Flare assist

[Bruce Tuncks]

Yep, I am now flying a J230. I like it and it is easier to land than the SK was. I would still like to try an audio flare aid.

Here's a coincidence....  in the latest "sport pilot" mag there is a story about lidars ( laser range finders) being used for flare assist tools.

I really would like to hear from somebody who has used one in practice.

Nev, how did they know when to flare those big airliners? I reckon you were so high in the cockpit that judging when the wheels were a couple of feet off the ground would have been real hard.

[turboplanner]

1 hour ago, Bruce Tuncks said:

Yep, I am now flying a J230. I like it and it is easier to land than the SK was. I would still like to try an audio flare aid.

 

 I found the J170 wing very different to the J160, but if your J230 is easier to land, you didn't have the same problem as me. I spent the time learning to cope with a pre AD model in gusting crosswinds where I had to keep it flatter than normal, with the nosewheel about 150 mm off when the mains touched and do it again and again, so a good flare can be learned.

 

You can buy a radar kit online - a packet or 6 sensors and the beeper. It's set for the bumper almost touching the brick wall (for tight parking spots) The sensor distances apart triangulate the object if you install them at the correct distances.

 

You don't want to drag a bumper on the ground of course, or mount the array at tyre footprint level, so you may be able to calculate triangles on the centreline of the underside of the fuse which give you the progressive beeps with the continuous beep equivalent to wheel height.                                                                                              I've fitted cameras to the front and rear of the ute, and it's possible to reverse on to a drawbar and drop the pins in the holes, but all the time you're using your camera to make the judgements there's no time for any looking out the window, so I wouldn't fit a camera system to an aircraft for something that required major concentration at the same time. I know some people have said you could take a quick look, but I've done that and you don't get a quick enough look at the screen and you also dropped your concentration outside.             

[turboplanner]

2 hours ago, Bruce Tuncks said:

I would still like to try an audio flare aid.

 

However, think about how you would react if from your experience you were in a normal flare and the beeping started a metre and a half higher than you expected. There would be a temptation to land longer or go round; there would be a few cases where your coordination might be thrown off.

I've always liked to land short, and no doubt my instructor, a sadist noticed this because one day he pulled an EFATO on me when we were 2/3 down a very short runway. I had to climb at idle throttle to clear a roadway, then bank about 20 degrees for my selected paddock, and smug, I said to him "full throttle?" and he said no, so I was back to gliding and about two feet off the ground. On and on we went with me holding back stick and I swear we were leaving grooves in the tops of the cow pats for about a hundred metres, but no wheels touching the ground and he finally said "Full power" No doubt he kenw all the action points from doing the exercise with countless students, but it did teach me that we can make use of the flying ability of the aircraft from well past our normal flare if we want to.

[onetrack]

The Missus' 2011 Camry Atara has proximity warning beepers for reversing, and I can tell you they are bloody effective and loud! They also work at the sides of the car, at the rear.

But rain can bugger them up, I get the impression trickles of water off the car, set them off. But they work on even little bushy plants at the rear of the car. A reversing camera with a red line in it, also assists.

[Old Koreelah]

Altho modern reversing radar seems reliable, why not consider a thin, flexible probe?

Soviet/Russian space capsules use such a device to trigger the retro blast that slows the last couple of metres of descent.

Like most of their stuff, it’s simple, cheap and dependable.

[turboplanner]

9 hours ago, Old Koreelah said:

Altho modern reversing radar seems reliable, why not consider a thin, flexible probe?

Soviet/Russian space capsules use such a device to trigger the retro blast that slows the last couple of metres of descent.

Like most of their stuff, it’s simple, cheap and dependable.

You could use a hinge mounted on the spat trailing a short length of fishing rod on the end and fit a microswitch to the hinge set for whatever you wanted - 50 mm, 100, 200 etc. but since you would start to rely on them you'd have to use two, so you could land on either wheel in a crosswind, and keep replacing the worn fishing rod or use a damped steel rod, and there's still be rough paddocks and wind gusts which would catch you out.

 

I suspect that huge wing on such a tiny aircraft which picks up lift from the slightest gust which can come from any direction, then dump might be giving you that unease because the aircraft can be right on the grade one second and moving up, down or sideways in the next.

 

On the other hand, a Cessna 172 has a lot of extra weight to resist the slight buffeting so you can learn to land with a smoothness where the passenger doesn't know you've landed, and you can repeat that regularly.

[facthunter]

It seems my reply to Bruce has Gone "somewhere". The short answer is yes the Crew are quite high up and well Forward of the wheels so you "adjust" to the "new view" or you won't be popular or happy with yourself. The radio altimeter is used also for about the last 20 feet.but you still do it by judgement essentially like any other. BIG stuff has lots of inertia and it doesn't change what it's doing quite as quickly as a low wing loaded U/L  that doesn't come out in 60+ knot winds either.  Little planes are far more "twitchy". Nev