fly_tornado Posted November 6, 2015 Posted November 6, 2015 Would have to have been a fatal accident without the chute https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=954156221324739 2
Head in the clouds Posted November 6, 2015 Posted November 6, 2015 Yup, good reason for a chute if you end up like that ... However, I'm curious, if you replay it, right at the very start there's a vertical streamer-like thing that the trike falls away from, does anyone have any idea what it is? Was the trike pilot playing at streamer cutting perhaps? 1
red750 Posted November 6, 2015 Posted November 6, 2015 Aerial launch suspended below a helicopter? 1 2
kasper Posted November 6, 2015 Posted November 6, 2015 Aerial launch suspended below a helicopter? Would agree - zero forward speed yet tumbling starts after 'release' from streamer, no visible person on board and no engine sound - I suspect a remote control test of the deployment/recovery - and without a person on board probably not fatal to anything other than the airframe ;-) 1
fly_tornado Posted November 6, 2015 Author Posted November 6, 2015 a good example of how effective parachutes are at low altitudes
DrZoos Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 Looks like a helicopter launch as, it seems to drop away from that item and accelerate.... also the top of the two items for a millisecond which i couldn't capture in a still frame from facebook shines brightly like the reflection from a metal cable... Clearly a chopper nearby and the camera is from the ground not a chopper. Bloody lucky he had a chute and he really didn't have much extra altitude to play with once he pulled it... I reckon he was pulling some serious G in that thing when he deployed it...it would be easy to have missed it, got flicked or disoriented and messed that whole thing up... wow what a lucky save
cscotthendry Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 a good example of how effective parachutes are at low altitudes Especially if you're inclined to try looping a trike!
Guest ozzie Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 This is a test of a BRS unit. Remote drop and wing was set up to tuck and tumble. Remote deployment. Listen right at the start you can hear the word 'cut'. Close look shows no pilot on board. Serious test would have cost a bit to set up. This clip was posted by a Brazilian but it was mentioned elsewhere that it was in Romania or near there.
DrZoos Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 Hope that pilot job pays well...reckon it score a 110 out of 10 on the hazard matrix
Guest ozzie Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 I recently read an article on trike accidents and the injuries sustained in them. Lots of broken ankles and foot injuries in ground handling accidents and in incidents like these tuck and tumbles the pilot usually comes out of it with broken ribs and other chest and internal injuries from the A frame base smashing back into them. Impossible to hang on to.
SDQDI Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 Hope that pilot job pays well...reckon it score a 110 out of 10 on the hazard matrix If there was no pilot then the that brings it back to nearly risk free:thumb up: 1
Downunder Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 If there was no pilot then the that brings it back to nearly risk free:thumb up: Don't tell CASA, they'll want all aircraft pilot-less ........... and therefore "risk free"!! 1 1
DrZoos Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 We should just have pilot and passenger free aircraft...oh yeh soz, people hate drones as well!
cscotthendry Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 Don't tell CASA, they'll want all aircraft pilot-less ........... and therefore "risk free"!! Nah, CASA are fine with people in airplanes ... As long as the airplanes don't leave the ground ... Or start their engines. 1
tassytriker Posted November 7, 2015 Posted November 7, 2015 I recently read an article on trike accidents and the injuries sustained in them. Lots of broken ankles and foot injuries in ground handling accidents and in incidents like these tuck and tumbles the pilot usually comes out of it with broken ribs and other chest and internal injuries from the A frame base smashing back into them. Impossible to hang on to. I wonder what could be done about redesigning the base bar so as it were to contact the seat frame area in extreme movements instead of the pilot? I would imagine the scenario would be the same if the wing contacted something on the ground?
fly_tornado Posted November 7, 2015 Author Posted November 7, 2015 I am guessing the manufacturers are finding it very hard to get trike pilots to consider any sort of safety compromise.
tassytriker Posted November 8, 2015 Posted November 8, 2015 Im not sure I understand what you mean Tornado?
kasper Posted November 8, 2015 Posted November 8, 2015 I wonder what could be done about redesigning the base bar so as it were to contact the seat frame area in extreme movements instead of the pilot? I would imagine the scenario would be the same if the wing contacted something on the ground? Very difficult It would require side projections from the seat frame area projecting forward of the chest of the pilot - can't be on the bar itself because it would have to be effective across all bar positions not just the straight and level bar position - an uber deep bucket seat and that would have to have extreme cutouts for the pilots arms - and these would have to be very deep to accommodate differing pilot arm lengths. Not viable to put it on the mast as the force from the rotation of the win gin the tumble mode would be massive on such as short moment arm and likely not prevent chest strikes - and then there is the whole moving hang point to accomodate up at that position on the airframe AND just stopping the bar to chest strike only gives the pilot the time to pull big red handle ... training to avoid at all cost neg G and bunt is much more universally available than designing an airframe mod to allow you to be more likely to be in a capacity to pull big red handle Do not get me wrong - the option of a big red handle on a trike is attractive because IF through upset from turbulence it all goes tits up its an option but modding the trike to make it more likely you can get to the airframe out of control point and then pull it is not where trike design needs to go.
Geoff13 Posted November 8, 2015 Posted November 8, 2015 Im not sure I understand what you mean Tornado? Well that puts you in a fairly large group. 2
fly_tornado Posted November 8, 2015 Author Posted November 8, 2015 Im not sure I understand what you mean Tornado? I am sure you could design a trike that wouldn't allow the cross bar to crush the pilots chest. But will the trike pilots buy it? Its a bit like ballistic chutes, hotshots never make mistakes and get into trouble
kasper Posted November 8, 2015 Posted November 8, 2015 I am sure you could design a trike that wouldn't allow the cross bar to crush the pilots chest. But will the trike pilots buy it? Its a bit like ballistic chutes, hotshots never make mistakes and get into trouble I'm sure you could ... but to get the pilot that far back you are basically either putting the engine up the front and having either the mast in front of the pilot or an even larger forward crank on the mast behind the pilot - basically you have to have a way to mechanically limit the base bar forward of the chest of the pilot at all wing roll positions and with the distributed masses of pilot, engine, passenger and fuel where both fuel and passenger have to be pretty close to the CofG of the trike you have limited options on layout of structure. And if you put the engine up the front to give you more freedom on how to mechanically limit bar movement you will have lost 95% of the trike pilots NOT because we are hotshots but because we enjoy the on average lower performance of the trike exactly because we are right out in the breeze with pretty much nothing in front of you - its very engaged flying akin to hang gliding and putting an engine and prop in front of us is not going to be a seller. For me I can easily see how to run a trike without the basebar having the possibility of chest strikes ... but my design gives up one of the other very important and intrinsic aspects of the wing so would equally not be attractive and will not be built. And market knowledge is easy - pilots tend to migrate away from trikes towards three axis as they age and the people with all cash to pay for very nice (and profitable) aircraft are the older people of this world ... hence very little development of what is considered high tech in the area of weightshift and all the investment of design and marketing in 3 axis that are very high performance and very exepnsive.
tassytriker Posted November 9, 2015 Posted November 9, 2015 How about remove the base bar, brace the down tubes well above the pilots head and have a couple of short handle bars on the bottom of the down tubes? That would have to give you a better chance of not being smacked in the ribs?
kasper Posted November 9, 2015 Posted November 9, 2015 How about remove the base bar, brace the down tubes well above the pilots head and have a couple of short handle bars on the bottom of the down tubes? That would have to give you a better chance of not being smacked in the ribs? so the side wires move up 80+cm ... and your 'short' handle bars still need to come down to a comfortable hold height .... and themselves not be hard enough to knock you senceless yet strong enough to control the wing ... and dont forget the fore/aft lower cables still need to run to the shortened aframe ...
Guest ozzie Posted November 9, 2015 Posted November 9, 2015 I remember this A frame redesign discussion long long ago in Ultralight Flight Systems factory, A lot of talk and scribble on the floor working out how to make two J type uprights to replace the A frame unfortunately no way around removing the lower base. It tends to hold the whole show together. If it could be done someone would have found a way after these 40 odd years.
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