Gnarly Gnu Posted September 7, 2015 Posted September 7, 2015 "The Lippisch P.13a was an experimental ramjet-powered delta wing interceptor aircraft designed in late 1944 by Dr Alexander Lippisch for Nazi Germany. The aircraft never made it past the drawing board, but testing of wind-tunnel models in the DVL high-speed wind tunnel showed that the design had extraordinary stability into the Mach 2.6 range As conventional fuels were in extremely short supply by late 1944, Lippisch proposed that the P.13a be powered by coal. Initially, it was proposed that a wire-mesh basket holding coal be mounted behind a nose air intake, protruding slightly into the airflow and ignited by a gas burner. Following wind-tunnel testing of the ramjet and the coal basket, modifications were incorporated to provide more efficient combustion." (model) Well everything old is new again - a battery powered aircraft in Australia is also most likely a coal powered aircraft. 2
pmccarthy Posted September 7, 2015 Posted September 7, 2015 What a great idea. Australian coal could power the world's aircraft and the soot coming out the back would mask sunlight and reverse global warming. (Though I could have used a bit more global warming this winter). 1
Marty_d Posted September 7, 2015 Posted September 7, 2015 Yep, if he had a chance, I bet Dr Alexander Lippisch would have voted for Tony Abbott... 1
Gnarly Gnu Posted September 7, 2015 Author Posted September 7, 2015 Indeed it is! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKp8W1jBuHw 2
willedoo Posted September 7, 2015 Posted September 7, 2015 I remember a few years ago, they flew a B-52 with four of the eight engines running on a fuel made from coal. I think they gasified the coal and then converted the gas to a liquid jet fuel. To make it viable, oil had to be over $80 per barrel, so the idea is not sustainable economically nowdays. This was before the US shale oil boom. I had an idea the method was used during the war to make some type of fuel. Cheers, Willie.
facthunter Posted September 7, 2015 Posted September 7, 2015 We could let England have the ashes. Nev 3
Marty_d Posted September 8, 2015 Posted September 8, 2015 I can hear the conversation now. TA: "Ah, good morning Dr Lippisch. I believe you have invented an, ah, aeroplane, ah, which runs on coal!" AL: "Er... guten Morgen Herr Abbott... ja... I haff done zis, but..." TA: "But this is brilliant, brilliant work! This is a, ah... a GOOD and PROPER way to fuel an aircraft." AL: "Danke, but..." TA: "I'll make sure you, ah, have enough coal, enough coal to power your planes for a, ah, a THOUSAND YEARS!" AL: "Er... Herr Abbott... I haff decided not to use coal... it is too dirty for ze environment..." TA: "WHAT!!?" AL: "Look over here Herr Abbott... I am working on zis electric plane, charged by zis solar array... zere are no emissions, you see..." TA: "This is TERRIBLE! That solar, ah, power plant is, ah, UGLY. This is truly, truly, terrible. It will cause a, ah, budget emergency, ah, a worse budget emergency than this, ah, government inherited!" AL: "Er, actually, zis power plant will be cost neutral in fourteen years, Herr Abbott... und besides ze airfield it vill power ze nearby town..." TA: "Dr Lippisch, I am very, ah, disappointed, very disappointed indeed. Coal is GOOD FOR, ah, HUMANITY. I'm afraid we'll have to, ah, reduce your budget, ah, in order to reduce the deficit, ah, the deficit this government inherited." AL: "By how much?" TA: "100, ah, percent." AL: "F*ck zis scheisse, I am back to Deutschland going!" 3
fly_tornado Posted September 8, 2015 Posted September 8, 2015 Its weird though that the LNP is connected to the Nazi elite. Uncle Otto Abetz was a convicted war criminal whose nephew Eric Abetz is a Tasmanian senator! One of the few western democracies with such a fine pedigree.
Marty_d Posted September 8, 2015 Posted September 8, 2015 I can't stand Eric Abetz - I think he's a nasty, narrow-minded little man - however I'd say that modern Germans should be able to put their past behind them. Look at how they're welcoming 800,000 refugees at the moment - by comparison Australia is the hard and unwelcoming country these days.
Marty_d Posted September 8, 2015 Posted September 8, 2015 We could if we tried. Bit difficult with the dynastic progression of Grooms, Bacons and Hodgemans in state parliament. 1
Old Koreelah Posted September 8, 2015 Posted September 8, 2015 I had an idea the method was used during the war to make some type of fuel... Both the Nazis and Apartheid South Africa developed coal-to-oil technology. Both were on the nose internationally and suffering trade blockades or boycotts, so were desperate enough to pay the enormous cost. Australia's current government is making us more dependent on coal and is also on the nose internationally... Can you see a trend here?
frank marriott Posted September 8, 2015 Posted September 8, 2015 My answer was only to address the matter raised by Willie, they were in use in WW2 in Australia. Not interested in buying into any political (or religious) arguments in the slightest. 1 2
facthunter Posted September 8, 2015 Posted September 8, 2015 The gas producer ran on Coke which produces CO that burns to CO2. Had little power and wore out engines with ash. Nev 1 1
frank marriott Posted September 8, 2015 Posted September 8, 2015 The gas producer ran on Coke which produces CO that burns to CO2. Had little power and wore out engines with ash. Nev Yes Nev, not great, but at the time with fuel rationing it was that or go by horse.
facthunter Posted September 8, 2015 Posted September 8, 2015 Run on kero or stolen avgas. Many cars went on blocks and people rode pushbikes. Nev
Marty_d Posted September 8, 2015 Posted September 8, 2015 There's an idea Nev. Especially for the fitness crowd - passenger pedal-powered aircraft. Sure it may be slow, and if you stop pedalling you stop flying, so you'd end up bloody fit by the time you got there.
Marty_d Posted September 8, 2015 Posted September 8, 2015 Indeed it is! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKp8W1jBuHwAlways nice to see some propaganda, er, information, from our government and its owners.
Old Koreelah Posted September 8, 2015 Posted September 8, 2015 The gas producer ran on Coke which produces CO that burns to CO2... Nev maybe you meant CH4 and H2 rather than CO, which won't burn.
facthunter Posted September 8, 2015 Posted September 8, 2015 Coke has only carbon in it. Where is your hydrogen coming from? CO will oxidise to CO2. Are you confusing it with acetylene ? Nev 1
Old Koreelah Posted September 8, 2015 Posted September 8, 2015 ...What, therefore, is coke oven gas? Large amounts of this gas, whichrepresentsahigh-qualityandlow-costfuelinpurifiedor partiallypurifiedform,resultfromgasificationofcoalorasa by-product of coal degassing at coking plants. It consists of 50 % hydrogen and approx. 25 % methane... From http://www.saacke.com/fileadmin/Media/Documents/pdfs/EN/Brochures/Coke-Oven-Gas.pdf
Nobody Posted September 8, 2015 Posted September 8, 2015 There is a good basic description of the process of producing, "town gas" or "water gas" or "coal gas" at the link below: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coal_gas depending on the process is could be CO or H2 that is being burnt 1 1
facthunter Posted September 8, 2015 Posted September 8, 2015 Coke is what you have left after you put Coal (Anthracite) through coke ovens and the "town gas" is extracted from it. It's used by blacksmiths when forging metals and sometimes in steel making. It's Carbon +ash plus some impurities like sulphur. The "town gas" or coke oven gas is done under high temperatures with water (Hydrogenation) reacting with the very hot carbon in the absence of air. Where a lot of town gas is made, there is plenty of "Coke" for sale' The cars ran on Coke . You can do the same with wood to form "charcoal" which was used in steelmaking in Nordik countries and the steel is more pure. Hence the "quality"of Swedish alloys. Cars there did run on woodchips which when vapourised / distilled, produced something much more complex and better (more calorific) than CO. Nev 2
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