thunderstorm at my 1 o'clock. I'll be landing on 27. Foxbat 22 Heavy will call at 5 miles out."

 

That's about all one likely will get at an uncontrolled field, if they get that much. Pilots may get nothing and just broadcast on frequency to "Blackstone Traffic." However, the system works, and I've had just as many problems - maybe even more - at controlled fields as compared with uncontrolled fields. At uncontrolled fields, pilots know we depend on each other. At controlled fields, some pilots seem to forget to look. They just blast along awaiting instructions. I've made a couple of go-arounds at towered airports because traffic on the ground taxied onto the runway while I was on short final. I've never had that happen at an uncontrolled field. People tend to look-and-listen instead of depending on others to keep them out of trouble. But I have had at least 3 occasions in which I was landing at an uncontrolled field, obeying all the rules, giving all the position reports, landing into the wind, only to be met head-on by some local yokel landing downwind without a single radio call. They usually say "gee, I land here almost every day and you're the only guy I've even seen on the field this time of the day." (or something like that).

 

Be careful out there my friends. There are those out there who are not careful.

 

 

[Russ]

Casa could learn a lot from the yank style.

 

Hell..........Oshkosh ....anyone heard of that mind blowing event. Runs like clockwork. ( not for the faint hearted tho )

 

 

[rhysmcc]

The only thing I see in the article (if the link is the same one i read earlier today), is that a CASA official who earlier said in the "US they don't give such information" is now saying, "yes your right that's what they do". No where did i see any suggestion from CASA that this is changing in Australia.

 

Isn't this the whole role that Flight Service used to provide but was canned under Dick? Now he wants the fire fighters out giving flight briefings?.

 

Saying that Radar is available at 8500, is a long shot from claiming a Radar service could be provided to the ground at any particular aerodrome. We could try ADSB but we know how Dick feels about that.

 

 

[Guest SrPilot]

Casa could learn a lot from the yank style. Hell..........Oshkosh ....anyone heard of that mind blowing event. Runs like clockwork. ( not for the faint hearted tho )

Oh that Oshkosh. NOT an uncontrolled field (and for good reason). Many tales about my trips to OSH and Sun 'n Fun. Agreed. Not for the faint hearted. I remember once when we landed OSH in a Midget Mustang square in the thick of things, the fellow with me said "even my ear lobes are sweating." I landed on 27 on one occasion in a Citabria 7KCAB (aerobatic taildragger) with the wife in the back seat. I must have left 50 feet of skid marks trying not to hit anything or anybody after just having made a beautiful landing at an airport 50 miles or so South of OSH for refueling. It wasn't a crosswind. It was more airplanes than should be in one place at one time being flown by guys who were all thinking the same thing I was: "Where did all these suckers come from?!" If you're flying into OSH, Warbirds are the way to go. We fly in from the East instead of from the West like everyone else, and when we report Warbird Island (or some name like that), the tower gives us the clearance for a warbird arrival in a separate pattern from the other aircraft. Way to go. You can Google "N420RB" and see a photo of me making a landing in the CJ6A at OSH, rwy 36. Nice system for handling boocoos of arrivals and departures.

 

The guys in the tower are FAA controllers. I've always been told, but have never verified. that they compete to get the slots for OSH. I've heard that.

 

 

[Guest ozzie]

Good reason to get to Oshkosh a couple days early is to watch the arrivals. Have some good footage of mass arrivals like the Bonanzas and the Nang Changs one touching down every 5 seconds or so. Even the FAR103 ultralights have their own inbound route and strip. They got it all sorted. Being a controller at Oshkosh is a highly sort after gig.

 

 

[Russ]

some....within the corridors of casa, have the gonads to think "they casa" are the benchmark others strive to achieve. ( what planet are they on....unreal )......they're a joke.

 

 

[coljones]

Aviation watchdog CASA shares safety role

 

• THE AUSTRALIAN
   
   
  
• JUNE 05, 2015 12:00AM
   
   
  

 

 

 

 

 

The aviation watchdog has buckled to more than a decade of pressure from aviators including

 

businessman Dick Smith, agreeing to allow airport ground staff including firemen to provide

 

air-traffic information to pilots as they do in the US.

 

The move follows revelations in The Weekend Australian last Saturday that outdated regulations had

 

stopped regional airports that did not have air traffic control towers and controllers from making use of

 

other staff to improve air safety by relaying basic observations of aircraft movements.

 

The change is likely to be taken up first by larger airports that have fire services including Ballina in

 

NSW, Gladstone in Queensland and Newman in Western Australia.

 

It could also apply to smaller airports — such as Hervey Bay in southeast Queensland, within the seat of

 

Wide Bay held by Deputy Prime Minister Warren Truss — where other ground staff could provide the

 

radio service.

 

Mr Smith willsoon hold public meetings in Wide Bay to apply pressure on Mr Truss, whose ministerial

 

portfolio includes aviation, to adopt the US air traffic controlsystem.

 

He described the Civil Aviation Safety Authority’s decision as a “cave-in”. “It’s a great change, because

 

for 15 years they have done everything to prevent what they have now allowed,” he said.

 

CASA’s change of heart was welcomed by Ballina Byron Gateway Airport manager Neil Weatherson,

 

who is keen to establish a radio operator at the burgeoning facility, which now handles 430,000

 

passengers a year, making it the biggest regional airport in NSW after Newcastle.

 

Mr Weatherson said he would prefer to do so without having to pay for a dedicated radio crew, given

 

the recently built $13.5 million fire station had a roster of 17 full-time staff and a viewing tower.

 

“It’s an option,” he said of the possibility of having the fire crew man the Unicom radio service.

 

“If they do it in the US, it’s possible here.”

 

Ballina Byron Gatew ay Airport manager Neil Weatherson w elcomes the change in CASA rules: ‘If they do it in the US, it’s

 

possible here’. Picture: Lyndon Mechielsen Source: New s Corp Australia

 

6/5/2015 Aviation watchdog CASA shares safetyrole | The Australian

 

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/aviation/aviation-watchdog-casa-shares-safety-role/story-e6frg95x-1227383785233 3/4

 

Mr Weatherson pointed out, however, that it would not be his exclusive call, because while the airport

 

was owned by the council, the fire and rescue operation is run by Airservices Australia, which is

 

financed by the airlines.

 

Ballina Byron fire station manager Wayne Morrison said he had “not formed a view”.

 

Last week, before CASA’s change of policy, an Airservices spokesman said the possibility of fire

 

station staff providing radio services was “not currently being considered”.

 

Yesterday, an Airservices spokeswoman said it was “a matter for the airport”.

 

As late as last week, CASA said US fire crews did not provide air traffic information services to pilots,

 

but was this week forced to admit they did after The Australian cited an airport manager in Colorado

 

and three pilots who had flown in the US attesting to it.

 

For a decade, CASA regulations have sharply restricted ground staff who are not licensed air traffic

 

controllers, or held a controllers’ licence within the past 10 years, from providing any but the most basic

 

weather information to pilots, and banned them from communicating air traffic movements beyond

 

“unscheduled landings by aircraft”.

 

According to Mr Smith, this reflected CASA’s yielding to unions over demarcation issues and a desire in

 

the aviation establishment to restrict who could perform such services to “retired air traffic controller

 

mates”.

 

Under the new policy announced yesterday, CASA will, on a case-by-case basis, allow airport

 

operators to have designated ground staff trained in handling the Unicom radio service and providing

 

pilots with information such as what aircraft are in the circuit around the airport, and on the runways and

 

taxiways.

 

It will grant official exemptions from regulations to allow such radio operators to do so lawfully.

 

“Allsafety issues would be addressed in the assessment of the application,” CASA said. “In the case of

 

a Unicom this regulatory support would include an appropriate legal instrument needed to enable basic

 

information on air traffic to be provided by the Unicom operator to pilots.”

 

In the US, a wide range of ground staff operate the Unicom, including fire and rescue officers, aircraft

 

refuellers, maintenance staff, baggage handlers and check-in employees.

 

Mr Smith will continue his campaign for his other major proposed change to the way Australian airspace

 

is managed: having air traffic controllers direct aircraft wherever radar is available.

 

 

[Guest SrPilot]

Good reason to get to Oshkosh a couple days early is to watch the arrivals. . . . the Nang Changs one touching down every 5 seconds or so. Even the FAR103 ultralights have their own inbound route and strip. They got it all sorted. Being a controller at Oshkosh is a highly sort after gig.

BTDT. First time I went, I had driven straight through, all night. About 7 a.m., I checked in, took a shower and got ready to take a nap. Then I heard the roar of airplanes overhead. I went to the window, looked out at the line of aircraft above, dressed and went to the airport. Never did make up on the lost sleep. Oh, I own a Nanchang. You can drop the extra "g".

 

 

[winsor68]

Good reason to get to Oshkosh a couple days early is to watch the arrivals. Have some good footage of mass arrivals like the Bonanzas and the Nang Changs one touching down every 5 seconds or so. Even the FAR103 ultralights have their own inbound route and strip. They got it all sorted. Being a controller at Oshkosh is a highly sort after gig.

I know it is streets apart...but I was bloody impressed to watch the arrivals at Birdsville Races when I went (many years ago now). Didn't see a single horse race...but that little airport didn't stop all afternoon.

 

 

[TAA up-into-the-air]

There were three articles, plus a series of interviews on ABC plus a Today Show story yesterday [sorry about on-its-side for first 10 seconds!!!].

 

 

Dick Smith made some major concessions for the big-iron, but much more should be taken from this with Alan Jones taking up the cudgells on Friday 5th June 2015. More to come I would expect.

 

The Dick Smith story is summarised on: http://vocasupport.com/dick-smith-has-a-win-against-casa-with-commonsense/

 

Just remember, we need good regulations, a simpler Part 61 from the FAA or the NZ Regs put in place, not exemptions and just another re-write.

 

 

[Guest SrPilot]

The US system isn't perfect, but it's at least quite familiar to people who use it. When I purchased my CJ6A, I had to pick it up in California and fly it to Alabama. That's virtually all the way across the US, west to southeast. At no time on the entire trip did we talk with a controller until we were just over 5 miles out for landing at the home base. Because my home station is has a tower with controllers during daylight hours and into the evening, we had to speak with them. Our local tower controllers are not FAA controllers. Thus, on this trans-continental trip the FAA did not speak with us and we didn't speak with them even once on the entire trip. At the fields where we landed for fuel, food, and other essentials, we spoke with the "unicom" operator if they were manning their radio. Most were. Some were out servicing planes, or throwing frisbies to their dogs, or something. In those instances, we just broadcast to the traffic (if any). We gave position reports at all airports whether speaking with unicom or just broadcasting over the assigned frequency.

 

My trip up to OSH and back in the CJ was the same but I had to speak with two tower controllers - one at the home station (non-FAA) and at OSH (FAA), coming and going. In between destinations, it was unicoms or just open channel position reports for any traffic in the area. As I posted earlier, the positive features are that one can get rather basic traffic and weather reports from unicom operators, and pilots understand the nature of the system so they usually are flying their airplanes with their eyes out of the cockpit. They are not relying on someone in a glass house to tell them what to do, when to do it, and how. Search, see and avoid is the name of the game. Defensive flying. On the other hand, at towered airports, some pilots forget that they have to fly the plane. The controller cannot do it. Even an FAA controller has to defer to the pilot when conditions or circumstances dictate. If given an instruction which endangers the aircraft and its occupants (or others), the pilot informs the controller of the conflict and resolves it. Paperwork later perhaps, but that's better than someone else filling out paperwork on a crash. We also have a program operated by NASA, I believe, in which a pilot can file an anonymous report on a boo-boo and unless it involves intentional or criminal activity, the filing of the report gives the pilot protection against a regulatory action by the FAA against the pilot for the boo-boo. Better to build a database of infractions and discuss them in the aviation community rather than just fine a pilot and/or suspend his flying privileges for some minor infraction. Through all of these interwoven rules, the US pilot lives and flies in a partially controlled environment (e.g., at or near big airports, or when flying IFR, or when flying at higher altitudes) but also operates over huge chunks of the US in "uncontrolled airspace" using common sense and cautious practices. In the 1930s, Charles Lindberg (“Lucky Lindy”) flew across the US (and the pond) without a chat-buddy or directions from a controller. We do the same today - the US at least; and it works. Moreover, if I am not listening to navcom traffic, I can listen to the sound track from Top Gun - at least until the weather starts deteriorating, the engine starts running rough, or I near controlled airspace and must request permission to penetrate the airspace, or I cross a national border..

 

I think I’d probably have to chat with someone to make the jump over the pond. Crossing borders these days raises a lot more interest from all kinds of alphabet agencies (FAA, FBI, NSA, Homeland Security, etc).

 

Sure, some pilots do careless things, but they do so in controlled airspace just like they do in uncontrolled airspace. But whether in controlled or uncontrolled airspace, weather services, FAA controllers, tower or unicom operators are just a radio call away in most instances should you need some information, advice or assistance. Otherwise, just fly your airplane and do so safely.

 

I am interested in the discussion in Australia about your system. I’ve seen NZ mentioned and concluded that NZ has a different system (although to date, I haven’t developed a solid understanding of either system). You talk; I listen. It’s interesting to me. Thanks!

 

 

[Keith Page]

I can't believe you blokes don't subscribe to the Australian!

Wot do you subscribe to? "Wellcamp Guardian"?

 

They will know..

 

Regards

 

KP

 

 

[turboplanner]

The Communist Daily.