Bris to Longreach - tips and suggestions

[Pearo]

So this will be the first decent Nav since my PPL. Will also be my first trip into the red country with not a lot of ground references. Sharing the flight with a CPL student who is hour building. I want to do this trip as a pure DR exercise with no GPS (even though we are flying a g1000 cockpit).

 

Rough plan is Redcliffe, Emerald, Longreach (overnight) Charleville, Redcliffe (stops at each point). The other person I am flying with has enroute PIFR, so I think we might fly at least one leg as IFR which will also be a good intro to me for my upcoming IFR training. Might also include Roma so we have a couple of places to attempt RNAV approaches (the only time GPS will be used hopefully!)

 

Looking for flight planning tips, good alternates, potential places to stop and have a look, good waypoints for DR nav etc. No Coastal Nav either, that is too easy.

 

Plane we are flying (C182) has about 6 hours endurance, although I am not interested in spending anywhere near that amount of time in the cockpit!

 

Thanks!

 

 

[facthunter]

Get into the air early for smoother air. With high surface temps the inversion level rises during the day. Fly headings accurately on compass for practice. Nev

 

 

[Russ]

other poss points.......springsure / rollston / dingo. ( all good strips, acomm etc, adjacent )

 

 

[M61A1]

So this will be the first decent Nav since my PPL. Will also be my first trip into the red country with not a lot of ground references. Sharing the flight with a CPL student who is hour building. I want to do this trip as a pure DR exercise with no GPS (even though we are flying a g1000 cockpit).Rough plan is Redcliffe, Emerald, Longreach (overnight) Charleville, Redcliffe (stops at each point). The other person I am flying with has enroute PIFR, so I think we might fly at least one leg as IFR which will also be a good intro to me for my upcoming IFR training. Might also include Roma so we have a couple of places to attempt RNAV approaches (the only time GPS will be used hopefully!)

 

Looking for flight planning tips, good alternates, potential places to stop and have a look, good waypoints for DR nav etc. No Coastal Nav either, that is too easy.

 

Plane we are flying (C182) has about 6 hours endurance, although I am not interested in spending anywhere near that amount of time in the cockpit!

 

Thanks!

If it's on a weekend, Oakey has facilities for ILS, just not allowed to land. During the week, when airspace is active , generally stay clear. Atis 124.3 gives airspace status.

 

 

[Chocolate]

Allow in your planning for it being just too windy to continue. Allow an extra day in there.

 

 

[Chocolate]

About the half way (listowel) from Longreach to Charleville is some truly spectacular topography.

 

Be prepared. If you land unexpectedly on this leg you will be liable to perish from thirst at this time of year. This leg has very few people and some serious walking (at night ) to find help...and forget about your phone working on this leg if y are on the ground. Not all the stations on the wac are occupied these days.

 

Maybe think about going on to Winton from Longreach....very spectacular jump up country.

 

If you are going soon...take enough water .

 

 

[Pearo]

Get into the air early for smoother air. With high surface temps the inversion level rises during the day. Fly headings accurately on compass for practice. Nev

Yup, plan is to fly as high as possible. We might even try 12000ft on the IFR leg if we can climb that high!!

 

Allow in your planning for it being just too windy to continue. Allow an extra day in there.

Fortunately we are not on a time limit. Talking to on of the other members at the club who has flown the same aircraft to Longreach twice, he said it took 4 hours once, and 6 hours the next time due to headwind

 

About the half way (listowel) from Longreach to Charleville is some truly spectacular topography. Be prepared. If you land unexpectedly on this leg you will be liable to perish from thirst at this time of year. This leg has very few people and some serious walking (at night ) to find help...and forget about your phone working on this leg if y are on the ground. Not all the stations on the wac are occupied these days.

 

Maybe think about going on to Winton from Longreach....very spectacular jump up country.

 

If you are going soon...take enough water .

Water, very good tip.

 

 

[red750]

Check the DG against the compass regularly. If it's bumpy, the compass jumps around like a cat on hot bricks. If the DG drifts off and you don't have good ground references, tracking on the DG could lead you off track. I've had it happen.

 

 

[facthunter]

In that type of country coming down away from a road could be a real problem if you bend it. It's one area I would stay near fairly well used roads if possible for more assistance likely. Nev

 

 

[Pearo]

Check the DG against the compass regularly. If it's bumpy, the compass jumps around like a cat on hot bricks. If the DG drifts off and you don't have good ground references, tracking on the DG could lead you off track. I've had it happen.

G1000, luxury!! No need to adjust the DG in these modern cockpits! But interesting you should say that, because I reckon I check the DG every 10 mins or so in the analog cockpits. Just one of those things I do, as soon as I get bored its a full check of everything, got to keep myself busy.

 

 

[Pearo]

In that type of country coming down away from a road could be a real problem if you bend it. It's one area I would stay near fairly well used roads if possible for more assistance likely. Nev

From what I am told, once west of Emerald it gets pretty featureless, so I think I will plan to fly roads anyway.

 

 

[red750]

The original IFR - I Follow Roads.

 

G1000, luxury!! No need to adjust the DG in these modern cockpits!

He said they planned to go DR, even though the plane has a G1000 cockpit.

 

 

[ben87r]

G1000 DR.

 

Step one. Set CDI to track

 

Step two. Adjust autopilot on HDG mode to align the tracking diamond with CDI.

 

step three. Nap with alarm set for TOD -3min.

 

 

[Pearo]

G1000 DR.Step one. Set CDI to track

 

Step two. Adjust autopilot on HDG mode to align the tracking diamond with CDI.

 

step three. Nap with alarm set for TOD -3min.

Nah,

 

Start engine, enter flight plan, establish in circuit, engage AP and press NAV button. AP disconnect to flare and land!!

 

G1000 is great, I love it and I love the integrated AP even more. When I fly that plane, it spends most of its time on AP. This trip will also use AP, but on ALT hold only. No GPS or flight plan in the system other than any RNAV approaches. Paper charts and whiz wheels all the way. Gotta keep it real. I actually enjoy DR, its the way I learned to navigate across oceans in boats, and its the way I was taught in aircraft. As a boatie, I tend to distrust GPS, its a good aid to navigation, but should never be used as a primary resource.

 

FWIW, I am getting the hang of OzRunways now, and I have a backup iPad. But I still carry paper charts and a paper flight plan. I have been navigating for years on my boats with a GPS chartplotter, but the same rules apply. I will not go to sea without paper charts period.

 

 

[Pearo]

BTW, the biggest problem with the G1000 is it does not have most of the Aussie ALA's in its database. Its clearly aimed at IFR flight plans, not VFR. The next biggest problem is it does not show CTA steps, once again because I think its primarily target at IFR.

 

 

[red750]

Never had all these gizmos. All we had was a compass, a chart, a pencil and an E6B.

 

 

[Pearo]

Never had all these gizmos. All we had was a compass, a chart, a pencil and an E6B.

Thats the way its still taught.. Its not far off from the way offshore nav is taught to boaties either. I was taught astral nav, but most of that is lost now.

 

 

[ben87r]

Nah,Start engine, enter flight plan, establish in circuit, engage AP and press NAV button. AP disconnect to flare and land!!

 

.

But that wouldn't be DR now would it ;)

 

 

[Chocolate]

"featureless past emerald"... wtf. none of it is featureless...look out the window . its a beautiful country.

 

 

[Cloud Basher]

I have done a fair bit of flying in the outback and I actually found it "easier" to navigate. Well maybe not easier, but one of the things that strikes me is, the lack of features actually means those that are there stand out like dogs balls and therefore there is less confusion about which feature (road, dried lake, river, homestead etc) you may be passing in order to get your fix. As Chocolate says above, it is far from featureless. Even to this day, where most of my long distance flights are in airliners, I still love to look out the window at this "featureless" country and be amazed and what I can find in terms of stations, homesteads, big mobs of sheep or cattle being mustered and of course I love to identify airstrips and imagine landing there. Most of the properties out that way have them.

 

Good luck and if I may suggest, turn those screens off and use a handheld radio! On My CPL pre-test, Craig Marshall turned the screens off at about 200ft on takeoff and didn't turn them back on until around 30nm from our departure airfield. Compass, clock and map. Be a pilot not and aircraft manager...

 

Cheers

 

CB

 

 

[rankamateur]

G1000 DR.Step one. Set CDI to track

 

Step two. Adjust autopilot on HDG mode to align the tracking diamond with CDI.

 

step three. Nap with alarm set for TOD -3min.

May as well nap in your lounge room and you know the bed is comfy each night.

 

 

[Tomo]

You'll love it, my favourite country to fly over is the outback stuff.

 

Being summer, and if you don't want to be tossed around I'd get going early... as it'll get rough and hot as the day heats up. Once you leave Emerald the Navving to Longreach is a piece of cake! Pretty much just follow the highway. Enjoy the different scenery and cattle stations you'll fly over. There's airstrips at a lot of stations if you run into dramas, or just want to drop in... buzz the strip or homestead first. Don't forget about DA with the hot climates.

 

Check out Barky airstrip, it's huge!! (just east of Longreach). And be aware of the blackness if you do any night flying, but you'll find Navigating quite easy as you just head towards the town lights! If you take off in the dark, look at your instruments and not the black hole out front! (much different to flying from the coastal/built up areas)

 

Longreach is a great place, and you'll see it from miles away, as the 747 sticks out like cowboy in a city. If you run into any trouble let me know as I have a contacts spread all around that area. There is a little restricted area just south of Longreach about 10-12nm from memory, just to be aware of. If you have the time, head home via Windorah or Quilpie, the channel country through there is awesome I reckon! Avgas is available from Windorah but not Quilpie from memory.

 

Enjoy your time and let us know how you go... I miss that country so much now that I'm down near Sydney....

 

Here's a dodge video I put together a few years ago.

 

 

 

[DonRamsay]

Well, I am curious as to when you think you might be forced to go DR? For me it would take most of the US and Russian satellites to go defective at the same time. I've had iPads fail to display GPS and one turned off due to overheating but the backup has always been there.

 

• I have the G1000's little brother, G3X Touch (GPS 1) with backup battery good for hours;
   
   
  
• OzRunways running on iPad mini mounted on instrument panel, fully charged before takeoff and running on ship power; (GPS 2)
   
   
  
• Dual XGPS160 fully charged before flight and running on ship power as backup GPS signal source connects by Bluetooth to up to 5 iDevices seeing both Russian and USA Sats)
   
   
  
• iPhone running OzRunways (backup not primary) GPS 3
   
   
  

 

 

And if I were going bush, I'd take a second iPad running OzRunways.

 

And of course I navigate by looking out the window and updating my paper flight plan.

 

If you were to calculate the probability of all those systems going fut at the same time it would be an astronomical number.

 

As a last resort there is my SPOT tracker and the EPIRB.

 

Almost as a superstition I admit to carrying WACs but would not have a mechanical E6B in the cockpit. Do have electronic versions but do not expect ever to use while in the air.

 

When the Super G Constellation was in service on the long haul overseas runs they used celestial navigation to find their way around. There is that cute plastic dome in the roof of the Connie for the navigator to take sightings with his sextant. I'm glad nobody is seriously suggesting anything like that. Why not? Not necessary with modern equipment.

 

In my view, far better that pilots were well trained in all the vagaries of GPS than just DR.

 

 

[Pearo]

Good luck and if I may suggest, turn those screens off and use a handheld radio! On My CPL pre-test, Craig Marshall turned the screens off at about 200ft on takeoff and didn't turn them back on until around 30nm from our departure airfield. Compass, clock and map. Be a pilot not and aircraft manager...

Cheers

 

CB

I will turn the moving map off, not sure I am comfortable flying purely compass and clock, as its actually pretty hard on the compass alone. I might try it though. I have done some short legs on compass alone, but its hard to read, especially at this time of year with all the thermal turbulence.

 

When I was training, I had the instruments taken away from me a lot. Its a good way to teach people how to fly. I remember in the early days of doing circuits, I would loose all my instruments too!! Harsh, but I can pick a profile and approach speeds now with out having to spend the whole time in the cockpit. Actually, when doing my CSU endorsement I was commended on my situational awareness, and a lot of that stems from the way those instructors taught me to fly.

 

Well, I am curious as to when you think you might be forced to go DR?%< (snip)

 

In my view, far better that pilots were well trained in all the vagaries of GPS than just DR.

Its not that we think we are going to be forced to DR, its that we want to. The guy I am flying with is a CPL student, so he is going to be tested on this. I figure that given I fly a mixture of planes with varied levels of GNSS capability, that its probably a good exercise for me also. Both of us will be DR'ing on all legs regardless of who is PIC.

 

I can fly GNSS, and that is pretty much all I have done since obtaining my PPL (although I did revert to paper on one trip).

 

EDIT: Sorry Don, I kinda skipped over a few things you said there.

 

If you look in my flight bag, you will find 2 iPads. I have 2 because it was always my intention to use ozrunways as primary navigation once I completed my PPL.

 

I navigate by map to ground, that is I plot my expected position on the map, then confirm that position by looking at the ground.

 

This trip will be pretty much in WAC, and I hate the E6B. I use a CR-2, its fantastic in the cockpit and it will fit in your top pocket!

 

 

[dsam]

Don, I'm inclined to agree about D.R. un-importance these days.

 

I'm an old dog who loves the new tricks (having happily given up the old methods, though the sextant + chronometer was never my friend).

 

I always fly with 2 iPads with OzRunways, 1 iPhone with OzRunways, 1 Dynon Skyview & autopilot linked to 2 independently powered GPS receivers, 1 SPOT tracker, and 1 GPS enabled PLB.

 

If some (unlikely) massive solar storm wiped out all Nav satellites, I'd know it right away, because all independent devices would stop tracking simultaneously. But at least I'd know exactly where I was when it happened, and still land at my intended airfield, since my maps remain available on multiple screens.

 

I love the situational awareness that comes from modern Nav devices, including the little ADS-B Pi receiver that links into my iPad with OzRunways to show other traffic.

 

Having real-time weather, traffic, glide range, QNH, frequencies, live restricted airspace info, nearest aerodrome, winds aloft, etc. all at my fingertips is very empowering. Cockpit workload is considerably reduced.

 

My eyes are allowed to remain mostly outside the cockpit, scanning for unreported traffic, or just enjoying the beautiful scenery.

 

Perhaps the dead reckoning exercise is a comforting nostalgic link with aviation's past, but like you, I'm happy to use the best tools at my disposal to ensure my safety, and the responsible enjoyment of flying in this vast, spectacular country.

 

Happy flying!