Guest ericthered1975 Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 I found this site an interesting report with some curious photographs showing a Spitfire of the RAF carrying beer kegs under the wings. I've never seen this. Can anyone tell what the purpose of it ? To see these curious and unbelievable photos, visit the link below: http://aviacaoemfloripa.blogspot.com.br/2011/01/um-armamento-curioso.html Best Regards!
old man emu Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 That's an old story, repeated many times. In the latter stages of WWll a British pilot operating from an airfield in liberated Europe did a quick sortie back to England, picked up two kegs of beer and flew them back to the airfield for the enjoyment of the squadron's personnel. The pictures tell that this event happened when the weather was warm (see the shirtless ground crew), so it may well have happened sometime after the German surrender. Typically, the whinging Poms complained that the beer had been chilled during the flight and therefore was undrinkable. OME 1 4
Phil Perry Posted December 28, 2015 Posted December 28, 2015 I found this site an interesting report with some curious photographs showing a Spitfire of the RAF carrying beer kegs under the wings. I've never seen this. Can anyone tell what the purpose of it ? Best Regards! Eric. . . . . . You wanna know the purpose of carrying beer ? ? ? ? ? ? We need to go out for a drink and Ill try to explain . . . . . . . 2 1
IBob Posted December 28, 2015 Posted December 28, 2015 That's an old story, repeated many times. In the latter stages of WWll a British pilot operating from an airfield in liberated Europe did a quick sortie back to England, picked up two kegs of beer and flew them back to the airfield for the enjoyment of the squadron's personnel. The pictures tell that this event happened when the weather was warm (see the shirtless ground crew), so it may well have happened sometime after the German surrender.Typically, the whinging Poms complained that the beer had been chilled during the flight and therefore was undrinkable. OME That's an interesting version, though a pity it had to be rounded out by locally added racial slur, I thought. Here is the actual story: http://spitfiresite.com/2012/01/modification-xxx-beer-carrying-spitfires.html 1
Phil Perry Posted December 28, 2015 Posted December 28, 2015 That's an interesting version, though a pity it had to be rounded out by locally added racial slur, I thought. Here is the actual story:http://spitfiresite.com/2012/01/modification-xxx-beer-carrying-spitfires.html Thanks for the link Bob, seen it before, but no matter . . . here's a little story for you. My Maternal Uncle James Bowen was an engineer / tail gunner on Wellingtons at the start of WW2, I say at the start, as his aircraft disappeared without a trace during a leaflet raid over Norway in early 1941. According to my Mother, to whom he regularly wrote a couple of ( heavily censored) letters at least twice weekly; he was a man who really liked his beer. His Mother, could not read due to poor eyesight, so my Mum did the reading and "Filtering" of his letters, which weere sometimes quite fruity ( for the time ) with statements like,. . " The top brass are running around in small circles and farting in church because our new uniforms have not arrived yet and we're wearing a mixture of Khaki and Navy blues. . . ." He and his crewmates would, whilst off flying duty, pile in to the local pub and partake of the ale, which was heated up a little, by sticking a red hot poker from the fire into the beer to take the chill off it. . . I used to watch my Uncle Ernie do this also ( naval man, half blinded by a German Phosphorous bomb whch he grabbed and ran outside with,. . it then blew up in his face when a neighbour chucked a bucket of water on it. . ) both he,. . .and the RAF blokes did NOT like cold beer. ( Most of it in those days was a basic mild ale, with an ABV of around 3.5 percent, unless the publican had any of his illicit home brew available, which sometimes topped five and a half percent ) This was the sort of stuff the Air Ministry did Not censor in his letters, most of the ones I saw had several lines of writing blacked out. The "Beer warming" excercises were obviously not deemed a danger to national security. . . .nor were the mixed up uniforms evidently. . . When I arrived on the convict ship at Port Melbourne in early 1971 ( feb 17th ) I was glad of a cold drink when the OAT was aroind 32 degrees at half eleven in the evening ! . . . but it took me some time to get used to the fizzy Australian light "Lager style" beers which I learned to love later . . .prior to this I was also a drinker of warm beer with bits of wood floating in it. O.M.E. made a joke,. . . . about that point I have no doubt,. . . but "RACIAL" . . . . . Back then, Aussies and me were of more or less the same "Race" just a different culture. Phil. 2 1
IBob Posted December 28, 2015 Posted December 28, 2015 Thanks for the link Bob, seen it before, but no matter . . . here's a little story for you.My Maternal Uncle James Bowen was an engineer / tail gunner on Wellingtons at the start of WW2, I say at the start, as his aircraft disappeared without a trace during a leaflet raid over Norway in early 1941. According to my Mother, to whom he regularly wrote a couple of ( heavily censored) letters at least twice weekly; he was a man who really liked his beer. His Mother, could not read due to poor eyesight, so my Mum did the reading and "Filtering" of his letters, which weere sometimes quite fruity ( for the time ) with statements like,. . " The top brass are running around in small circles and farting in church because our new uniforms have not arrived yet and we're wearing a mixture of Khaki and Navy blues. . . ." He and his crewmates would, whilst off flying duty, pile in to the local pub and partake of the ale, which was heated up a little, by sticking a red hot poker from the fire into the beer to take the chill off it. . . I used to watch my Uncle Ernie ( naval man, half blinded by a German Phosphorous bomb whch he grabbed and ran outside with,. . it then blew up in his face when a neighbour chucked a bucket of water on it. . ) both he,. . .and the RAF blokes did NOT like cold beer. ( Most of it in those days was a basic mild ale, with an ABV of around 3.5 percent, unless the publican had any of his illicit home brew available, which sometimes topped five and a half percent ) This was the sort of stuff the Air Ministry did Not censor in his letters, most of the ones I saw had several lines of writing blacked out. The "Beer warming" excercises were obviously not deemed a danger to national security. . . .nor were the mixed up uniforms evidently. . . When I arrived on the convict ship at Port Melbourne in early 1971 ( feb 17th ) I was glad of a cold drink when the OAT was aroind 32 degrees at half eleven in the evening ! . . . but it took me some time to get used to the fizzy Australian light "Lager style" beers which I learned to love later . . .prior to this I was also a drinker of warm beer with bits of wood floating in it. O.M.E. made a joke,. . . . about that point I have no doubt,. . . but "RACIAL" . . . . . Back then, Aussies and me were of more or less the same "Race" just a different culture. Phil. Thanks for your story, Phil. I also had many family 'serve' in both WW1 and 2, though very few stories, as mostly what they wanted to do was move on and try to live normal lives. The business of mulling various drinks (usually ale or wine) still goes on. It doesn't so much have to do with not liking cold drinks, it's more about what it does to the flavour, though certainly it is more a cold weather thing. As for the RAF blokes not liking cold beer: I would suggest most of the UK don't like overly cold beer as it actually kills the taste. Which, admittedly, in the case of some beers, is a mercy. Phil, I call it as I see it. And while I stand to be corrected, I long ago got weary of the endless allusions to whingeing Poms. I realise it makes some Australians feel better, in a matey sort of way, to share these little put-downs, but I'll be glad when they finally get over whatever it is that makes that necessary.
old man emu Posted December 28, 2015 Posted December 28, 2015 IBob, Phil and I have been swapping sledges with each other for ages when the thread involved is not dealing with a serious topic. I've even been to the town where he lives, in winter, in the snow to collect ammunition to fire at him. Don't forget that Aussies are the delinquent sons of Mother England, who are given to displays of rebelliousness towards our dear mother, but when the chips were down we weren't backward in coming forward to defend her. As for the temperature of beer, you don't know what it is like to come in covered in dust and chaff after spending the day harvesting grain in 35+ degree, dry heat under a cloudless sky, and to drain an icy cold lager style beer. It goes down without touching the sides. After that, you can sit on your second glass while you chat with your mates, and the chill comes off the beer, releasing the frozen flavours. The beers I sampled in England were of a different style - ales rather than lagers. However, when drunk at a temperature between 5 and 10C, they were quite tasty. In those sort of temperatures, you don't need a beer to be refreshing. It is an adjunct to a meal. OME
winsor68 Posted December 28, 2015 Posted December 28, 2015 IBob,Don't forget that Aussies are the delinquent sons of Mother England, who are given to displays of rebelliousness towards our dear mother, but when the chips were down we weren't backward in coming forward to defend her. OME Were the delinquent sons of Mother England....
Phil Perry Posted December 28, 2015 Posted December 28, 2015 Thanks for your story, Phil. I also had many family 'serve' in both WW1 and 2, though very few stories, as mostly what they wanted to do was move on and try to live normal lives.The business of mulling various drinks (usually ale or wine) still goes on. It doesn't so much have to do with not liking cold drinks, it's more about what it does to the flavour, though certainly it is more a cold weather thing. As for the RAF blokes not liking cold beer: I would suggest most of the UK don't like overly cold beer as it actually kills the taste. Which, admittedly, in the case of some beers, is a mercy. Phil, I call it as I see it. And while I stand to be corrected, I long ago got weary of the endless allusions to whingeing Poms. I realise it makes some Australians feel better, in a matey sort of way, to share these little put-downs, but I'll be glad when they finally get over whatever it is that makes that necessary. Fair play mate,. . . I was just basically saying "Lighten Up" a bit,. . .I am sorry if my mate OME's comment irritated you,. . .but it was made in the nicest possible way. . . ie, friend to friend. . . . .and that is the way I'd like to keep things on this forum. Oh, I certainly "go off" on a racial one now and again, especially about the way I'm now a second class citizen in my county of birth, but I try to keep that humorous as well. Happy new year to you and your family. . .and clear skies for flying with ( you bloody lucky sod. . . .) from miserable cold, wet, windy ( the Perry Home anemometer registered a gust of 71 .4 MPH around 2 hours ago, . . .now it's a steady 50 / 55 mph. . .they've named the current storm "Frank" and frankly I jiust wish it would go away but we've got it for the next 2 days I fear. . . .no lightweight flyin here for a bit. . . . . .) I'm dying for the Met office to name one Abdul. . .or summat. . . yeah. . .right. . . . Phil, Angie, Rachel and Leanne. . . . ( and Jesus. . .our friendly guard Rottweiler. . . . )
IBob Posted December 29, 2015 Posted December 29, 2015 I stand corrected, and I apologise. I greatly enjoy the clever insult (I lived in Scotland and it seems to be an art form there.) I had not realised I had strayed into that sort of minefield. I have a real problem with intolerance. I suppose you could say that I'm intolerant of intolerance? Yes, I know, bad joke... Still, it seems to me we live in a very troubled world, and we don't need to add to that or go looking for it. But yes, I probably do need to lighten up. All the best as you battle your way through winter there, Phil. Sure the winters can be hard, but it's a most beautiful country.... 1
Phil Perry Posted December 29, 2015 Posted December 29, 2015 " Sure the winters can be hard, but it's a most beautiful country.... " Is it,. . .? ? ? ( ! ) Most of it is under several metres of sewage contaminated watery stuff at the moment mate,. . . which is why I bought a house 565 ft above sea level ! ! ! ! ! ( well,. . .being a radio Ham, this height also helps ! ! ! ) Cheers Bob. Phil
IBob Posted December 29, 2015 Posted December 29, 2015 " Sure the winters can be hard, but it's a most beautiful country.... "Is it,. . .? ? ? ( ! ) Most of it is under several metres of sewage contaminated watery stuff at the moment mate,. . . which is why I bought a house 565 ft above sea level ! ! ! ! ! ( well,. . .being a radio Ham, this height also helps ! ! ! ) Cheers Bob. Phil Dammit, man.....stiffen that upper lip........you're frightening us in the colonies! A ham, eh? Hmmm...another thing I know nothing about (though my most excellent instructor has a lifetime's experience in all manner of hammishness, in addition to enormously broad flying experience, fortunate man that I am). But...it just so happens that I am in possession of some very fine insulators from one of the old coastal LW stations here: they are simple (but elegant) long porcelain slabs with a hole in each end; and I know they're fine 'cos they have Made In England onem. I have no idea why I got them, and have been struggling to find something clever to do with them ever since I did. Though my instructor seemed to like the two pair I gave him: "top quality" he said, "look, Made In England"...........
Phil Perry Posted December 29, 2015 Posted December 29, 2015 "Is it,. . .? ? ? ( ! ) Most of it is under several metres of sewage contaminated watery stuff at the moment mate,. . . which is why I bought a house 565 ft above sea level ! ! ! ! ! ( well,. . .being a radio Ham, this height also helps ! ! ! ) Cheers Bob. Phil Dammit, man.....stiffen that upper lip........you're frightening us in the colonies! A ham, eh? Hmmm...another thing I know nothing about (though my most excellent instructor has a lifetime's experience in all manner of hammishness, in addition to enormously broad flying experience, fortunate man that I am). But...it just so happens that I am in possession of some very fine insulators from one of the old coastal LW stations here: they are simple (but elegant) long porcelain slabs with a hole in each end; and I know they're fine 'cos they have Made In England onem. I have no idea why I got them, and have been struggling to find something clever to do with them ever since I did. Though my instructor seemed to like the two pair I gave him: "top quality" he said, "look, Made In England"........... OOOOOOH. . . .I could do with four of those to make a rhombic antenna, so that I can get enough gain to work my mates in OZ on the HF bands at this rather low ebb of the current sunspot cycle. . . . . I can only get stupid tiny Egg" insulators which are actually a quarter of the size of a hen egg,. . . .they'd be blown to pieces by the rf voltage at the end of the lines. . . . . I'm using big chunks of perspex scrap glued together for insualtors at the moment. . . .they work, but the dielectric constant value is not right, ie, they don't INSULATE that well at RF frequencies, especially in wet conditions ( ie all the fecking time in England. . .) . . . . .oh well. . . .Nemind Aye. . .as my mate Alfie used to say. . . . . .I'm on a written warning at the moment mate, as I burned down the Wife's garden shed a few months back, when one of the end insulators failed. . . . . gotta be careful,. . .I'm bloody useless at washing socks and undies. . . .
IBob Posted December 29, 2015 Posted December 29, 2015 Hold on...trying to work out how to post pic. How you attach a pic???
IBob Posted December 29, 2015 Posted December 29, 2015 Dammit, man.....stiffen that upper lip........you're frightening us in the colonies!A ham, eh? Hmmm...another thing I know nothing about (though my most excellent instructor has a lifetime's experience in all manner of hammishness, in addition to enormously broad flying experience, fortunate man that I am). But...it just so happens that I am in possession of some very fine insulators from one of the old coastal LW stations here: they are simple (but elegant) long porcelain slabs with a hole in each end; and I know they're fine 'cos they have Made In England onem. I have no idea why I got them, and have been struggling to find something clever to do with them ever since I did. Though my instructor seemed to like the two pair I gave him: "top quality" he said, "look, Made In England"........... OOOOOOH. . . .I could do with four of those to make a rhombic antenna, so that I can get enough gain to work my mates in OZ on the HF bands at this rather low ebb of the current sunspot cycle. . . . . I can only get stupid tiny Egg" insulators which are actually a quarter of the size of a hen egg,. . . .they'd be blown to pieces by the rf voltage at the end of the lines. . . . . I'm using big chunks of perspex scrap glued together for insualtors at the moment. . . .they work, but the dielectric constant value is not right, ie, they don't INSULATE that well at RF frequencies, especially in wet conditions ( ie all the fecking time in England. . .) . . . . .oh well. . . .Nemind Aye. . .as my mate Alfie used to say. . . . . .I'm on a written warning at the moment mate, as I burned down the Wife's garden shed a few months back, when one of the end insulators failed. . . . . gotta be careful,. . .I'm bloody useless at washing socks and undies. . . . I'm trying to figure out how to attach a pic here, while knee deep in wife's grandchildren and various visiting family. If/when I can do so, i'll send you a pic to see if they'd do the job.
IBob Posted December 29, 2015 Posted December 29, 2015 OOOOOOH. . . .I could do with four of those to make a rhombic antenna, so that I can get enough gain to work my mates in OZ on the HF bands at this rather low ebb of the current sunspot cycle. . . . . I can only get stupid tiny Egg" insulators which are actually a quarter of the size of a hen egg,. . . .they'd be blown to pieces by the rf voltage at the end of the lines. . . . . I'm using big chunks of perspex scrap glued together for insualtors at the moment. . . .they work, but the dielectric constant value is not right, ie, they don't INSULATE that well at RF frequencies, especially in wet conditions ( ie all the fecking time in England. . .) . . . . .oh well. . . .Nemind Aye. . .as my mate Alfie used to say. . . . . .I'm on a written warning at the moment mate, as I burned down the Wife's garden shed a few months back, when one of the end insulators failed. . . . . gotta be careful,. . .I'm bloody useless at washing socks and undies. . . . I'm trying to figure out how to attach a pic here, while knee deep in wife's grandchildren and various visiting family. If/when I can do so, i'll send you a pic to see if they'd do the job. Okay, Phil, do these look like they'd do the job? The discolourations are old oxide paint & grease, I guess from cable maintenance. Cleans off easily, then they look like ivory.
IBob Posted December 29, 2015 Posted December 29, 2015 IBob,Phil and I have been swapping sledges with each other for ages when the thread involved is not dealing with a serious topic. I've even been to the town where he lives, in winter, in the snow to collect ammunition to fire at him. Don't forget that Aussies are the delinquent sons of Mother England, who are given to displays of rebelliousness towards our dear mother, but when the chips were down we weren't backward in coming forward to defend her. As for the temperature of beer, you don't know what it is like to come in covered in dust and chaff after spending the day harvesting grain in 35+ degree, dry heat under a cloudless sky, and to drain an icy cold lager style beer. It goes down without touching the sides. After that, you can sit on your second glass while you chat with your mates, and the chill comes off the beer, releasing the frozen flavours. The beers I sampled in England were of a different style - ales rather than lagers. However, when drunk at a temperature between 5 and 10C, they were quite tasty. In those sort of temperatures, you don't need a beer to be refreshing. It is an adjunct to a meal. OME Hi, OME, interesting reflection on Mother England when the chips were down: I've come across some of the numbers, as most of us have, but it never really came home to me (in NZ) until I got my midlife motorbike, and set out to explore the backroads and the one horse coastal settlements here. And it seemed like every crossroads and every tiny place had a cenotaph with a list of those who didn't come back. Often enough in groups with the same surname. So I got to think about that, as and when i got off for a breather and a break. But there's something else too, which in no way detracts from what they did, or the price so many paid: an awful lot of the survivors here were interviewed later in life, taped, for the records and for posterity. Probably the same happened in Australia. And I don't know what the Australian experience was, but a large number of those men didn't go for 'King and Country', for 'Mother England'. And they are quite open and honest about that. As I just said, but i'd best repeat it, this in no way detracts from what they did, or the price they and their loved ones paid. I think we should now also respect their honesty and humanity, as we move gradually away from the very long reach of wartime and post-war propaganda.
Marty_d Posted December 29, 2015 Posted December 29, 2015 OOOOOOH. . . .I could do with four of those to make a rhombic antenna, so that I can get enough gain to work my mates in OZ on the HF bands at this rather low ebb of the current sunspot cycle. . . . . I can only get stupid tiny Egg" insulators which are actually a quarter of the size of a hen egg,. . . .they'd be blown to pieces by the rf voltage at the end of the lines. . . . . I'm using big chunks of perspex scrap glued together for insualtors at the moment. . . .they work, but the dielectric constant value is not right, ie, they don't INSULATE that well at RF frequencies, especially in wet conditions ( ie all the fecking time in England. . .) . . . . .oh well. . . .Nemind Aye. . .as my mate Alfie used to say. . . . . .I'm on a written warning at the moment mate, as I burned down the Wife's garden shed a few months back, when one of the end insulators failed. . . . . gotta be careful,. . .I'm bloody useless at washing socks and undies. . . . Don't most toilets have a porcelain lip at the back with a couple of holes in it where the seat bolts on? Just saying..
Phil Perry Posted December 29, 2015 Posted December 29, 2015 Crackin' insulators those Bob,. . . . although looking at the accompanying steel rule, it looks as if they would be quite heavy as well, and this is part of my problem, ie I have to employ fairly light gauge enamelled copper wire to make my antennas, so that the neighbours can't ssee them easily between the trees ! Those are lovely heavy duty insulators desigtned for really thick stuff and I doubt if my wire creations could stand the weight ! ! ! otherwise I'd be sending you a few bucks to stick 'em in the post mate ! Neighbours can be funny animals I find,. . .when I moved in to my first house after returning from Aus, I erected a couple of ally, and wire aerials, and within a day, a neighbour came knocking and said that my "CB" aerial was interfering with his "Telly" . . . thing was, I hadn't got the radio gear from the docks at that point. . . .! Thanks for the heads up Marty, never thought of using the back end of a toilet for an insulator,. . .but I dunny think that would work well, probably be a crap signal. . . . "Good Morning old man, name here is Phil,. . . radio gear is by Drake electronics, and my aerial is by Armitage Shanks. . . .over. . . . ." 1
Geoff13 Posted December 29, 2015 Posted December 29, 2015 I remember the Christmas B-B-Q we had in England. In the middle of the backyard of our semi detached house (whatever the hell that means, surely the house is detached or not detached, how can it be semi detached?) but I digress, the backyard was about the size of an Aussie farmers handkerchief. Well 2 feet of snow the barbie smoking away and every bloody Pom within 5 miles sniffing around seeing what the bloody silly Aussies where up to now. At least it was easy to keep the Beer cold, in England in the December the whole bloody country turns into the worlds best esky. Just grab a 6 pack and bury it in the snow. What a wonderful 2.5 years we had over here with so many pommy mates that are now lifelong friends.
Phil Perry Posted December 29, 2015 Posted December 29, 2015 I remember the Christmas B-B-Q we had in England.In the middle of the backyard of our semi detached house (whatever the hell that means, surely the house is detached or not detached, how can it be semi detached?) but I digress, the backyard was about the size of an Aussie farmers handkerchief. Well 2 feet of snow the barbie smoking away and every bloody Pom within 5 miles sniffing around seeing what the bloody silly Aussies where up to now. At least it was easy to keep the Beer cold, in England in the December the whole bloody country turns into the worlds best esky. Just grab a 6 pack and bury it in the snow. What a wonderful 2.5 years we had over here with so many pommy mates that are now lifelong friends. Good one Geoff. . . . to answer your query, . . ."Standard" British houses can be "Detatched",. . . ie, stand alone stuctures, sometimes with a driveway on both sides. . .. . . . .or "Semi-detatched". . . .connected to an opposite handed structure at one end, with a driveway on one side. . . .or "Terraced". . . . .connected to the other buildings on both sides. . .with no driveway access to the rear of the property, unless it is from the next street, usually via a narrowish alleyway access to a sort of communal garage block at the rear. . .but Dahn in Lahndon,. . .these are called MEWS houses as the people dahn there seem to think it sahnds a bit more clarsy ( ? ) Land prices are a big problem to major builders nowadays, and newer dwellings are being made painfully smal, with detatched properties separated by as little as one metre. . . .! in London last year, a "Parking Space" between some dwellings was sold for £330,000. . . . . . Not many "Ordinary" folk can afford to live down in the smoke nowadays,. . .just luvvie leftie BBC empolyees and other media millionaires. . . .the Arabs own 60 percent of London property now anyway. . . . and leave it all unnocupied waiting for the prices to increase. . . Park lane in London is 100 percent Arab owned. . .I can understand why the Thais don't allow foreign investors to purchase land in their country ! ! ! !
IBob Posted December 29, 2015 Posted December 29, 2015 Crackin' insulators those Bob,. . . . although looking at the accompanying steel rule, it looks as if they would be quite heavy as well, and this is part of my problem, ie I have to employ fairly light gauge enamelled copper wire to make my antennas, so that the neighbours can't ssee them easily between the trees ! Those are lovely heavy duty insulators desigtned for really thick stuff and I doubt if my wire creations could stand the weight ! ! ! otherwise I'd be sending you a few bucks to stick 'em in the post mate !Neighbours can be funny animals I find,. . .when I moved in to my first house after returning from Aus, I erected a couple of ally, and wire aerials, and within a day, a neighbour came knocking and said that my "CB" aerial was interfering with his "Telly" . . . thing was, I hadn't got the radio gear from the docks at that point. . . .! Thanks for the heads up Marty, never thought of using the back end of a toilet for an insulator,. . .but I dunny think that would work well, probably be a crap signal. . . . "Good Morning old man, name here is Phil,. . . radio gear is by Drake electronics, and my aerial is by Armitage Shanks. . . .over. . . . ." Aye, they're heavy, Phil...and I can see now where that would be a problem in your setup. Neighbours, eh? Good ones are solid gold: my late parents had the most wonderful neighbours in Melbourne for all the last years of their lives. Just quietly kept an eye on them and did the little things they couldn't do themselves, without fuss and without being asked. And the not good ones can be a curse: I had a dog set on me in Brisbane 'cos I was packing a parachute down the side of the house, and I may have put a foot on the neighbour's property, there being no fence. Dog was followed rapidly by owner, however, we used to use steel stakes to pull the old canopies out tight and straight, and as I got up I pulled a stake and just held it, and both dog and owner took a quick step back. I think some folk are just threatened by anything outside their own existence. And some, lacking clout in the wider world, compensate by ruling their own castles as little tyrants... Takes all sorts, eh? Anyway, all the best with radio WCPP 1
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