Savannah S Build Notes - Some Tools

[IBob]

A pair of sidecutters, (the red ones) ground so that the cutting edge sits flush to a flat surface.

 

These are very good for removing rivets when you can get to both sides of the job:

 

First carefully drill off the rivet head with an oversized bit. Then go round the back and take hold of the rivet, flush to the sheet metal, with the sidecutters. No need to squeeze hard, you're not trying to cut it off.

 

Now rotate the rivet a little in the hole and it will generally come out very easily.

 

I read about this method early in my build, and it's so easy I wish I'd ground the cutters then too!

 

 

[MajorTom]

Since then, I have again wanted A3 countersink rivets (at the fittings for the mixer inspection hatch). This time I made my own, and if there should be a next time, I would also use them at the Fin.I would not do this for 'structural' rivets: in each case, these rivets are holding anchor nuts or the like from rotating. Once those nuts or fittings are done up, the rivets are not under load.

Stupid question I guess, but are there many anchor nuts used in the savannah? What about rivet nuts istead?

 

 

[IBob]

Stupid question I guess, but are there many anchor nuts used in the savannah? What about rivet nuts istead?

No such thing as stupid question here, MajorTom.

There are a variety of fasteners in the Savannah, rivet nuts, anchor nuts and proprietary Camlock or Dzus.

 

The rivet nuts are aluminium and used on inspection covers. I chose to screw rather than rivet the fuel tank covers on the underside of the wings, so bought more for that.

 

The anchor nuts are steel and offer a physically much larger bearing surface (so would be stronger than rivnuts, size for size). They are used when bolting fin to fuselage. I bought some more for fastening my strobes to the (fiberglass) wingtips. They come in many shapes, both 'fixed' and 'floating', (which is where the threaded part is captive but can move laterally to help with alignment). They look handy, I bought a couple of sizes of 'floating' while I was at it.

 

The Camlock and Dzus, which are both half-turn types, are used on covers that will be opened more frequently.

 

 

[MajorTom]

Thanks Bob,

 

that is very helpfull and good explained.

 

I have to catch up with the vokabulary a lot. It's quiet a difference to follow a conversation on everyday business or tech stuff, like this.

 

But ist challenging and fun too.

 

Hope to hear often from you, in the next couple of months ;-)

 

 

[dan tonner]

Hello IBob;

 

Would it be presumptive of me to say "Hi Bob?

 

I will be spending 10 weeks or so in North Palmerston between now and the middle of April and would be interested in getting together for a cuppa. I've been following your thread with interest and have admired your tenacity and resourcefulness. I would love to see the results.

 

If interested, give me a shout at [email protected] and I'll share a few more details about my trip to the other side.

 

All the best;

 

Dan

 

 

[M61A1]

Stupid question I guess, but are there many anchor nuts used in the savannah? What about rivet nuts istead?

Another good reason to use anchor nuts(nut plates)is that rivnuts are prone to "spinning" , especially in thin material, and usually at the worst possible time. The only place to use rivnuts is when you only have access to one side.

Give me anchor nuts anytime

 

 

[IBob]

More bits & pieces:

 

Cheap vice with DIY softjaws

 

 

[IBob]

...cheap set of metric pin punches.

 

The one on top is 4mm and I have tapered the end. It makes a great podger for the A5 rivets, as suggested here by Mark many months ago.

 

 

[IBob]

Half decent set of metric drills, for aircraft use only.

 

I have the usual sad DIY assortment of drills, with the one you really want always broken or missing. Decent drills aren't cheap (and the cheap ones are rubbish), I put this off for a while. So they are another thing I wish I'd bought sooner.

 

 

[IBob]

Cheap automatic centrepunch. No hammer required, just press it down until it goes click (or clunk), so one-handed use.

 

Get an adjustable one, this one adjusts by turning the knob. Most of them are made for use on steel, so a bit brutal for aluminium. I took this one to bits and modified the springs for softer action.

 

 

[IBob]

DIY stand for spray gun...

 

 

[IBob]

The very cheapest drill press I could buy.

 

Yes, it's rubbish. But it works fine in this environment, and helps me drill/clean/countersink holes with real accuracy where I need to.

 

 

[IBob]

Not the cheapest compressor, but I've been really happy with this:

 

190cfm, plenty of capacity for both riveting and spraying, only cycles on occasionally when riveting.

 

Belt drive for quiet operation: direct drive compressors (or the ones I have heard) make a horrible noise.

 

 

 

[IBob]

....and essential pinups. I need much more of these.

 

 

 

[MajorTom]

Just wondering, what tools do I need to buy. Some things seem to be nonexistend on the german market.

 

Do I need a Rivet Squeeser? (tried to put this a search into the german ebay and amazon page... no result...)

 

 

[rmorton]

Hi Major Tom,

 

I found this site very useful:

 

Zyozyo

 

He bought some of his tooling from :

 

Pince à riveter à levier VADIUM

 

There is also a link to a Sketchup model of a Savannah which is great for trying out colour schemes.

 

Hope that helps

 

 

[IBob]

Just wondering, what tools do I need to buy. Some things seem to be nonexistend on the german market.Do I need a Rivet Squeeser? (tried to put this a search into the german ebay and amazon page... no result...)

The hand rivet squeeze is used only for the trailing edges of all the flying surfaces.

These can be done at any time (although it's less handling to do the wings while they are on the bench) so not having the squeeze does not hold up the build in any way. I did all my flying surfaces at the same time, on completion of the wings.

 

They are quite cheap from outlets like Aircraft Spruce.

 

HAND RIVET SQUEEZER from Aircraft Spruce

 

However, I borrowed a set from a local LAME.

 

I then bought the snap (the die that goes in the squeeze) to fit the rivets as specified in the manual.

 

I then found that the rivets supplied were different (did not fit the snap), and having watched others with a lot more experience than myself try to use them, I purchased 1/4lb (love those imperial measures!) of the rivets as specified in the manual. They cost very little, and 1/4lb is probably enough for 2 Savannahs.

 

I then drilled some scrap and put in a few practise rivets while setting up the squeeze (you set up how far it squeezes).

 

Having done all that, and worked out how to use the bench edge as a guide for aligning the squeeze (as described elsewhere), the setting of these rivets went very easily.

 

I am very happy with the result (perfectly straight trailing edges and all rivets appear identical) and found this part most enjoyable.

 

(If I was doing this again, I would buy shorter rivets, as well as the specified rivets. I think the length as specified is only necessary at the rudder TE, where there is an insert between the skins, with trim tab. All other TEs are just 2 skins joining, and a shorter rivet would give a neater finish still.)

 

PS. If you buy a set, get them with a deep enough throat to work at the rudder trim tab. The rivets are set in 45mm from the TE of the trim tab.

 

 

[rmorton]

It has been a very long day so I havent had time to update my other posts. So here is what I found in the box when I opened it up. There is a stranger set of pliers (you need to tighten them yourself) 10 silver, ten black and 30 copper clekos, as well as a rather nice looking rivet gun. Wading through the manuel, well the first few pages you need to either buy or make a solid rivet squeezer. I am not so sure that I can find a pair of pliers with a long enough throat for the job so will probably make an order to aircraft spruce and top up the clekos at the same time.

 

 

 

[IBob]

It has been a very long day so I havent had time to update my other posts. So here is what I found in the box when I opened it up. There is a stranger set of pliers (you need to tighten them yourself) 10 silver, ten black and 30 copper clekos, as well as a rather nice looking rivet gun. Wading through the manuel, well the first few pages you need to either buy or make a solid rivet squeezer. I am not so sure that I can find a pair of pliers with a long enough throat for the job so will probably make an order to aircraft spruce and top up the clekos at the same time.[ATTACH]47978[/ATTACH]

Oh, you found the 'pliers'......

My suggestion would be to buy or borrow a proper rivet squeeze: the idea of making your own is a bit of a joke for several reasons, (though anything is possible).

 

You'll also need to buy the correct die/snap to go in the squeeze. This is dished to fit the curve of the rivet head correctly. And also buy the correct rivets (I was able to do that locally).

 

The rivet spec (which will tell you what die/snap to buy) is in the very first part of the manual, with all the general info on rivets and bolts.

 

 

[IBob]

More on solid riveting here:

 

Savannah S Build Notes - Wing Nose Skin and Closure

 

 

[MajorTom]

10 silver, ten black and 30 copper clekos

So, we will need a lot more. Unfortunaly aircraftsruce.eu just incresed der price for copper clecos from 0,80 to 0,88 € .... grrrrrrr

Also had no luck, with me calling some former builders. There seems to be kind of a intimat relationship between builder and cleco, that is bound for eternity....

 

So, what about my offer to share a shipping of best US-made clecos from browntools.com ???

 

Can you put your brand new 50 clecos on a kitchenscale and tell me the weight?

 

 

[rmorton]

I hadn't noticed the price hike! Yes of course we can share I can place an order now if you like. 695gr for 50. where in Germany are you?

 

 

[MajorTom]

 

I'm wondering if this will work for deburring.

 

After a long fruitless, search I found some 2 and 3 inch scotch bright weels.

 

The angle drilling machine (don't know how you call it in english) is 900 rpm.

 

 

[IBob]

[ATTACH]48006[/ATTACH]I'm wondering if this will work for deburring.

After a long fruitless, search I found some 2 and 3 inch scotch bright weels.

 

The angle drilling machine (don't know how you call it in english) is 900 rpm.

In English that is an angle grinder. You may find it easier (and quieter) to use a bench grinder, either that or fasten the angle grinder to the bench in some way so that it cannot move?

You can also buy the (red) scotchbrite pads, and use them by hand.

 

There is some fairly detailed conversation around deburring earlier in this thread, starting about here:

 

Savannah S Build Notes - Some Tools

 

 

[Nobody]

I posted about my deburing on my RV-12 previously but here is a bit more detail. It is a 3 step process.

 

First step in with a smooth file to remove the punch marks from making the item. I run the file along the edge but holding the file at about 45 degrees to the edge. It is usually only 5 or 10passes with the file, less if the piece is thin

 

The second step is to use emery paper of about 180 grit to remove the file marks, again along the edge. I used a timber block by hand and again it is only a few passes.

 

Final step depends on the pieces size. For small pieces I use a bench grinder with a scotch rite wheel. You can get these in different hardness but you want a fairly soft one. Mine is 150mm diameter and 25mm wide and works well,

 

http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3M/en_US/3MIndustrial/Abrasives/Products/~/Scotch-Brite-EXL-Deburring-Wheel?N=7581697+3293241548&rt=rud

 

For large pieces I use a pneumatic die grinder with a smaller wheel similar to the one on the bench grinder. This is done on large sheets that are too big to use the bench Grinder on as well as lightening holes that you can't get the big wheel inside.

 

An RV- 12 uses 2024-t3 aluminum and not the 6000 series that I think the Savannah uses. The 2024-t3 is stronger but less tolerant to defects and scratches from a fatigue point of view and so the deburing and finish is important. It is actually very quick when you get organized and you can do a lot of parts in an hour or two.