turboplanner Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 All this legal talk and litigation and liability and so forth,,,,,,Makes me wonder how many aircraft and pilots are dropping off the register with raa, because of frustration with the system and are going back to the old days anyway and flying around their own patch in that little plane that they lovingly maintain and pander ,as they have safely been doing for many years,..And are just saying #$^^#@them if they want to sue /prosecute me ,well go ahead,,getting anything out off a stone or pensioner with bugger all assets to lose,will be a challenge for them and if they threaten jail time ,,,,,Well so be it i,ll probably be eating better then I am now and wont have to worry about the power bills etc ,,,,,,,,lol,,,,,clear prop.................. You don't want to cross over to the criminal side bull. Thousands of RA aviators are flying legal and covering themselves with adequate PL insurance without making a Federal case out of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 You don't want to cross over to the criminal side bull. Thousands of RA aviators are flying legal and covering themselves with adequate PL insurance without making a Federal case out of it. criminal side ???? it,s not illegal to ride a trail bike on private property and no rego or licence is required,,,whats the difference Turb,s??And I think trail bike riding has a much larger accident rate than the little planes flying around the patch,,i now I,m more scared to go for a ride then go for a fly!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 criminal side ???? it,s not illegal to ride a trail bike on private property and no rego or licence is required,,,whats the difference Turb,s?? Culpable negligence is roughly when you know you are doing something wrong but you still do it. So if you get a ski full then take a mate on the pillion seat, you're likely to be charged. You may even have a problem if you just injure someone on the unreg/unlucky bike if you're sober. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonRamsay Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 VH regoed ,,yes but under the same guidelines set down by casa for raa, without the empire building of raa, mr ramsay......... Good luck with that. Would you call that a "level playing field"? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blueadventures Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 As I recall glider pilots are offered a licence under part 60 that is ICAO compliant so that pilots can do their stuff overseas - as it is with the RPL and PPL.www.casa.gov.au/standard-page/licence-types Thats absolutely correct. I have mine. Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 Good luck with that.Would you call that a "level playing field"? A level playing field is only required if you are playing the same game mr ramsay,,,,,,,,,,ultralight flying and GA flying ARE not the same game ,as per the original reason the AUF was formed in the first place,i,m sure hockey players would not like to play the game by the rules of golf and vice verser,,,,but both games are hitting a little ball with a stick ah................ 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 Culpable negligence is roughly when you know you are doing something wrong but you still do it. So if you get a ski full then take a mate on the pillion seat, you're likely to be charged. You may even have a problem if you just injure someone on the unreg/unlucky bike if you're sober. Tell that to the thousands of rural Australians who operate commercial mustering operations every year with trail bikes and quads, and unregistered horses and have been doing so for decades. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDQDI Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 Tell that to the thousands of rural Australians who operate commercial mustering operations every year with trail bikes and quads, and unregistered horses and have been doing so for decades. It's all well and good until someone gets hurt, then it all goes south. As sad as it is nothing is considered an accident these days and there is always someone to blame. Quadriplegic British woman Holly Raper awarded $12m in quad bike compensation case - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron5335 Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 but both games are hitting a little ball with a stick ah................ But the problems start when the hockey players want to play hockey on the golf course !!!! 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kasper Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 But the problems start when the hockey players want to play hockey on the golf course !!!! But a golf course is really just 9-18 grass runways isn't it? 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted November 3, 2016 Share Posted November 3, 2016 But a golf course is really just 9-18 grass runways isn't it? Not really a level playing field,,,but it,ll do ah.........lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted November 3, 2016 Share Posted November 3, 2016 But the problems start when the hockey players want to play hockey on the golf course !!!! Or vice verser,as the golfers start breaking windows at the stadium ah,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rick-p Posted November 3, 2016 Share Posted November 3, 2016 I can smell the Avgas it's that close. Anyone up for a bit of Level 1 training that will be recognized by CASA? Email your interest to [email protected] All good things come to those who are patient and of strong resolve. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhysmcc Posted November 3, 2016 Share Posted November 3, 2016 What is level 1 training (guess since I don't know maybe I need it)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kasper Posted November 3, 2016 Share Posted November 3, 2016 What is level 1 training (guess since I don't know maybe I need it)? L1 is effectively line maintainer and self maintenance for RAAus aircraft not used for hire and reward. All pilot certificate holders used to get it as part of their certificate way back when but current RAAus process is to separate it from the certificate issue and add it as an additional that requires online training. L2 is the next level and is the minimum required for an RAAus aircraft used for hire and reward - other than daily items like adding oil etc. L3 and L4 are higher levels and are bascially regional technical or home built inspectors - many of whom are also GA LAME certified. All of this is set out int eh RAAus tech manual but the above gives a flavour. From Rick-P post I assume that the ELAAA L1 training must be coming close to completion. As ELAAA have not yet started operating I take this as a hint that they are getting close to turning on the lights and operating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Posted November 3, 2016 Author Share Posted November 3, 2016 I have stripped the posts out of the original thread as it has gone so much off topic and created this new thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhysmcc Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 L1 is effectively line maintainer and self maintenance for RAAus aircraft not used for hire and reward. All pilot certificate holders used to get it as part of their certificate way back when but current RAAus process is to separate it from the certificate issue and add it as an additional that requires online training.L2 is the next level and is the minimum required for an RAAus aircraft used for hire and reward - other than daily items like adding oil etc. L3 and L4 are higher levels and are bascially regional technical or home built inspectors - many of whom are also GA LAME certified. All of this is set out int eh RAAus tech manual but the above gives a flavour. From Rick-P post I assume that the ELAAA L1 training must be coming close to completion. As ELAAA have not yet started operating I take this as a hint that they are getting close to turning on the lights and operating. Yes I'm aware of L1-4 in the RA-AUS sense, but surely that has nothing to do with ELAAA and CASA? Thought it must have been something else. Can't really talk more as I'm not an ELAAA member and it's now banned to comment if your not a member Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDQDI Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 Wait till Bull finds his posts in a thread called Pseudo GA 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billwoodmason Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 I've been wondering if anyone knows wether current L1 maintainers ie those who were given the right to maintain their aircraft when they received their pilot certificate are going to have to do a course to be able to continue to do maintain their aircraft or are they now deemed incompetent until upskilled. Surely those who have maintained their aircraft for years will be exempted from this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frank marriott Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 No Bill, The information I received was that your L1 will expire if you don't do the on new line exam. This is after I completed a (a). face to face L1 course (cost $100) run by RAA (b) first on line exam ©. Manufacturers engine maintenance course (d) Been maintaining my LSA for 8 yrs. This was all pointed out to Banfield and the board but a waste of effort. So I just did the L1 exam AGAIN which will cover me until the next brain fart. I have given up with this admins approach to people. Just shut up and pay your money. Until enough people get annoyed enough to do something about them I just pay my money and go flying and treat them like another CASA (with the same amount of respect) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kasper Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 I've been wondering if anyone knows wether current L1 maintainers ie those who were given the right to maintain their aircraft when they received their pilot certificate are going to have to do a course to be able to continue to do maintain their aircraft or are they now deemed incompetent until upskilled. Surely those who have maintained their aircraft for years will be exempted from this. clear as mud - from the current Tech Manual: "SECTION 11.1 MAINTENANCE POLICY Under a grandfather clause all members who are maintaining their own RAAus registered aircraft have until 01/02/2017 to complete the L1 maintenance authority assessment. After 01/02/2017 members who have not completed the L1 assessment cannot continue to sign for maintenance performed on their own aircraft. (Does not apply for members completing line maintenance only)" So basically you are going GA if you do not do the online test - you can do line maintenance with your pilot certificate but do not lift a spanner to change spark plus for do anything else ... Oh and I suggest that you do not read further through the sections of the Tech Manual following that if you are liable to fits of rage or high blood pressure ... it starts calling out CASA Schedule 5 maintenance schedules for all aircraft without a specific maintenance schedule - and that would be applied to all the old 95.10s out there as well. Maybe there is a small market for someone like me with old school rag and tube to set up a consultancy writing all the required documents for RAAus registered aircraft to AVOID all the GA crap that's coming down the pipeline ... after all if you HAVE an airframe specific schedule you do not have to use the sledge hammer overkill RAAus have as their default position ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frank marriott Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 Maybe there is a small market for someone like me with old school rag and tube to set up a consultancy writing all the required documents for RAAus registered aircraft to AVOID all the GA crap that's coming down the pipeline ... after all if you HAVE an airframe specific schedule you do not have to use the sledge hammer overkill RAAus have as their default position ... Not a chance Kasper - there is a clear GA mindset with Monk & Banfield and nothing can be changed - trust me I tried my best and only received insults (whilst a board member). Very sad but they still have their supporters, yet anyway. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happyflyer Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 clear as mud - from the current Tech Manual:"SECTION 11.1 MAINTENANCE POLICY Under a grandfather clause all members who are maintaining their own RAAus registered aircraft have until 01/02/2017 to complete the L1 maintenance authority assessment. After 01/02/2017 members who have not completed the L1 assessment cannot continue to sign for maintenance performed on their own aircraft. (Does not apply for members completing line maintenance only)" So basically you are going GA if you do not do the online test - you can do line maintenance with your pilot certificate but do not lift a spanner to change spark plus for do anything else ... Oh and I suggest that you do not read further through the sections of the Tech Manual following that if you are liable to fits of rage or high blood pressure ... it starts calling out CASA Schedule 5 maintenance schedules for all aircraft without a specific maintenance schedule - and that would be applied to all the old 95.10s out there as well. Maybe there is a small market for someone like me with old school rag and tube to set up a consultancy writing all the required documents for RAAus registered aircraft to AVOID all the GA crap that's coming down the pipeline ... after all if you HAVE an airframe specific schedule you do not have to use the sledge hammer overkill RAAus have as their default position ... Just so you don't give the wrong impression about line maintenance, the facts are that you can indeed lift a spanner to change your spark plug. List of line maintenance items from the tech manual shown below (Section 12.7). • Removal or installation of landing gear tyres • Repair of pneumatic tubes of landing gear tyres • Servicing of landing gear wheel bearings • Replacement of defective safety wiring or split pins • Replacement of side windows • Replacement of seats • Repairs to upholstery or decorative furnishings inside the cockpit • Replacement of seat belts or harnesses • Replacement or repair of signs and markings • Replacement of bulbs, reflectors, glasses, lenses and lights • Replacement, cleaning, or setting gaps of, spark plugs • Replacement of batteries • Changing oil filters or air filters • Changing or replenishing engine oil or fuel • Lubrication of components • Replenishment of hydraulic fluid • Application of preservative or protective materials • Removal or replacement of glider tow hooks • Carrying out a duplicate inspection of a flight control system that has been assembled, adjusted, repaired, modified or replaced • Carrying out a daily inspection on an aircraft You can do any of the above tasks without doing the L1 online course. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Page Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 Not a chance Kasper - there is a clear GA mindset with Monk & Banfield and nothing can be changed - trust me I tried my best and only received insults (whilst a board member). Very sad but they still have their supporters, yet anyway. Hello Frank, They must think the average RAAus member is stupid to try to put that stuff down our necks. Still boggles my mind how something can effectively be taught in from of a computer screen. I will go along with, academic endeavours may be - however subjects which need manual demonstrations I am no for that one. Regarding the L1 course there are people who need to ask questions to verify their though process it is those people who need help in certain areas so they will not fall through the cracks. As it is structured the learning outcome will not be good. KP 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billwoodmason Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 Can one of you learned gentlemen or ladies enlighten me as to where the term "Line maintenance" come from, and what does it mean as opposed other maintenance?. I fear for the reputations of Monck and Linke. They are going to be remembered for screwing up a good thing that had a "point of difference" from our GA brethren. All these GA flying Raa board members are blinkered into thinking the GA route is the right way and have failed to keep CASA at bay on behalf of the membership. The failures keep stacking up. They need to be reminded that RAA is about affordable flying with minimum regulation - is anyone listening?. Wake up before it's too late!. 1 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts