PPL via RPL or direct

[ian00798]

Save yourself the test fee, do the PPL test straight away, and spend the $1000 you save on a retrac and csu endorsement. You will get way more benefit.

 

 

[greybeard]

Find another flight school that isn't trying to force you into spending time and $'s on an intermediate test. Skip the RPL and do the PPL.

 

 

[Pearo]

Find another flight school that isn't trying to force you into spending time and $'s on an intermediate test. Skip the RPL and do the PPL.

Maybe the flight school wants you to pass, and is trying to provide you with the best chances of passing.

 

 

[greybeard]

Maybe the flight school wants you to pass, and is trying to provide you with the best chances of passing.

Have to agree to disagree on this one.

As someone else has suggested, spend the extra money on a csu & retract endorsement. Your regular lessons should be a more than adequate review of your skills. If the OP wasn't intending to get a PPL then fair enough, as they have stated that they are intending to continue to get a PPL, spend the money on gaining extra skills.

 

 

[Pearo]

Have to agree to disagree on this one.As someone else has suggested, spend the extra money on a csu & retract endorsement. Your regular lessons should be a more than adequate review of your skills. If the OP wasn't intending to get a PPL then fair enough, as they have stated that they are intending to continue to get a PPL, spend the money on gaining extra skills.

As I was hinting at earlier, depends on your level of confidence. I would never have passed the PPL without doing the RPL (or GFPT when I started).

 

I was chatting with a couple of my past instructors today, they were talking about how students perform. I asked how I went compared to others and was pleased to hear that I did well. One of the instructors I flew with during my nav's said all the PIC I had as an RPL made a huge difference. They got to know me, and got to know my personality, and they guided me through my training.

 

So what may work for some, may not work for others. Aplund sounds like one of those students that excels and will pass the PPL with ease. I on the other hand was scared of flying on commercial aircraft prior to learning to fly, so I was on the other end of the spectrum. In my case, the RPL provided me with an interim step to gain confidence.

 

Just remember, no to people are the same.

 

 

[ian00798]

Unusual for me to disagree with Pearo, we are generally on the same page, but the standards for the RPL and the PPL are exactly the same, except for a PPL you do navigation and controlled airspace. If the school is worried about you passing a PPL, then they should have the same problem with the RPL component. They won't put you up for a test unless you are ready and meeting the standards. For information, I have put the reference from the manual of standards in a photo below. While these are the published tolerances, brief excursions outside them that are promptly corrected generally won't get you failed, but a requirement of the test is to set attitudes, so if you spend all day going from +149 feet from your nominated height to -149 feet from your nominated height you will still fail even though your within tolerances.

 

 

 

[ian00798]

PIC is the most critical part of flying, you are the one making the decisions, it will always help and the more you can get the better. How much PIC did you have pearo when you did the test?

 

 

[Pearo]

Just checked my logbook, I had 56.3 PIC on the date of the PPL test. Worth noting, that my training was interrupted too, 1st time due to a trail bike crash, second time due to hitting a kangaroo on the road bike! I did my first circuit solo 3 times!

 

I agree that the standards are the same for PPL and RPL, however when it came to doing nav's and the PPL test, simple things like holding alt's and not busting airspace, correctly trimming the aircraft etc where all second nature, leaving me to focus on learning the other parts. This is where it makes a difference. BUT, if you can do all that, and do it well then the RPL step is a waste of time, and some people are just gifted with the skill of flying. I could do all those things, but I had to think about it. Now its motor skill, i just do it and not think about it. As I said earlier, it was a huge confidence builder for me also.

 

 

[ian00798]

Are you going for CPL? 56 hours is a good chunk of PIC for a PPL to have, makes it easier to get exciting aircraft like the C210 etc.

 

 

[ian00798]

RPL makes good sense if your training is done over a long time period, but if your doing a lot of training at once with good consistency, I would just skip it.

 

 

[aplund]

RPL makes good sense if your training is done over a long time period, but if your doing a lot of training at once with good consistency, I would just skip it.

How long is long? My first flight is from the end of Nov last year. Had 2-3 flights each week over most of December. Slightly less in January. My plan was to be done by the middle of this year, but stuff got in the way and now having AAA disappear doesn't seem to have helped. One flight a week is what I want my minimum to be until I finish. Clearly not "full time", but it seems to be working out OK for me.

 

 

[Pearo]

Are you going for CPL? 56 hours is a good chunk of PIC for a PPL to have, makes it easier to get exciting aircraft like the C210 etc.

Nope, purely pleasure here. Too late for me to make a career out of it and there is not enough money in it any more. What I am aiming for, is 206/210 experience (low wing is no good for me with my leg) and an IR so I can do angel flights. I have about 60 hours left before I qualify for angel flights

 

How long is long? My first flight is from the end of Nov last year. Had 2-3 flights each week over most of December. Slightly less in January. My plan was to be done by the middle of this year, but stuff got in the way and now having AAA disappear doesn't seem to have helped. One flight a week is what I want my minimum to be until I finish. Clearly not "full time", but it seems to be working out OK for me.

If you are (were) flying 2-3 times a week then you would be correct in assuming RPL is a waste of time. How many nav's were you doing a week though? Numbers are not adding up here. Should be about 10 navs including pre-test, at 2-3 flights a week that is only 3-4 weeks. Time between flights is a killer when training, as I found out.

 

 

[aplund]

If you are (were) flying 2-3 times a week then you would be correct in assuming RPL is a waste of time. How many nav's were you doing a week though? Numbers are not adding up here. Should be about 10 navs including pre-test, at 2-3 flights a week that is only 3-4 weeks. Time between flights is a killer when training, as I found out.

I did have a few extended breaks due to a summer holiday and a work trip. Haven't done a nav since a couple of weeks before Easter. It was generally about 1 nav every week or two in Feb and march. General handing in Nov and December was when I was getting up to 4 a week in.

 

 

[ian00798]

I find with navs you can really do a lot of ground preparation that will save a lot of air time. Pick a random place, even if you just point somewhere on a map with your eyes closed, then plan the flight to there. Do the whole lot, including heading calculations, get the weather, notams etc. then fly it in your head. What will my radio calls be? When will I make them? Who to? Then do Nav work cycles, error correction cycles, even plan a diversion to really get the process down. Do airways clearances, circuit procedures and everything you would do on an actual flight. The flying up to RPL is basic flying techniques, the how to fly an aircraft. Everything after that, ie IF, Nav, Night etc is just a new set of procedures to learn, the aircraft will always fly the way it did up to RPL, and procedures can be ingrained through ground training.

 

Pearo, what is it for Angel flights? 250 PIC?

 

 

[Robbo]

http://www.angelflight.com/pilots/

 

Valid and current private (or higher) certificate, with class/type ratings and endorsements required for aircraft

 

Instrument rating

 

Valid & current class III or higher medical certificate

 

250 hours pilot in command (PIC) experience

 

25 hours make and model in singles, 75 hours make and model in turbines and twins

 

50 hours as PIC in last 12 months (waived with a flight review or completion of a Wings phase in last 3 months)

 

Liability insurance policy

 

 

[ian00798]

Robbo, that one is actually the US Angel flight website, the Australian requirements aren't quite as strict. Here is the link

 

http://www.angelflight.org.au/Pilots/RegisterQuestion

 

you eligible to join our volunteer team?

 

Do you own an aircraft or have access to private hire (at your own expense)?

 

Is the aircraft VH registered, factory built and assembled, and of a category other than 'Experimental', 'Amateur Built' or 'Warbird'?

 

Do you have in excess of 250 hours Pilot In Command?

 

Do you have at least 10 hours IFR (5 hours VFR) Pilot In Command on the aircraft you will be using?

 

Pearo, I read that as the instrument rating isn't actually required. Still, I would recommend doing it anyway, IF is awesome fun.

 

 

[Robbo]

Robbo, that one is actually the US Angel flight website, the Australian requirements aren't quite as strict. Here is the link http://www.angelflight.org.au/Pilots/RegisterQuestion

 

you eligible to join our volunteer team?

 

Do you own an aircraft or have access to private hire (at your own expense)?

 

Is the aircraft VH registered, factory built and assembled, and of a category other than 'Experimental', 'Amateur Built' or 'Warbird'?

 

Do you have in excess of 250 hours Pilot In Command?

 

Do you have at least 10 hours IFR (5 hours VFR) Pilot In Command on the aircraft you will be using?

 

Pearo, I read that as the instrument rating isn't actually required. Still, I would recommend doing it anyway, IF is awesome fun.

oops.... I googled it without glasses on.

I have actually been involved with Angel Flight since there launch back in 2004 however other commitments have taken over my life and sadly I have not been active since about 2012.

 

 

[ian00798]

I need the coo and time first, I'm at abott t 100 pic with 275 hours total.

 

 

[Pearo]

Midht I add aplund, whilst you are in the descision phase, get solo checked and go do some stuff, even if it's onl

 

Robbo, that one is actually the US Angel flight website, the Australian requirements aren't quite as strict. Here is the linkhttp://www.angelflight.org.au/Pilots/RegisterQuestion

 

you eligible to join our volunteer team?

 

Do you own an aircraft or have access to private hire (at your own expense)?

 

Is the aircraft VH registered, factory built and assembled, and of a category other than 'Experimental', 'Amateur Built' or 'Warbird'?

 

Do you have in excess of 250 hours Pilot In Command?

 

Do you have at least 10 hours IFR (5 hours VFR) Pilot In Command on the aircraft you will be using?

 

Pearo, I read that as the instrument rating isn't actually required. Still, I would recommend doing it anyway, IF is awesome fun.

Not sure how you can have 10 hours IFR with the rating! I am actually going to do night VFR first, which the ATO who did my PPL test recommends. However I have started the study for the IR.

 

 

[rhysmcc]

10 Hours IFR PIC on the aircraft you'll be using.