So what's the big announcement on Friday

[Litespeed]

In respect to your questions re: cost of the meeting at Canberra airport, employee wages and purchase of orange vests, signs etc. I believe the Safety month program is being funded by a sizeable CASA safety cash grant .

If that is correct, and I think that's great if it is- then why the bloody hell did they not tell us.

 

A little bit of information goes a long way and can generate goodwill both for RAAus and CASA. Instead due to a vacuum and the appearance of PR spin we have a lot of members complaining because we lack the simple information to have a informed view.

 

The members can not be blamed for getting pissed if we lack the info and hence feel like mushrooms- kept in the dark and fed what seems like bullshite (PR).

 

It does not matter if great things are been done if we get bugger all info, we can only go on what we know.

 

If CASA is truly helping us move to safer operations and helping fund it- the tell us. Then we will appreciate our organisation and CASA for the work they are doing.

 

It is not that damn hard to do. And not just on some Farcebook page and the 1990's style website but here on this forum where we as members and prospective members gather and chat.

 

It is not rocket science.

 

 

[SDQDI]

In respect to your questions re: cost of the meeting at Canberra airport, employee wages and purchase of orange vests, signs etc. I believe the Safety month program is being funded by a sizeable CASA safety cash grant .

If that is the case then that does improve it in my view, as I said earlier the whole orange vest and Political pr may still be a waste of money but if it was funded (fully or part thereof) by CASA then that doesn't worry me so much.

A safety month does have the potential to grow and help but as others have said spreading the word could be done a whole lot better. I'm nearly 30 and I refuse to get Facebook and I know I'm not alone there, especially considering the older generation of our flyers I would have thought a special email would have been in order.

 

While safety is important the LAST thing we need is for RAaus to turn into a mini CASA just because that makes CASA happy and this last pr thingy certainly had the look of something that was just put on for show.

 

 

[Litespeed]

TO ALL Admin-

 

AS a side issue could you please provide on the site Data on how many members are actually registered.

 

I know we have stats on who is on line and those visitors and robots?, but to actually know how big the forum group is would be very helpful.

 

Thanks

 

 

[01rmb]

I am all for improving safety - the key is to drive positive behaviours. Encouraging people to pull up bad behaviours and helping educate others of what they should be doing safer. So now it's time to back up the safety launch with the elimination of bad practices that are leading to accidents and deaths.

 

It does not work if people are undertaking and encouraging unsafe behaviour and breaches of regulations such as low level flights and incorrect circuit procedures.

 

 

[Litespeed]

If that is true about a certain board member then he (assuming it is a he) should be taken outback and have his "member" removed.

 

His member could then be goldplated and become a "Darwin Award" for addition to the "Come and get it trophy".

 

Also should be brought to the notice of RAA and dealt with appropriately.

 

 

[Geoff13]

I am all for safety. I have for many years been a detractor of the excessive use of Flouro vests/shirts in millions of places. If you go to Woolies at 4 pm most days 25% of people there will be wearing a flouro shirt. A genuine safety initiative targeting the things that are killing people would imho be a great thing. A mail out of 4 flouro vests to each of our ftf's with some semi logical instruction to wear them on the flight line is a simple PR stunt gone wrong. This is not simply a group of employees at Canbera airfield, this has involved a mailout to all FTF's with a very mixed message. As I have said before and will continue to say information is paramount. That info must be passed to the members. I amm only aware of the mailout due to my continuing freindship with members of one of my local FTF's.

 

 

[Guest asmol]

Try flying in a fluro shirt, the reflection on any of the instruments makes it all but impossible to read anything especialy when the sun is on the shirt as it is in a lot of low wings

 

 

[Guest ozzie]

SAAA and RAAus are going to merge?

long overdue

 

 

[GAFA]

Providing detailed reports of incidents and accidents on a regular basis, would provide a better safety benefit then handing out fluro safety vests. To me it shows the safety manger has no idea about aviation safety.

 

 

[Guest ozzie]

This is the exact crap that RAAus should be avoiding...this makes me think these guys are a bunch of photo happy politicians, not interested in real outcomes...I dont think i have ever been critical of RAAus till today (happy to be proven wrong) but this just destroyed my faith in them.

It is Canberra, you have to move them out of Canberra it is a bad influence.

 

 

[Geoff13]

Safety is one thing. But the illusion of safety is something else again. We cannot go onto the wharf in Brisbane without Safety Boots. We are not allowed within 50 metres of a working straddle. Safety boots are about as useful as screen doors in a submarine. There is safety and then there is the illusion of safety. What do we really want.

 

 

[DrZoos]

Maj, congratulations on your well put support for RAA . The packages that was sent to CFI's was well accepted and was obviously well intended to address safety issues that have brought RAA into unnesssecary controversy. The safety issue seems to focus on Non compliance of rules and regulations and is about getting this situation under control by greater awareness.It is not BS as Dr Zoo puts it as many have died because of it! If DrZoos is not happy with RAA then he should go get a PPL ! And if he can't get a class 2 medical then he should thank RAA for having him !

Fair shake of the sauce bottle..so anyonne that disagrees need to get aPPL...not sure thats compliant with a membership organisation charter....??? we are entitled and should be actively encouraged to express our opinion, no matter how diverse it is.

 

 

[DrZoos]

It does not work if people are undertaking and encouraging unsafe behaviour and breaches of regulations such as low level flights and incorrect circuit procedures.

Well I was at Narromine in full view of the entire RAAuus SAAA and CASA and watched Paul Bennet and 10 others do low level turns and aeorbaotics less than 100ft AGL. i can post video here if you want of the

 

Gruman avenger doing aerobatics at less than hanger hieght.....

 

Personally that has no influence on my safety as I would never do that....but if thats what floats your boat go for it....

 

What affects me and almost everyone i know every time they fly is M.tow. When they try to scimp on fuel or equipment and then CTA as the plan routes through rediculous terrai. To avoid cta and RA just try and reach places that should be rediculously easy to reach...

 

Seriously. Can you honestly tell me you have not been forced to take less than ideal routes due to cta or Ra, or can you honestly tell me there are times where you have taken less fuel or safety equipment then you would have if you had an extra 50 -100kg

 

Can you honestly say to me your aircraft would be no safer if you had an extra 100 kg?

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

If that is correct, and I think that's great if it is- then why the bloody hell did they not tell us.A little bit of information goes a long way and can generate goodwill both for RAAus and CASA. Instead due to a vacuum and the appearance of PR spin we have a lot of members complaining because we lack the simple information to have a informed view.

The members can not be blamed for getting pissed if we lack the info and hence feel like mushrooms- kept in the dark and fed what seems like bullshite (PR).

 

It does not matter if great things are been done if we get bugger all info, we can only go on what we know.

 

If CASA is truly helping us move to safer operations and helping fund it- the tell us. Then we will appreciate our organisation and CASA for the work they are doing.

 

It is not that damn hard to do. And not just on some Farcebook page and the 1990's style website but here on this forum where we as members and prospective members gather and chat.

 

It is not rocket science.

I think I just did tell you didn't I ???....the event only happened yesterday.

 

 

[Ada Elle]

Can you honestly say to me your aircraft would be no safer if you had an extra 100 kg?

Yes. I've never come close to MTOW on the Alpha. I don't think there's any sane way to do so without being out of CoG - two 120kg POB would be getting chafing at the shoulders.

 

 

[Litespeed]

I think I just did tell you didn't I ???....the event only happened yesterday.

Yes you did just tell us that and thanks for the info, but........................................it took until the 96th post on this thread for such a important nugget of information to be shared with us.

 

Information is the key and in a timely manner not after the horse has already bolted.

 

 

[Mick]

I am all for safety. I have for many years been a detractor of the excessive use of Flouro vests/shirts in millions of places. If you go to Woolies at 4 pm most days 25% of people there will be wearing a flouro shirt. A genuine safety initiative targeting the things that are killing people would imho be a great thing.

The whole fluro vest thing is in my opinion a waste of effort. In places like Gladstone Qld it is more like camoflauge, there is so much of it no one sees it any more. I felt like I was the visible one not wearing fluro.

 

Sure our safety record has been horrible but I can't see how high vis clothing could have prevented any of our serious accidents of late.

 

 

[cscotthendry]

Well that's disturbing, I thought the only professions available in Canberra were politics, public service and prostitution! If it's not the public service.... But all that aside congratulations - it's a beautiful looking plane!

Marty:

Thanks. Yes there are other industries in Canberra, but they are few and far between. I moved there from Brisvegas to take a job at a satellite tracking station (Honeysuckle Creek) and when NASA rationalised that out of existence, I went and did my computing degree and became a software engineer for Pr1me computers, the company that had the C3PO look-alike as a mascot. But even working in the private sector there, I ran into an inordinate number of d*ckheads whose only contribution to ANY discussion was "No, no, no you're wrong". I think that statement should be the Canberra motto.

 

Anywhoo, when Pr1me were subjected to a hostile takeover, I moved back to Qld and sanity.

 

 

[jetjr]

Would people be happier if they sent out a RAA branded tee shirt?

 

Those vests are cheaper and longer lasting as a promo freebie.

 

Its about getting those working in and around airfields wering the right gear and it has our brand.

 

This isnt the whole safety proogram just a part of it

 

The concept is that if you have to remember to put on a vest youll, remember other stuff too

 

 

[rankamateur]

Would people be happier if they sent out a RAA branded tee shirt?Those vests are cheaper and longer lasting as a promo freebie.

Its about getting those working in and around airfields wering the right gear and it has our brand.

 

This isnt the whole safety proogram just a part of it

 

The concept is that if you have to remember to put on a vest youll, remember other stuff too

You are making it sound a bit like teaching Kindy kids to wash their hands before little lunch!

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

Yes you did just tell us that and thanks for the info, but........................................it took until the 96th post on this thread for such a important nugget of information to be shared with us.Information is the key and in a timely manner not after the horse has already bolted.

It looks like the horses need to be hobbled a bit so they don't bolt so often, or so quickly.

 

 

[farri]

Fairdinkum!!! Is there any chance of satisfying some people?..... As much as I can appreciate that it`s good to know what`s going on, in the organisation, (RA-Aus) does every member need to know every minute detail, at all times?

 

Ross, You`re doing OK from where I sit!!!

 

Frank.

 

 

[M61A1]

I get a bit sick of hearing "our safety record is poor". I can't speak for others, but I try to make sure my safety record is good (so far, so good), and if you are making sure your safety record is good, what else should you we be doing? Nature will weed out those who won't play safe regardless of regulation. Essentially the purpose of regulation is to minimise the risk to the public, nothing more.

 

 

[DrZoos]

I get a bit sick of hearing "our safety record is poor". I can't speak for others, but I try to make sure my safety record is good (so far, so good), and if you are making sure your safety record is good, what else should you we be doing? Nature will weed out those who won't play safe regardless of regulation. Essentially the purpose of regulation is to minimise the risk to the public, nothing more.

Thats exactly how i feel, and when we do tell them what they could actually do to improve it further we get ignored!

Which is why the orange vest stunt is so emotive! They are preaching to the convertedbut not listening to the congregation!

 

And hell yeh Maj the board and management are definitely doing great things, even if this one upsets us a bit

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

We need to look at our current ( and past) relationships with CASA....they are the ones who have the ability to make life hard or even impossible for us.

 

I'm not suggesting we front up at their offices first thing Monday morning to lick their floors clean, but to have Skidmore publicly participating in one of our launches is very positive for our present and future. Can you have imagined the former DAS doing this ?...............