cooperplace Posted October 29, 2016 Posted October 29, 2016 does anyone know anything about this: Another Jab engine failure... - PPRuNe Forums not reported yet on this forum; at Wagga reportedly.
kasper Posted October 29, 2016 Posted October 29, 2016 does anyone know anything about this:Another Jab engine failure... - PPRuNe Forums not reported yet on this forum; at Wagga reportedly. Interesting. Jab in a paddock and it's already reported as an engine failure ... there are lots of reasons to be in a paddock that are not engine failure and whilst it is more likely than not engine related the posting on pprune already on that thread are horrific to and about the rep of the engine even before they know the cause!
Old Koreelah Posted October 29, 2016 Posted October 29, 2016 i regret opening up that link. Some mindless people don't seem to want our country to have an aircraft industry. They don't seem to care if Jabiru goes the way of Victa and gawd knows how many other local manufacturers. 2 2 1
turboplanner Posted October 29, 2016 Posted October 29, 2016 Interesting. Jab in a paddock and it's already reported as an engine failure ... there are lots of reasons to be in a paddock that are not engine failure and whilst it is more likely than not engine related the posting on pprune already on that thread are horrific to and about the rep of the engine even before they know the cause! He probably didn't just park for a p break; two RPT diverted to look for him and an RA AC went up from Wagga.
frank marriott Posted October 29, 2016 Posted October 29, 2016 Don't worry the DH uninformed comments will start here as well shortly. 4
kasper Posted October 29, 2016 Posted October 29, 2016 He probably didn't just park for a p break; two RPT diverted to look for him and an RA AC went up from Wagga. And whilst it quite probably was engine related there have been fuel management outages that have occurred and Ed a prop goes you go down as well. I never even intimated that he parked there. I am just incredibly saddened that it's instantly engine failure and not a single second in either the report or any of the posts to consider either other options or consider it was put down in a paddock and the pilot walked out. It's a successful outlanding that is immediately presented as an engine failure and linked up with a heap of 'jokey' tar brushing of the entire jabiru engine 3
turboplanner Posted October 29, 2016 Posted October 29, 2016 I wouldn't get too excited about it; just the usual prune subjects gnashing their teeth 1 1
billwoodmason Posted October 29, 2016 Posted October 29, 2016 The same crap went on here for years unabated from certain members - thankfully it stopped in the main following CASA introducing their ill informed instrument. 1 6
turboplanner Posted October 29, 2016 Posted October 29, 2016 Well, everyone can settle down now; the pilot has reported on prune that it was a maintenance issue, not a mechanical fault. 1 1
cooperplace Posted October 29, 2016 Author Posted October 29, 2016 on pprune the pilot reported that "On climb out, the engine rapidly, and without herald, powered down to approx. zero thrust." ..... we'll all be interested to know the cause. He did well to land it uneventfully. 1
Deskpilot Posted October 30, 2016 Posted October 30, 2016 Had it been a Cessna, Piper, Mooney or any other GA aircraft, I wonder what would have been said. Also, how much would it have cost and how long would it have taken to recover such planes. Indeed, would they all survive the out-landing at all? Tough birds those Jabirus. Flew again within the week. 1 3
turboplanner Posted October 30, 2016 Posted October 30, 2016 Had it been a Cessna, Piper, Mooney or any other GA aircraft, I wonder what would have been said. Also, how much would it have cost and how long would it have taken to recover such planes. Indeed, would they all survive the out-landing at all? Tough birds those Jabirus.[ATTACH]46591[/ATTACH] Flew again within the week. Yes they would all have survived that forced landing. It's not often you have to recover one, but the wings come off much the same, and in either case, close to the field it wouldn't be unusual for them to comeback on a tilt tray with the wings on.
Litespeed Posted October 30, 2016 Posted October 30, 2016 Had it been a Cessna, Piper, Mooney or any other GA aircraft, I wonder what would have been said. Also, how much would it have cost and how long would it have taken to recover such planes. Indeed, would they all survive the out-landing at all? Tough birds those Jabirus.[ATTACH]46591[/ATTACH] Flew again within the week. A Jabiru is in my mind- when it all goes to shit- the little aircraft to be in. Yes a GA machine might survive a outlanding and flip on to its roof - but the damage bill will be substantial. And given the higher speeds and heavier weight- the pilot might be expected to have more injuries. A Jabiru is one of the toughest things in the air- very hard to kill. Should have called it the Wombat- the native tank. Even when smashed they are easily repaired. As for the humans inside- we have all seen lots of incidents which the software survives, when many other designs would have meant a fatal. The fatalities in a Jabiru have been few and normally involve forces that our bodies just aren't designed to survive. If I had to pick a machine to be in when it goes bad- A Jabiru would be very high on the list. If I wanted to run a experimental new engine in a airframe- I would always pick a Jabiru. Then I would feel confident I had a strong beast- up to the rigours of a unknown engine. Jabiru- tough Aussie wildlife. 3 3
motzartmerv Posted October 30, 2016 Posted October 30, 2016 Lol, some of the jokes in that thread are creative and quite funny. Lots of places to put down out near Wagga. Good on the PIC for pulling off a successful forced landing. 2
brilin_air Posted October 31, 2016 Posted October 31, 2016 What a bunch of mindless idiots pprune keyboard warriors are. The pilot got it right. Jabiru bashing is sooooo yesterday. -Linda 3
Yenn Posted November 1, 2016 Posted November 1, 2016 3 days old and nobody bashing Jab engines. A pity it has taken so long for this to happen and the bashers have just about killed off another aviation industry in Australia. 2
SDQDI Posted November 1, 2016 Posted November 1, 2016 3 days old and nobody bashing Jab engines. A pity it has taken so long for this to happen and the bashers have just about killed off another aviation industry in Australia. Blaming the Bashers for killing jabs reputation is a bit fanciful IMO. I think you will find though that most Bashers think CASA has been a bit harsh hence the lightening off of the criticism in recent times. 3 2
Frankus1aust Posted November 1, 2016 Posted November 1, 2016 I would like to know the real story around the Jab engine and the clumsy CASA action. No doubt there is a little both ways here but names at CASA need to be named. If this agency coughs, GA gets the flu. This has been going for a long time and it is time for a real reform of CASA as far as GA is concerned. CASA seem to be masters of "overtaking the Minister" or at least maintaining their own patch and agenda. Am I just being cranky? Anyone else want to throw some enlightenment into the pile?
turboplanner Posted November 1, 2016 Posted November 1, 2016 I would like to know the real story around the Jab engine and the clumsy CASA action. No doubt there is a little both ways here but names at CASA need to be named. If this agency coughs, GA gets the flu. This has been going for a long time and it is time for a real reform of CASA as far as GA is concerned. CASA seem to be masters of "overtaking the Minister" or at least maintaining their own patch and agenda. Am I just being cranky? Anyone else want to throw some enlightenment into the pile? Frank us, if you have a reasonable interest, just contact the Sports Aviation section of CASA, and I would expect you will get a clear answer. 1 2
Keith Page Posted November 1, 2016 Posted November 1, 2016 I would like to know the real story around the Jab engine and the clumsy CASA action. No doubt there is a little both ways here but names at CASA need to be named. If this agency coughs, GA gets the flu. This has been going for a long time and it is time for a real reform of CASA as far as GA is concerned. CASA seem to be masters of "overtaking the Minister" or at least maintaining their own patch and agenda. Am I just being cranky? Anyone else want to throw some enlightenment into the pile? Little interest for you Frankus.. Have a personal enquiry and broaden your terms of reference to what you have suggested above. Confirm where the individuals collected/gathered/caused to receive the information. Who collected/gathered/caused to receive this information you will be surprised as to the origin. KP 1 1
Frankus1aust Posted November 1, 2016 Posted November 1, 2016 Frank us, if you have a reasonable interest, just contact the Sports Aviation section of CASA, and I would expect you will get a clear answer. I will give this a look. 1
Jaba-who Posted November 2, 2016 Posted November 2, 2016 Frank us, if you have a reasonable interest, just contact the Sports Aviation section of CASA, and I would expect you will get a clear answer. FT, I'm assuming you're being cynical. Frankus when the real stuff was being flung around many of us asked CASA for the real story ( myself included) and for the data, the source etc. In the beginning we were completely fobbed off. I didn't even get an acknowledgement of my initial enquiries from CASA. In fact the only response I ever got was from the senator who grilled Mark Skidmore and his mate. Later as the excrement was flying off the fan ( and the noise started getting into senate enquiry territory), CASA started to release information but often only after FOI demands and then only in drips and drabs of selected data. Only when that selected data was shown to be suspect the restrictions started to be lifted. The head honcho resigned but the public servants who really run the show stayed on. ( Mark Skidmore stated at his penultimate public appearance as the CEO that he was unable to control the senior public servants in CASA ) So now that the Jabiru fiasco is winding down I suspect that you or anyone will be even less able to get anything out of CASA. They will be hunkered down, watching their backs ( and jobs) waiting for it all to go away. 2
Frankus1aust Posted November 2, 2016 Posted November 2, 2016 FT, I'm assuming you're being cynical.Frankus when the real stuff was being flung around many of us asked CASA for the real story ( myself included) and for the data, the source etc. In the beginning we were completely fobbed off. I didn't even get an acknowledgement of my initial enquiries from CASA. In fact the only response I ever got was from the senator who grilled Mark Skidmore and his mate. Later as the excrement was flying off the fan ( and the noise started getting into senate enquiry territory), CASA started to release information but often only after FOI demands and then only in drips and drabs of selected data. Only when that selected data was shown to be suspect the restrictions started to be lifted. The head honcho resigned but the public servants who really run the show stayed on. ( Mark Skidmore stated at his penultimate public appearance as the CEO that he was unable to control the senior public servants in CASA ) So now that the Jabiru fiasco is winding down I suspect that you or anyone will be even less able to get anything out of CASA. They will be hunkered down, watching their backs ( and jobs) waiting for it all to go away. Thanks for the reply. looking at the CASA website this is all I can find... the reference to the "Relief for Jabiru engine limitations. Jabiru engine limitation relief | Civil Aviation Safety Authority I can't find anything else by way of back story, stats qualification or process. I saw the Mr Skidmore YouTube Senate Committee discussions and I was totally underwhelmed. It is like a piece of string sticking out from under a curtain. On the other end there might be anything from a mouse to an elephant. If this process is how CASA comes to a decisions that affects the livelihood of industry sectors, I would be hoping to see more rigor and professionalism. From my limited view, looking at the incident reports at the time I couldn't see the need for a blanket ban on the engines, just the appropriate A/D's and some public awareness campaign for people tampering with their own engines. If this is how CASA works more broadly, by decree/whim/fiat/prejudice etc, time for a real review. Starting at the people and process behind the Jab engine ban. If there is nothing in it, their position and cred is strengthened. 1
turboplanner Posted November 2, 2016 Posted November 2, 2016 I will give this a look. Frankus, did you contact one of the CASA Sports Administration guys like I recommended before you wrote post #23?
Frankus1aust Posted November 2, 2016 Posted November 2, 2016 Frankus, did you contact one of the CASA Sports Administration guys like I recommended before you wrote post #23? Thanks Turboplanner, I couldn't find any reference on the website apart from the Engine limitation relief report. This team on the link, who do you suggest it the appropriate person to contact re the Jabiru engine history? CASA’s role in sport aviation | Civil Aviation Safety Authority
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