turboplanner Posted September 11, 2016 Posted September 11, 2016 There would have been more creibility to the snipers if they had stood for position. 100 candidates; that would have been exciting!
gandalph Posted September 11, 2016 Posted September 11, 2016 As expected, the usual porch dogs yapping away at a result they don't like. All noise no ticker! If the vote turn out was around the 1000 mark, as some have suggested, then that is a disappointing figure, but it is still the democratic choice of those who made the effort to vote. Hopefully the naysayers scan get over it and let the elected board get on with it. Am I being overly hopeful with that? 1 1
Keith Page Posted September 11, 2016 Posted September 11, 2016 Can't help viewing that the email concerning the voting results was targeted at promoting OZ-Kosh and the election results,(The most important thing to the operation and being of Raaus) were tacked on as an afterthought. Seems to me that the Elected Directors are just "Something" you have to have. Interesting wording also: The Chairman announced............. He also thanked all 10 candidates.......... But where was the congratulations to the Successful Candidates who were put there by the members ?????? Ummmmm...May be not the planned election result? Regards, KP 1
Keith Page Posted September 11, 2016 Posted September 11, 2016 Hopefully the knockers will go silently away and let the majority vote rule, Apparantly very few are upset enough (with the issues KP keeps on about) to even vote.Wheres the conspiracy theories about the vote and how it was run? I do believe there are a great number who have given up caring, they are just hoping things will keep on happening so they can fly. I do hope they do not do silly things. KP 1 3
Admin Posted September 11, 2016 Posted September 11, 2016 I do believe there are a great number who have given up caring, they are just hoping things will keep on happening so they can fly.I do hope they do not do silly things. KP +1
gandalph Posted September 11, 2016 Posted September 11, 2016 I do believe there are a great number who have given up caring, they are just hoping things will keep on happening so they can fly.I do hope they do not do silly things. KP Post removed - Mod 1 1
Happyflyer Posted September 11, 2016 Posted September 11, 2016 I do believe there are a great number who have given up caring, they are just hoping things will keep on happening so they can fly.I do hope they do not do silly things. KP You are right about people not caring. Most pilots I speak to have no idea and no interest in the goings on with RAAus board and management. They just want to fly. I don't know how you can change that. Maybe they think RAAus is too big to fail. If things got out of hand maybe CASA would simply take over. 3 1
Geoff13 Posted September 12, 2016 Posted September 12, 2016 Most people just want to fly their planes. To be quite honest why would anyone even want to show an interest in the governance of RAA. 5 minutes on this forum will convince anyone with an interest that if they put their hand up they would be painting a target in the middle of there own back. The Ulysses club, a member based organisation with over 30,000 member, normally get between 400 and 500 to the AGM to have their say in the running of the club, so 1000 out of our membership is a pretty good turnout in the big scheme of things. The board can only call for nominations, the interested members vote on those nominations, once that has happened we really do then need to do what the majority of intested members voted for. 3
facthunter Posted September 12, 2016 Posted September 12, 2016 IF the Ullyses Club ceased to exist all those people could still ride their motorcycles, so it's not comparable . HOW the RAAus and the CASA behave has EVERYTHING to do with how and IF you will fly and whether it's worth flying for enjoyment. There's never been a more important time to get involved with making things better in the U/L scene in this country. Heard that one? Think It can't get worse? People thought that last year AND the year before and the year before. etc More crap and complexity and no surety of improvement. NOT GOOD ENOUGH. Nev 9 1
storchy neil Posted September 12, 2016 Posted September 12, 2016 how about questions on notice to the next AGM do they have to be heard neil 1 1
facthunter Posted September 12, 2016 Posted September 12, 2016 There has to be a process for that important function. What about a POLICY manifest or manual? IF you don't have Known policies, what are your aims? Nev
Bruce Tuncks Posted September 13, 2016 Posted September 13, 2016 keeping CASA off our backs is a good policy. Is it not bizarre that our recreational activity is subject to such oppression? You can go mountain climbing or white-water rafting or fast-food eating without semi-police bossing you in detail. Its my life and I don't want to be policed, even in the nanny way. If I want to climb a ladder, I want to accept the risk all by myself. Alas, RAAus must work within the law of the land and I'm grateful for them dealing with CASA on my behalf. I would get too angry too quickly to do it myself. Not that all CASA people are bad, its their assignment to police my recreational activity that I hate. 3
turboplanner Posted September 13, 2016 Posted September 13, 2016 keeping CASA off our backs is a good policy. Is it not bizarre that our recreational activity is subject to such oppression?You can go mountain climbing or white-water rafting or fast-food eating without semi-police bossing you in detail. Its my life and I don't want to be policed, even in the nanny way. If I want to climb a ladder, I want to accept the risk all by myself. Alas, RAAus must work within the law of the land and I'm grateful for them dealing with CASA on my behalf. I would get too angry too quickly to do it myself. Not that all CASA people are bad, its their assignment to police my recreational activity that I hate. CASA are entitled to police their airspace and step in if the self administering body stuffs up. The key to retaining your freedomn is to have a good self administering body. 6
Yenn Posted September 13, 2016 Posted September 13, 2016 Nev. Aren't the policies what is spelled out in the constitution? If they are we still don't know what is supposed to happen.
facthunter Posted September 13, 2016 Posted September 13, 2016 Not the way I understand it Yenn . There used to be a policy manual and a way of forming policies based on members wishes and known needs. Anything in a constitution would be general... about the organisational structure more than immediate aims or tasks. Nev
rick-p Posted September 16, 2016 Posted September 16, 2016 I do believe there are a great number who have given up caring, they are just hoping things will keep on happening so they can fly.I do hope they do not do silly things. KP I do believe there are a great number who have given up caring, they are just hoping things will keep on happening so they can fly.I do hope they do not do silly things. KP 1
Keith Page Posted September 16, 2016 Posted September 16, 2016 [ATTACH=full]45790[/ATTACH] Ummmm.! Very interesting Rick-P I just wonder how gandalph will reply to me. A very interesting post. Looks like the beginning of big happenings. KP
rick-p Posted September 16, 2016 Posted September 16, 2016 Ummmm.! Very interesting Rick-P I just wonder how gandalph will reply to me.A very interesting post. Looks like the beginning of big happenings. KP Great things have through history arisen due to competition, it has given people a choice and hopefully kept the different camps honest. It's no different to the choices we make as to which brand motor vehicle we wish to run with. Competition is healthy for the consumer and we should never forget that otherwise to allow a monopoly in any area of consumerism will always only see an increase in the cost of a product with declining services by the provider as we are seeing at this time in the area of sports aviation. Safety is paramount and value for money is essential. Self interested squabbling is not an option or luxury for those at the helm they are there to provide the best possible outcomes for the industry, not for themselves. The days of rubber stamp credentials need to be behind us this is a business and needs to be run and managed as a business in order that the customers of the business get the best service and product available at any given point in time, namely that they get the best bang for their buck without having to worry about politics but just enjoy their flying. 3 2 1
Oscar Posted September 17, 2016 Posted September 17, 2016 Obviously, competition has significant advantages for the consumer (though one would have to examine the Banking Sector to form a true picture of just how much advantage there IS to 'the consumer' when 'competition' is in fact nothing more than varnish used to blur the vision of a hegemony). In the case of RAA, you have an intensely technical regime requiring strict performance. Let's be realistic: things like the magazine, (which is frankly pitched at the level of intelligence of an in-flight brochure), and fly-ins ( which can be very, very well-managed by local Flying Clubs) do not need need a multi-$M organisation. However, adherence to the applicable regulations to flying an aircraft in Australia, DOES need a high-level of technical expertise. Neither RAA nor AUF nor SAA have had the opportunity to contribute to the development of the regulations since HORSCOT - and there are very, very few people indeed in this country who have a comprehensive understanding of those regulations. There were two; one died several years ago and the other has responded to being invited to far cough by the owner of a popular Aviation web-site by doing just that. So: let us fantasise for a moment, about an alternative, competitive service to RAA. The actual mechanical processing of such things as registration, is not difficult - but from where does one source the expertise to ensure that the regulatory requirements are being met? You'd need people with experience of the regs. as imposed by CASA and as implemented by RAA. Now, the only people NOT already in RAA who have - ostensibly - some claim to such expertise would be those who are 'on the outer' with RAA at the moment. Not to put too fine a point upon it: Sergeant Runciman's Rejects Ragtime Band - which has briefly (and laughably) put its head above the trenches from a hangar in Bundy, only to demonstrate several times that it retains its unparalleled ability to fail to get anything done because of its ineptitude. Would you place any faith in that mob, to keep you flying legally? The same crew that gave you the mega-colossal registration screw-up? The failure to organise continuation of the Insurance? Membership number falsification? A massive Financial Control FAIL? Give me a break - that would be equivalent to giving Alexander Haigh control of the re-run of the Western Front battle.. So far, I have seen no better alternative to RAA as it currently stands to serve my modest flying ambitions. I have an open mind to any realistic alternative, but it will have to be way more realistic and believable than the Bundy Hangar Clown's Co-Opertative. 2 1
ave8rr Posted September 17, 2016 Posted September 17, 2016 So far, I have seen no better alternative to RAA as it currently stands to serve my modest flying ambitions. I have an open mind to any realistic alternative, but it will have to be way more realistic and believable than the Bundy Hangar Clown's Co-Opertative. Oscar, I operate from Bundy and am not aware of any "Bundy Hangar Clowns Co-Operative" There was talk a year or two back of a group forming a breakaway organisation. There were two schools in Bundy. One (single CFI) operation which still exists and the other has not been operating for many months with equipment either on the market or sold. 2
coljones Posted September 17, 2016 Posted September 17, 2016 Great things have through history arisen due to competition, it has given people a choice and hopefully kept the different camps honest. It's no different to the choices we make as to which brand motor vehicle we wish to run with. Competition is healthy for the consumer and we should never forget that otherwise to allow a monopoly in any area of consumerism will always only see an increase in the cost of a product with declining services by the provider as we are seeing at this time in the area of sports aviation. Safety is paramount and value for money is essential. Self interested squabbling is not an option or luxury for those at the helm they are there to provide the best possible outcomes for the industry, not for themselves. The days of rubber stamp credentials need to be behind us this is a business and needs to be run and managed as a business in order that the customers of the business get the best service and product available at any given point in time, namely that they get the best bang for their buck without having to worry about politics but just enjoy their flying. When Optus refuses, under the protection of ACCC, in your little corner of the world, and the monopoly provider is prevented from offering a service at a fair price what are you going to do? pat yourself on the back and say "fantastic - competition had delivered me bugger all" Competition is not the universal panacea, markets are not perfect and occasional, where orderly markets are thin and the players are disproportionate then a managed monopoly may be the only solution. We live in a society, markets should aid society not destroy it. 2 1
kaz3g Posted September 17, 2016 Posted September 17, 2016 100 candidates; that would have been exciting! Unfortunately, Turbs, it seems highly unlikely that there will ever be a surfeit of nominations for a job which brings no financial rewards and not much appreciation, either. How quickly we forget the freeze on registrations, the difficulties with individual aircraft types, and the very distinct possibility that CASA would close down the whole shebang. Only 10% of members even bothered to vote so perhaps the only logical conclusion that can be drawn is that the other 90% are satisfied with the outcome. The alternative is that they are all apathetic and that couldn't be right....could it? Kaz 1 5
DrZoos Posted September 17, 2016 Posted September 17, 2016 Must admit, i didn't vote, because i knew very little about any of them. I will in the future, but was too snowed under so left it to better informed parties. Id love a video next time where they get 2 minutes to tell us what they stand for...
coljones Posted September 17, 2016 Posted September 17, 2016 Must admit, i didn't vote, because i knew very little about any of them. I will in the future, but was too snowed under so left it to better informed parties.Id love a video next time where they get 2 minutes to tell us what they stand for... Better informed doesn't mean capable of making a sensible decision. You have to trust yourself and vote for the ones who you trust most or against those you trust the least. 1
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